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Shop Made Car Stand

Shop Made Car Stand

Shop Made Car Stand

(OP)
I have attached a jpeg of the referenced subject matter. I am to suggest that a load limit be posted and is to be based on an analysis from a structural PE. There would be two other stands of different designs and one of them with worse conditions, for the structural PE to evaluate. So, would the structural engineer be willing to take on the task? Yes, after repairs are done; No regardless how well they were repaired would sufficient replies for me as I am trying to determine some consensus. I have my own thoughts on this matter, however, I'll reserve that for the moment so as not to prejudice the comments. I'll post a second photo on the next link.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

My main concern is not with the design of the structural elements, but with the vehicle being placed on the supports in such a way as to be prone to fall on someone under it.

Note: Would the design be to AISC or AASHTO?

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

With respect to the first one, it looks thought out to some degree, but I would still be worried about roll-over of the top wide flange beams, and lateral support of the rack that is transverse to the car body. I would also better secure the car body to the frame, at least with four come-alongs and some cable or chains around the axles.

As for the second, that, at best, is jerry-rigged, and should be scrapped itself. There is no design, little to no stability, but just adaptation of something that was available with no alterations, other than the already damaged members.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

As I look at these stands, any engineer would be crazy to even start a structural evaluation as to loading strength. Provisions for stability are not there, especially for second photo (from photo view), so providing a load capability number would be useless especially if the operation of placing the load is not defined. Weld info is missing also. From the appearance of the area, alone, the engineer is risking his reputation immediately on entering the site. Workmanship also is severely lacking. This is a case where it is best to walk away.

Was this posted on April 1????

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

(OP)
No! this was not posted on April 1.
As far as the positioning of the wrecks on the stands, I was not really concerned since the weight of the engines far offset the overhanging weights over the trunk area.
I will be recommending about scraping these car stands and have shop made ones based on a design from a structural PE whose additional responsility will be to inspect the works during fabrication.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

Sounds like a plan.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

particularly looking at the buckled members (in the 2nd pic) !

it may be callous but "caveat user".

you could bring your concerns to the owner (i'd anticipate a brief response).

would only employees be under the wrecks ? or general public (looking to buy a component, removing a component) ?
you could mention this to OSHA (suspect they're busy running down "real" issues)

otherwise, wait for the ambulances and the lawyers to gather (suspect there won't be much in the way of "lawyering" ... the yard mgmt/ownership will probably just disappear, i doubt they'd declare bankruptcy).

Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

I agree with your thoughts. There is no way in hell any structural engineer that I know that would even think of certifying those or even investigating repairs. (at least personally, as there are rumours of some that would have no problem approving them)

Scrap them and get new ones built to spec.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

remaking new stands is obviously the best way to go, but also the most expensive.

could you refurbish the obvious bad pieces, add some braces to the deep webs, and test the rigs ?

i guess you wouldn't dye penetrant inspect the welds ? maybe just brush the scale off and have a look ?

Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

Chico:

I'd throw in a significant factor of safety, to allow for abuse, over loading, etc. I assume these are loaded with some form of fork lift or loader with forks that may cause significant rack damage in the process of loading. Who knows what all might happen down the road. They even may try to set a big truck up there, or make them the base for a yard crane system. The general idea is open to abuse, such as the car falling off due to stupid operation of the loading equipment.

I'd look for some reject oil field pipe, as we use for foundation piling, and make it hell for stout. The client seems good at finding salvaged steel. No PE seal or designer ID should be found on site later with that gang.

It still is such a situation that law suits down the road may happen and walking away now would be best for your future reputation and livelihood. Miss use is likely.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

The most expensive outcome is having a homebrew stand fall on someone.

The next most expensive outcome _should_be_ getting caught with crap like that and being fined by OSHA or similar. I haven't seen that work as a deterrent, but YMMV.

The auto enthusiast magazines carry advertising for two-post and four-post lifts, all of which are cheaper than a custom design for a fixed stand from a PE should be. Most of them look reasonably sturdy, and as a bonus here, can raise and lower the wreck for better ergonomic access to various parts. Most of them should require site prep like a modest slab.

Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

Chicopee:
That’s a junk yard and those stands are junk and should be treated as such. This just goes to show you, that anyone can do anything, as long as they set their small minds and expertise (in their small mind) to the task. The one proviso should be that it only fall on them. Maybe they would learn something then. Unfortunately, other people could be hurt too. Any real engineer who would try to make something out of those should have his head examined.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

recommend these guys be nominated for potential Darwin awards

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

For what you would have to charge to design and fix and for them to implement a fix, they could just buy a proper hydraulic lift.
I have one in my garage that I paid $2300 for used and will hold 7000lbs.
I would run away from this very quickly.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

You can't fix STUPID. But the guy that did those may not be around much longer.

Richard A. Cornelius, P.E.
WWW.amlinereast.com

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

I just remembered the fix. It is four 55 gal drums set on end. One for each wheel. If not high enough use two at each wheel. Was invented by a junk yard back when the barrels first became popular. We should however go easy on the junk yards. These days there is where the money is.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

(OP)
These stands could be refurbished, however, the cost of the repairs would probably be as much as the cost of newly fabricated stands. Here is a link about a fatality involving a shop made gantry having no certification on the design: www.lni.wa.gov/Safety/Research/Face/Files/SalvageY... FATALITY INVESTIGATION REPORT.

RE: Shop Made Car Stand

There's a big difference in abuse loads between a drive on drive off garage hoist, and one where the car is plonked down on the car stand by a crane, with possibly a magnet instead of a hook.

The first one looks like it is fixable, by eye the I beams need some web stiffeners. Since people are working under it it should be physically tested to 4 times the maximum lifting capacity of the crane that loads it in both compression and tension, and you should also consider lateral loads.

The second is just scrap metal waiting to fall over.

Cheers

Greg Locock


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