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What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?
5

What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
I just asked this question to one of the new employees.. and they didn't know the answer.

Am I crazy? or if you graduated from college with a civil engineering degree wouldn't you at least know this?

Just wondering if I am expecting too much here... wow.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I only vaguely know and probably wouldn't actually apply it without double checking part nine of the NBCC. I honestly just don't do light framing work except on very rare occasions.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Sorry, I hate to tell you, that doesn't surprise me at all. In fact, I'd be more surprised if he did know the answer. They don't teach much of that type of thing in colleges; they concentrate more on theory and political indoctrination, not practical applications.

The only reason I knew it was because I worked as a construction laborer in the summer between school. It was the best thing I could have done though at the time I thought I was missing out since many of my classmates had high profile internships in air conditioned offices. But, if the internships weren't either in structural design or working directly for a construction company they probably didn't learn that type of thing there either. And "construction management", wherein they served as an owner's representative might not expose them to that either.

My $.02 worth.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

For clarity, my post above was in response to the original question.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
Thanks Archie. I guess I was also very handy as a teenager because I knew this much about buildings by that time.

Thanks for the perspective.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Agreed, they don't teach it. Its easy too look up, why bother wasting part of your curriculum on it I guess..

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Standard dimension in Canada is 16 inches center to center for 2 by 4 inch(actually 1.5x3.5inch) wood studs.
If 2x6 (actually 1.5x5.5 inches) studs are used then the center to center distance is 24 inches.

Don't know for steel studs but probably the same so they can be substituted 1:1.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Fresh into the structural workforce in 1978 (I volunteered), even after spending 6 years working for a public utility part time during school, and four years in the Army COE, I had no idea what a shear wall was. The common stud spacing I picked up outside of school at 10 watching a carpenter do remodels in our old house. The stud spacing was never mentioned in college, or was the shear wall.

So... I am not surprised either, unfortunately.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
I didn't learn it in school either.. I learned it real life.. Just surprised that if you wanted to study engineering as a profession that one didn't have a more natural apt to understand building construction even before going to school.
I wanted to know how everything worked including cars and computers at a very young age. In my opinion, if you don't have that natural thirst for how things work .... it is doubtful you'll be a successful engineer.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I agree with you to a point... and yes I've known since I was probably 10 as well, but if I didn't have my father who taught me the spacing I probably wouldn't have known either. Stud spacing just isn't one of those things that I would have had a thirst for knowledge on, unless I had a reason. Personally I was more into how cars and computers worked when I was younger.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

When I was younger, no one knew what a computer was. Oh yea that's because they were not invented yet.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I learned that outside of school as well while working as a laborer framing houses (for my father AKA slave driver). I have never even had a wood class in undergrad or graduate school. Everything I know about wood has been self taught over many years.

When I was interviewing for my first gig I was shown a set of drawings and asked what the solid triangle was on the end of a beam... I had no idea. Dindn't get the job. Now I do work with the same company as a consultant (cleaning up their messes) ironic I guess.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

When I worked for a "third-party inspection" firm, we hired an architect with a Master's degree in Architecture. He did not know what drywall was, nor which pipes were the water supply lines (which were copper).

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

It amazes me at times, just what the curriculum committees at universities think might be relevant.

For 5 years I taught in a university. I'm an engineer and I taught contractor (construction management) courses (I'm also a licensed general contractor). In each of those, I tried to introduce practicality and a relationship to the "real world", with the necessity of academic/theoretical exposure. There is plenty of room in any curriculum for connecting to the working world from academia. Much of the reason for not doing so is that many of those in academia have NO experience! A travesty in my opinion.

To have a student graduate a program of civil engineering study and not understand some basics of construction is wrong. There is no excuse for this. Curriculum committees complain constantly that they must cover all the topics required by their respective accreditation programs (ABET, etc). True, but they cannot lose sight that the goal of any engineering, construction or architecture program is to produce graduates who can contribute in the commercial or public realm.

