Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
(OP)
Hi Everyone,
This is normally something I would run by my mentor first, but I am kind of curious what your experience is.
I am doing structural for a building where a senior in our shop is the EoR. The client has contracted a roof truss supplier to do design & mfcr of roof trusses. We sign & stamp on the roof layouts as they don't have a senior engineer in shop. When I was peeling through their layouts and shop drawings I had noticed that they did not do a drift load where two different height roofs met. I checked code req's (Canadian NBC 2010) to see what was needed, and drift was required.
Now, I have talked to the roof truss supplier, and they are asking that I provide the load distribution as their software will not come up with an automatic drift load case (They don't know how to do the calculation manually...)
Is this common? I have no problem providing them the loading but something just seems off with these guys just punching numbers into a program without understanding something directly related to their trade.
This is normally something I would run by my mentor first, but I am kind of curious what your experience is.
I am doing structural for a building where a senior in our shop is the EoR. The client has contracted a roof truss supplier to do design & mfcr of roof trusses. We sign & stamp on the roof layouts as they don't have a senior engineer in shop. When I was peeling through their layouts and shop drawings I had noticed that they did not do a drift load where two different height roofs met. I checked code req's (Canadian NBC 2010) to see what was needed, and drift was required.
Now, I have talked to the roof truss supplier, and they are asking that I provide the load distribution as their software will not come up with an automatic drift load case (They don't know how to do the calculation manually...)
Is this common? I have no problem providing them the loading but something just seems off with these guys just punching numbers into a program without understanding something directly related to their trade.






RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Garth Dreger PE - AZ Phoenix area
As EOR's we should take the responsibility to design our structures to support the components we allow in our design per that industry standards.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
I talked to mentor as well, he said pretty much the same thing as you did Woodman. Bill the client an extra hour for consulting services (cost plus), but doesn't make me respect the truss guys any more.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Show this to your builders who think heating & hoarding is a money pit.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Garth Dreger PE - AZ Phoenix area
As EOR's we should take the responsibility to design our structures to support the components we allow in our design per that industry standards.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
There's your problem.
Actually, some of the specifics vary. In some jurisdictions, the rules recognize that you can delegate engineering, and in those cases, whoever it is delegated to, would seal that part of it. You might check into your jurisdiction's rules to see what the specifics are, also if this supplier is licensed to perform engineering in the first place (if that is required), check to make sure your client is paying them for the design (and not just manufacturing), and raise a flag if it isn't getting done. I see situations where Entity A assumes Entity B is responsible for a certain aspect of design, and Entity B assumes Entity A is handling that part of it, and it just doesn't get done. And it sounds like your case is not far from that. You can put notes on the drawings limiting your scope, but I find in real life, they tend to be ignored by pretty much everyone, so that might limit liability in a lawsuit, but doesn't resolve the issue, either.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
Also, I am not sure if I am reading correctly, but I interrupted you stating your firm was sealing the truss drawings completed by the truss supplier. I would never do this as they have their own internal software to design that I doubt they shared with you nor would you have time to learn if they did. It appeared you reviewed something similar to shop drawings including loads, but how are you verifying member sectional?
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
That is one thing that NEVER gets installed properly (if at all). If it is required, I typically require the webs be sistered rather than by adding horizontal braces. Much easier for them not to screw that up.
RE: Common practice for EORs duties over sub-disciplines
We are currently organizing a program about this for my local SEA chapter, since delineation of responsibility is one of the biggest problems on jobs where the EOR only does part of the job.