Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
(OP)
Dear community members,
I am trying to adapt the existing model organization approach from HyperMesh to the FEMAP environment, and I would be glad to hear your feedback and suggestions.
1. General organization. According to the existing model organization approach, model entities (nodes, elements, properties, materials) for each part (CHEXA, CQUAD etc.) and each interface (CBUSH, RBE2 etc.) are allocated in separate layers. I came across many discussions “groups vs layers”. Presented approach simply reflects already existing methodology based on components.
2. Numbering convention. Model numbering (nodes, elements, properties, materials) shall start with part layers and continue with interface layers. Starting ID is defined by the layer ID. E.g. for the layer ID 10,001 each entity is renumbered starting from 10,001. It allows keeping numbering ranges for particular objects/parts in the assembly.
3. Model summary. It is often required to generate model summaries, e.g. materials, properties, elements per layers etc.
Currently 2) and 3) are implemented via HyperWorks API, but I assume corresponding tools may already exist for FEMAP. However, I could not find anything similar yet, so your help is much appreciated.
Questions:
I am trying to adapt the existing model organization approach from HyperMesh to the FEMAP environment, and I would be glad to hear your feedback and suggestions.
1. General organization. According to the existing model organization approach, model entities (nodes, elements, properties, materials) for each part (CHEXA, CQUAD etc.) and each interface (CBUSH, RBE2 etc.) are allocated in separate layers. I came across many discussions “groups vs layers”. Presented approach simply reflects already existing methodology based on components.
2. Numbering convention. Model numbering (nodes, elements, properties, materials) shall start with part layers and continue with interface layers. Starting ID is defined by the layer ID. E.g. for the layer ID 10,001 each entity is renumbered starting from 10,001. It allows keeping numbering ranges for particular objects/parts in the assembly.
3. Model summary. It is often required to generate model summaries, e.g. materials, properties, elements per layers etc.
Currently 2) and 3) are implemented via HyperWorks API, but I assume corresponding tools may already exist for FEMAP. However, I could not find anything similar yet, so your help is much appreciated.
Questions:
- Considering flat layer hierarchy in FEMAP (no sub-layers or sub-assemblies are allowed) presented approach does not scale for the models with large number of parts/interfaces – list of layers becomes too large and difficult to deal with. Is there any way to solve this limitation? Groups do the work just partially, since their representation in the model tree is anyway flat.
- Are there any API collections available for FEMAP besides FEMAP knowledge base?
- What is your favorite model organization technique when using FEMAP?





RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
By assemblies I meant a set of components grouped together in FEMAP itself. Typical example is a model with more than thousand parts which can be represented as physical models or super-elements, e.g. complete assembly of a car, spacecraft or a ship. Flat hierarchy is obviously not sufficient for such models.
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
if FeMap is inadequate for your needs, do you have experience with another pre-/post-processor that does what you want ?
i know airplanes (surely large structures) are modelled with NASTRAN superelements, and PATRAN (as "awful" as it is) is used as the pre-/post-processor.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Super-elements is not an issue in fact: plotel elements are imported into the Preprocessor and matrix (*.pch, *.op4) and assembly (*.asm) files are called as includes during the analysis.
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
not sure what the numbers beside the coloured boxes mean ?
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
I think FeMap can handle superelements, possibly not as seamlessly as HyperMesh, and if this is critical for your designs, then you've got your answer ... stick with HyperMesh, and leave FeMap alone.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Anyway, thanks for the feedback. Can you recommend something regarding the API?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Well, next release of FEMAP V11.2 due for end of this year (or January 2015) will feature an insteresting capability: sub-levels. This was a query for all of us VARs and resellers of FEMAP in Europe, to support sublevels to include results, geometry, etc.. hopefully this will increasy the easy-of-use and powerfull of the FEMAP graphic user interface, to run geometry & mesh like a CAD system, we will know the details in a few months!!. I am sure the phylosophy sub-levels will expand to all areas of FEMAP.
In current version 11.1.2 we have flat-layers, flat-geometry, flat-properties, flat-groups, etc.. but if you leran to use LAYERS you will relize how powerful is to organize complex models, this is the way I run: during preprocessing both geometry & mesh is organized in layers, easy to create, manage, and hide/display!!. During postprocessing results the use groups is really powerfull, you have a full menu in FEMAP named GROUP to create the groups you like. I love to click in the MODEL INFO TREE on top of PROPERTIES and select GROUP, automatically will create a group for each property.
Best regards,
Blas.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Blas Molero Hidalgo
Ingeniero Industrial
Director
IBERISA
48004 BILBAO (SPAIN)
WEB: http://www.iberisa.com
Blog de FEMAP & NX Nastran: http://iberisa.wordpress.com/
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
I also use Layers as the basis for the model organization in FEMAP. It is indeed the most intuitive way.