Our task as professionals is not to hire academic automatons who can recite theory, but to select those who can think! Those who are exposed to a variety of offerings spanning theory and practicality are better prepared to be productive from the start than those who are only exposed to theory.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Well,we took timber design in our junior year, but we actually made scale model houses in our freshman year besides learning structural drafting in our sophomore year. Young prospective engineers should look carefully at the curriculum of the college that they want to attend. Most four year civil engineering curriculum's have about two years of engineering and about two years of social issues. Maybe that's why ASCE is pushing for a fifth year.

I went to our local library and reviewed the curriculum's of various colleges and picked out one - knew nothing about the school - which basically only had 900 students at that time. Never even told my folks then, and never visited the college before I went away to the school.

Turned out to be one of the best moves I ever made (besides my wife).
Small class size, great professor (European trained), exposed to the then current structural engineering thinking - shells,(concrete and ferrocement), prestressed concrete, designing and detailing connections, Hardy Cross methods (with haunches) (system only about four years old then); glulam beams (curved as well, Vierendeel trusses - and hands on building structural projects (hyperbolc paraboloid 16 foot square out of 6" x 16 feet 1/4 inch strips in each direction - senior project).

Probably some fellows on this site have guessed that this the Architectural Engineering program at Cal Poly. This curriculum should be taught in many of the schools. And per the foregoing discussions, it isn't that this program is so good but that many of the civil engineering curriculum's are so bad.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I knew before college, but the wood design class I took went over it. They even went over the why things are spaced the way they are. I didn't even get any political indoctrination, but then that part is a myth anyway.

Of course I went to a university that is primarily for engineering.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

its a function of design, correct? the higher the wall, the closer the spacing needs to be. That should have been his or her answer. Oh yea, and usually its on a spacing of multiples into 4'-0", i.e. 8", 12", 16", 24".
Jim

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

dcarr,

Political indoctrination is a myth? You must have gone to college a very long time ago.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Archie,

My college days were not that long ago and i cannot say there was any political indoctrination. I would say there was far less indoctrination than the provided by any one-sided/one-party Talk Radio station or equivalent News Media (any side). I would say that if anything a subtle message was to questions everything and perform out own research before judging. I think for someone to state that college kids are brainwashed when them themselves have not attended the institution that they are blaming is quite telling of ones ideology.

As to the original post. I do not recall if i was taught the typical spacing as i already knew it from my father are exposure to houses. But i would judge the person who does not know that and wants to design structures. I wonder if they know what welding is or if it is just 0.928Dl?

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Eric, to state that you weren't affected might be telling or your ideology. Do you mean to suggest, for example, that none of your engineering classes were imbued with "green building" or "global warming" philosophies, taught as unquestionable truth? And that's just on the engineering side of the house. The humanities classes are rife with all sorts of grievance studies curricula. If your college was bereft of that then count yourself very fortunate and amongst a very small minority.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Archie, i did not mean the wording of "your ideology" as an insult, i actually hold your opinion rather high, esp. on this forum. so please do not take offence to what i said as that was not my intention.

My classes did not cover Green or LEED. we were taught to be economical with our designs, as i am sure you perform this daily as well. The global warming philosophy was taught in geology and climate courses. I would 100% agree that humanities are heavy on the liberal teaching side of things but that does not mean they are incorrect always. Some issues probably go over pushed and others swept under the rug. My college was in the hear of the Liberal-California and i would say that the Engr Side was not intent on cranking or tree loving human theorist.

Again, i hope what i previously stated does not result in any hard feelings. peace

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

@ EngineeringEric:

"I would judge the person who does not know that and wants to design structures." ???????

Maybe you would but I certainly wouldn't. Just because you want to have sex does not mean that you know everything about the subject, any more than you do engineering, whatever the discipline. To say otherwise is to wonder why you are going to school at all if you know it all. An interest in a subject dies not imply a knowledge of it, only a desire to learn. Heck, most college students do not know what they want to major in until their Junior year anyway.

Starting to stray here a little from the OP's topic though...

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

And someday i just put my foot in my mouth and clamp down!

