Engineering solution to post pulling
Engineering solution to post pulling
(OP)
Classic problem of fence post in concrete rotted out & snapped maybe 6-8" (150-200mm) below ground level so I'm guessing I've got over a foot (300mm) of post still in there.
The concrete is a continuous run along the length of the fence, not discrete foundations for each post, so options of digging out the entire concrete (which I've done before elsewhere when I was younger) or even just putting new posts in a few feet to either side are not very practical.
Likewise numerous of the tools/techniques/gadgets on the various DIY websites etc aren't very practical for this situation. Plus as most of the fence is still up, there's a tree nearby, we'are in town and it's dry I don't like the idea of trying to burn it out.
We're in the desert and there's been no real rain for months so the wood below grade is probably pretty dry & not swollen too much.
I'm hoping - probably in vain - that I can put a couple of eye bolts down in the top of it and pull it out with some 'rope' and a 6' steel pole levered on a 12" tall piece of wood. Sadly the biggest eye bolts I could find at the store had probably less than 2" of thread lengh so I suspect will pull out before moving the post.
I can probably find some larger lag bolts/screws at a different DIY place but I'm still concerned that with the wood being rotten I may not get much grip.
I can obviously try drilling away some of the wood near a couple of edges but with the Drill I have I'm not sure I'll get down far enough to make much difference.
So before I waste a lot of time or buy a much beefier drill than I'll usually need I'm open to suggestions for a more elegant engineering solution.
It's OK if the solution is a bit half baked, this is a sows ear silk purse situation as the entire fence is a bit sorry but I don't have the time/money to do that right now.
I appreciate any help, if this is too much in the "DIY" category feel free to can it forum admin. I plan on doing the work Friday morning (6/27/14) so suggestions before then are most appreciated.
The concrete is a continuous run along the length of the fence, not discrete foundations for each post, so options of digging out the entire concrete (which I've done before elsewhere when I was younger) or even just putting new posts in a few feet to either side are not very practical.
Likewise numerous of the tools/techniques/gadgets on the various DIY websites etc aren't very practical for this situation. Plus as most of the fence is still up, there's a tree nearby, we'are in town and it's dry I don't like the idea of trying to burn it out.
We're in the desert and there's been no real rain for months so the wood below grade is probably pretty dry & not swollen too much.
I'm hoping - probably in vain - that I can put a couple of eye bolts down in the top of it and pull it out with some 'rope' and a 6' steel pole levered on a 12" tall piece of wood. Sadly the biggest eye bolts I could find at the store had probably less than 2" of thread lengh so I suspect will pull out before moving the post.
I can probably find some larger lag bolts/screws at a different DIY place but I'm still concerned that with the wood being rotten I may not get much grip.
I can obviously try drilling away some of the wood near a couple of edges but with the Drill I have I'm not sure I'll get down far enough to make much difference.
So before I waste a lot of time or buy a much beefier drill than I'll usually need I'm open to suggestions for a more elegant engineering solution.
It's OK if the solution is a bit half baked, this is a sows ear silk purse situation as the entire fence is a bit sorry but I don't have the time/money to do that right now.
I appreciate any help, if this is too much in the "DIY" category feel free to can it forum admin. I plan on doing the work Friday morning (6/27/14) so suggestions before then are most appreciated.
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What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?





RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
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RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Once I get the wood out, I cement an oversized galvanized sleeve into the hole flush with the surface and plumb (if I want to use a 1-3/4 OD post, then I make the sleeve 1-7/8 ID). Then you can either just use a metal fence post strapped to the fence and slid into the sleeve, or (if the first option raises aesthetic issues) you can drill a hole in your new wooden fence post about the size of the ID of the sleeve and epoxy a metal stub into the post and slide the stub into the sleeve. That makes replacing the post the next time pretty trivial.
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
Law is the common force organized to act as an obstacle of injustice Frédéric Bastiat
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
If the wood is pretty dry then dropping some lit charcoal in the hole would take less effort and get rid of the wood over-night. You cannot get a flare-up in a hole.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
"When all else fails... C4."
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Yours
Bill
Bill
--------------------
"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Many good suggestions already. I personally would use an auger bit (ship-builder's bit as some call them- like the ones once used with brace and bit sets) on a powerful corded drill. Hog out the centre by boring as many holes as you can get purchase to drill, then use the 6' crowbar to pry the wood into the voids made by the holes. If you have the room to work, grout a post base into the hole left by the rotted post timber. This will get rid of the source of the problem which is the soil-wood contact.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Good luck,
Latexman
Technically, the glass is always full - 1/2 air and 1/2 water.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
If you have not already broken the post up in the hole. Find the longest lag screw you can at the local hardware store, at least 6" of screw thread and at least 1/2" dia., take a drill of tapping size for that screw and drill down just off center for the length of the screw.
Obtain and install an anchor ring obtainable at Grainger's and some hardware stores, search anchor rings. Then drill another hole at the ring spacing. install the lug screws with an extension bar on a ratchet wrench or a rotary impact wrench.
You now have an attachment that should take at least 2 to 3 tons of upward pull if the wood is not totally rotted out, If it is we do not need this conversation , scoop it out with a spoon.
Now you can go back to your 6'-0" steel bar, and block of wood, however I would suggest borrowing a hydraulic jack to lever up with instead of using Armstrong power. I have done this job myself using an engine hoist over the hole with the arm set at the 2 ton setting.
Good luck.
B.E.
You are judged not by what you know, but by what you can do.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
First job Friday is to clear all the junk out of the hole that fell into it when I removed the post. Second job is to do a more thorough job of assessing just how degraded the wood in the hole is and go from there. I did check out a couple of local tool rental places websites to get some idea of the cost of renting a beefier drill but they didn't make it easy so I'll give them a call Friday if my initial attempts don't work.
Kudos to Latexman for the most engineered solution (there is a tool that kind of does that for you but it relies on being pushed down in the soil next to the post or individual concrete footing so I don't think would work for me).
Right now if I had to bet my money would be on the 'beat it into little pieces' approach espoused by 77JQX, Zdas & others being what ends up getting it done but I'm gonna consider other options in more detail once I'm actually there.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Good luck,
Latexman
Technically, the glass is always full - 1/2 air and 1/2 water.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
If you use Latexman's method Use a Looong handled sledge and stay well back from the edge of the hole
B.E.
You are judged not by what you know, but by what you can do.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
If you can auger down into the wood, an M-88 can pull it out, and probably the rest of the strip footing too!
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
http://www.metpost.co.uk/mp_repair.html
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
A. I didn't see them at my local hardware store in desertville california (yes I probably could find them online somewhere).
B. The post broke quite deep down so would be challenging to 'flatten out' and may not have enough depth to take the tine.
C. I had a bit of trouble with the products I did use with them 'wandering' on occasion. I'd guess this product would be better as it aligns on the concrete but...
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Is there room to get a sawzall down into the hole?
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Fill the old hole with masonry plug of some variety and set a Simpson bracket of some other sort in a new, nearby hole.
http://www.strongtie.com/products/connectors/EPB44...
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
From Kens original post "The concrete is a continuous run along the length of the fence, not discrete foundations for each post,"
B.E.
You are judged not by what you know, but by what you can do.
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Screwed it in thinking it was spinning in rotten wood, pulled on the eye bolt to see if it would even hold before setting up a lever and it came out in my hand. Piece of cake!
Now for trying to get the new post in...
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Cheers
Greg Locock
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RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
Have one of these... https://www.google.com/search?q=hemp+beer&tbm=...
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
RE: Engineering solution to post pulling
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?