By the way could you recommend any existing solutions for the model renumbering based on Layer' information (e.g. layer ID)?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Node & Element renumbering is not an issue for me, it dosen´t matter the Node#ID of Element#ID number the model has, this is part of the past, now you can select elements in any moment by property, by layer, by material, etc... then not need to have control of numbering. But if you like to renumbver anything you can do it, use command MODIFY > RENUMBER and you are done!.
Best regards,
Blas.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Blas Molero Hidalgo
Ingeniero Industrial
Director
IBERISA
48004 BILBAO (SPAIN)
WEB: http://www.iberisa.com
Blog de FEMAP & NX Nastran: http://iberisa.wordpress.com/
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
i thought you were looking to reuse a component (use the same model in different places) ?
personally i hate layers, but like groups.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
A trick you can use is to enter a OFFSET value to both node & element numbering, do not accept the "default" suggested by FEMAP.
Yes, you can renumber whatever you like, but if you are ordered you can mesh the model following your rules. In FEMAP you can mesh geometry any time you like, not need to do it at the beginneing or at then end, then why not to make your rules. For instance, if you want to have a range of numbering for such type of elements, then before meshing enter a value for Node#ID and Element#ID, in this case FEMAP will use that number to start asigning numbers to mesh and elements.
In the figure I used OFFSET=1000, then if I list nodes I will see the following: the first node#ID is 1000, as well as first Element#ID 1000
CODE -->
List Nodes 492 Node(s) Selected... ID Def CS Out CS X1 X2 X3 Color PermBC> Layer SEID #Elem #Load #BC __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ 1000 0 0 0. 0. 40. 124 ------ 1 0 2 0 0 1001 0 0 2.35559 0. 40.0463 124 ------ 1 0 4 0 0 1002 0 0 4.70755 0. 40.185 124 ------ 1 0 4 0 0 1003 0 0 7.05224 0. 40.4159 124 ------ 1 0 4 0 0Best regards,
Blas.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Blas Molero Hidalgo
Ingeniero Industrial
Director
IBERISA
48004 BILBAO (SPAIN)
WEB: http://www.iberisa.com
Blog de FEMAP & NX Nastran: http://iberisa.wordpress.com/
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
This automatic renumbering is usually helpful, when performing import of other models while having significant gaps in the numbering ranges of the main FE model.
Have you seen similar algorithms/scripts for the FEMAP?
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Another trick for you: take a look to command FILE > MERGE.
This command allows geometric or finite element entities from any model currently open in the same instance of FEMAP to be “merged” with the active model. Then you can renumber AUTOMATICALLY any part of your current model. At least two models must be open for this command to be available. To facilitate bringing entities into the active model, a number of overall Renumbering and Duplicates Strategy, Entity Selection, and Model Orientation options are available in the Model Merge Manager dialog box. In addition, the top portion of the dialog box, the Entities to Merge list can be used to choose which entity types to merge into the active model using the check marks in the Entity Type column. Here you are a tutorial:
http://community.plm.automation.siemens.com/siemen...
Best regards,
Blas.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Blas Molero Hidalgo
Ingeniero Industrial
Director
IBERISA
48004 BILBAO (SPAIN)
WEB: http://www.iberisa.com
Blog de FEMAP & NX Nastran: http://iberisa.wordpress.com/
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
There is just one question left from the original list: are there any API collections available for FEMAP besides FEMAP knowledge base? Sorry for bombarding you with so many questions. Your help is much appreciated.
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
I was following this thread since its start. I work for space industry and I know exactly what ANick is encountering regarding the FEM renumbering.
When we have a requirement from the customer, it should be respected...
Most FE models I made for space domain were large. When creating the mesh I number simultaneously the entities and when a part of the model needs to be updated later it will not cause a problem regarding the renumbering as it is already in a group / layer.
But the problem is when your entire model was randomly numbered and then you receive a requirement with numbering ranges (sub-systems models and IF nodes / elements...)
So I decided to accelerate things by automating them using API. I've created an excel / Femap program which create groups based on numbering ranges (Start ID / End ID)for elements, nodes and RBE received from the customer in an excel format. copy / paste and I am done.
And after reading this thread I have made a macro (yesterday) which renumber checked entities based on its Group IDs and not layer IDs as you asked for.
1/ First select the groups to be used to extract their entities (elements, nodes, prop, material, csys)
2/ check the entities you want to renumber based on their group ID
3/ That's all nothing else to do :)
You can also look at Group / Operations / Booleans which allow a lot of options.
I tested the macro on a small model with ten groups and it works.
I will look at the possibility of renumbering entities based on layerID.
Please use it and let me know if any issue appears.
Hopes this helps,
Regards.
Seif Eddine Naffoussi, Stress Engineer
www.Innovamech.com
33650 Martillac – France
RE: Model organization approach (layers and automated numbering)
Regards,
Seif Eddine Naffoussi, Stress Engineer
www.Innovamech.com
33650 Martillac – France