I will elaborate so i do not come off a complete arrogant person. I know and understand that there is an infinite number of things i am unaware of and really learn too many things daily to count. I would be leery of somebody in the field not being aware of typical construction methodology, we all have things that we take for granted like which side of a nail to hit but most aspects are foreign to everybody at first. If i worked/met with someone who had no idea of stud spacing, (and i mean a range, i want an answer between 6" and 24"). I would still like to work with the person and mentor them as a colleague but i would look closely at first. I believe the fact that i would watch for a little while learning their background would be based on an early judgment and that is the origin of my quick comment.

I hope that explains my wording better and what i meant with my statements.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Eric,

Thanks for the kind words and likewise, I didn't mean any ill will and also I hold your opinions on this forum in high esteem. Perhaps I painted with too broad a brush so let me explain where I was coming from. A few years ago I was involved with a project that caused me to have interactions with a summer intern from a highly prestigious engineering school. He proved to be a net drain on the project because instead of wanting to deal with any of the technical issues he was fixated on the green building aspect of it. It left a bad taste in my mouth. If he was indicative of what that (again highly prestigious) program produced it made me think that future hires would come from community colleges where the day students who are footing their own bill would presumably not spend tuition money studying such stuff. Generalizations can cause problems, of course...

As to the original topic, I suppose there will always be a balance to be had between teaching theory and teaching practice and if I had to choose I'd rather error on the side of teaching theory...but to a point. And I think the current situation has gone a bit too far in that direction at the expense of the practical side.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Thank you Archie. And i had students in my class who were the same kid as your negative experience, in my opinion the student was that way and the school just gave them the terminology they spewed. As for the original post i can state that my school offered theory of elasticity, a more than years worth of FEM courses, concrete composition (not design), and many theory courses but only one wood/timber course which was cancelled after i took it and one undergrad steel design course. So yeah, there seems to be a negative sway towards practice going on.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
Thank you all for the opinions. I am really trying hard to give the person a shot. As I think we all deserve one.

In re-reading some of my posts I sound a bit harsh. I think I need to lighten up.

Engineer on!

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I learned that in timber design.

But ditto to all of the comments about not learning enough practical knowledge in university. Completely agree with Ron's summary of why in the US it is this way. A retired professor of Geotech that I work with says the same things- ABET handcuffs schools and dictates their curriculum.

It is not that there is not enough time in undergrad either, but too much time is spent in truly useless classes. And if you KNOW you want to do structural engineering, why not have a concentrated BS in Structural Engineering. Wasting time in transportation, water, and environmental classes kept me from taking more structural classes.

I think these classes were the ones I have really used in my practice, which I could have probably done in 3-4 years max instead of 5+.
Trig and basic geometry
Physics
Some basic chemistry
Construction materials
Statics
Dynamics
Soil Mechanics, Geotech
Strength of Materials
Structural Analysis
Steel, Concrete and Timber Design
Should have had a masonry design course- not offered, which is ridiculous if you are going to work in Florida.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Eric....obviously you were not aware that there is an anatomical predisposition for those who aspire to engineering....the mouth must be large enough to insert both feet. I wash my feet carefully...knowing where they'll be shortly! lol

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

One or two required undergrad classes for aspiring structural engineers taught by a practicing non PHD engineer would be great, geared specifically for structural engineers:
-basic construction terminology and techniques
-structural drawings 101 (never saw a set of REAL drawings in undergrad)
-construction admin (shop drawings, specs, RFIs, memos, field issues)
-working with and for architects, understanding their needs, desires, whims, and especially their drawings
-coordination with other disciplines- MEP, civil, geotech
-basics of contracts, business and liability

Ron, call up Univ. of Florida and get going on this!

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I was required to take some technical (but not engineering) electives - such as Meteorology, which was totally useless.

There was no wood design whatsoever.

The courses were OK for background theory and developing the brain by forcing us to understand differential equations, but never any practical real-world topics, and of course no real-world seismic design. Just a lot of higher math regarding dynamics and Eigenvalues, which I will never understand.

Fortunately, no politics.

Some of the silly humanities electives such as art appreciation were a comic relief, and I enjoyed them.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I saved all of my humanities until my senior year. My second semester senior year I one engineering class and four humanities electives. I ended up taking classes like the Art of Rock an Roll because I had to fill an elective. Had the humanities requirements not been required by ABET, I would have been able to fit an additional 2-3 engineering classes.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Getting back to the original question, any North American person that doesn't guess at least 16" or 24" would be suspect - even though never having wood design in University. Wood framing under construction is apparent everywhere, and I would expect every one to know that plywood/OSB and gypsum board comes in lengths of 8'.

Of course, a newbie engineer from other parts of the world would be thinking metric, and some countries don't use wood framing.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I don’t understand this whole OP and all the different responses. Alls I know.... is you place the stud near where the mare is and the rest takes care of itself. I saw this start to happen, one time, with the mare one side of a barbed wire fence and the stud on the other and you would be surprised at how animated the horse owners became. And, none of these people had taken any Structural Engineering courses either. But, I do believe they used a 2x4 to divert the stud’s attention. If only they had taken a couple more computer courses they could have done this whole thing with FEA.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

rofl3

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

My goodness and it's only Tuesday! censored

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

If you are talking about stud spacing, you are limiting yourself geographically and even more restricting yourself to a specific small method or construction.

For wood and similar compatible materials the major basic module is 4' for some strange reason. After that it is cut into 1/2, 1/3, 1/4, etc. increments getting down to 1/24 if you are myopic. - the rest of the world uses a different "ruler" that happens to be definitive and convertible as the scale changes.

For the U.S. standards, 24", 16", 12" and 8" are common. For the rest of the world, a meter is divided into easy conversions by dividing by 2, 4, 6, 8 or 10 and so on.

There are always areas like civil/surveying/layouts where everything is metric to begin with, but switches to foot/inch when setting grade stakes. Down one means down 1/8 inch or down .01 foot. Same for "give or take one" when plumbing/laying out since once you get to the point of splitting hairs, there is little real difference.

A stud is just a generic term for a local building material and the is always some forgiveness or tolerances. A steel stud in the U.S. is not the same as a metric steel stud if you really look at standards.

Dick

Engineer and international traveler interested in construction techniques, problems and proper design.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

A2...will do!

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

A2...will do!

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Bipolar?

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

In other countries that use Metric, is it possible to exactly fit a full sheet of "metric" plywood in a pickup truck? That I think is more important than anything else.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I also taught a US University graduate school course dealing with highway design and construction and had students from many different countries. Most had never been on a field trip and so we did many. All seemed to think getting a high grade was more important than getting some practical knowledge. All exams were open book and such that some answers were not in the book causing them great consternation having to go out and find other sources for their answers. So, it is not just in USA, but seems to be everywhere as to what is taught in undergrad colleges. One of my "helpers" with a civil domineering Master's degree and from a construction family business once asked me "what is a backhoe". Not a lie.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?


"In other countries that use Metric, is it possible to exactly fit a full sheet of "metric" plywood in a pickup truck? That I think is more important than anything else."

In metric countries we have metric pickups (utes!) smile

For form ply, it is commonplace to have sheets that are 1200x1800 - lighter and easier to handle than 4'x8' equivalents.

Oh yeah, and 2x4's and called 4x2's.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I did have a timber design class (elective) on my transcript and probably new 16" stud spacing before I took the class. However, no masonry class and I used part of my 1st pay check to by a book on Building Construction because I had never heard of items such as purlins, girts, lintels, etc. I did not want my new boss or my direct supervisor to know how ignorant I was. I had graduated with a B+ average and also taken 5 terms of graduate courses before starting work, and yet many things were not ever discussed.

gjc

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

We call light metal plate connected open web roof trusses as 2x4 trusses, and floor trusses as 4x2 trusses, implying the orientation of the 2x4 members, isn't that clever?

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

2 young engineers in my office did not know what a "lock" was and I used it in the context of waterways/canals.

One had a masters in Civil, of all things, water resources. Both very smart too.

Glad to hear everyone has the same complaints about the lack of practical knowledge in most engineering curricula. I just learned the plural of curriculum and I am almost 40!

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I never had exposure to timber framing as a kid and would not have known the answer when I graduated from college. My dad built a whole house by himself but probably didn't think I would be interested. I knew how to sew my own clothes though, and this ended up being some pretty valuable "construction" experience. Anyway, I learned the importance of maintining a basic module or 4'/8' after framing a complicated 2 way, unequal leg, hip roof. The framing was very complex, and in some places I just spaced the rafters equally, like I would do laying out rebar. I was so proud of myself for figuring out all the complicated angles. But what a major pain it was when it came to cutting up the 4'x8' plywood sheathing! It took 3x longer than it should have.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
On Monday the company owner let go the entry level engineer that prompted this thread. Really sad actually, it was his lack of practical experience that really hindered him.

He had little to no knowledge of timber design or any experience reading plans. He was even having a hard time converting a framing plan into a series of free body diagrams for each element in order to analyze individual beams. Anyway, my point being that the university system is broken in my opinion when it comes to being a practicing design engineer. If you don't at least get some sort of internship, you are really going to struggle with your first job.

I know I was personally on very thin ice at my first job, I fortunately pulled it off because I was so strong on computers and software. I am a UCLA graduate and they didn't teach squat about timber or reading plans either, just like this fellow.




RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I thought learning to read plans and think in 3-D was one of the steepest parts of the learning curve once I got out of school. Also, one of the things I enjoyed the most. I am glad I worked for a firm that had architecture and engineering under one roof, because I learned a TON about drawings and practical construction from the more seasoned architects.

But in regards to your entry level hire, it sounds like whoever hired this person did not properly evaluate this person's knowledge. If you didn't have a class in timber or an internship, how would you know much about it? Free body diagrams, however, is pretty basic and should be something you get pounded into your head in undergrad.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

>>>I know I was personally on very thin ice at my first job, I fortunately pulled it off because I was so strong on computers and software. I am a UCLA graduate and they didn't teach squat about timber or reading plans either, just like this fellow.<<<

TDI, other than the UCLA part that described my experience exactly. Neither my "old school" boss nor I thought I was going to last out the first week. Thankfully he needed my computer skills badly enough that he was willing to invest the time and energy required to mentor me. It seems to me that one simple (non-existent at my school) course entitled "Practical Design & Construction Practices" would have gone a long way to alleviate that. I was so thirsty for such knowledge that I would have gladly paid to take it on a non-credit basis. I felt very vulnerable and useless learning only theory with no practical background. My $.02 worth.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Growing up, we had 4 channels on TV. ABC, NBC, CBS and PBS. I watched almost everything on PBS. I think watching This old house, woodwrights shop, new Yankee workshop, hometime, and then all the cooking shows really make my life easier. I dont have to call a plumber, electrician, carpenter, wood woorker if I want to change something in my house. I know what spacing to set framing at.

Perhaps a semester of common sense is in order.

I also teach some at a local school. We teach firefighting. About 80% of the last class had never used a chainsaw, and they are not from the inner city.

Im not sure we are going to get better engineers out of school by having them in school more.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

(OP)
@ztenguy: Very true. This generation sits behind their devices all day. Many kids get little to no interaction of real life objects other than their fingers touching the digitizer.

Common sense and practical knowledge is getting to be very rare. Although I am sure old timers have been bashing the younger generations for quite a while now.

rednose


RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

zteng,

The counterpoint is that you're not going to learn it sitting in front of a tv either.

While what you write is true enough, the situation has now been set in place through several generational cycles at this point. Nowadays unless you grow up on a farm or something similar you tend to be rather far removed from such stuff and if you don't have a family member to teach you...well, you're not likely to be exposed to it. A simple course or seminar at school about how the theory they are teaching is practically applied would have been helpful to me. Further, it would have had the side effect of being helpful to the most of the professors in the school by reminding them that their research serves to support the design and construction industry, not the other way around.

(PS: Those chainsaws are dangerous and yes, I own and operate a nice one.)

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Might not learn how to put up a wall from being in front of a TV, but would know that the best spacing is 16" oc.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Ditto such a seminar in E-school.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

"Getting back to the original question, any North American person that doesn't guess at least 16" or 24" would be suspect - even though never having wood design in University. Wood framing under construction is apparent everywhere, and I would expect every one to know that plywood/OSB and gypsum board comes in lengths of 8'."

That's a bit harsh. I don't know that my kids have even registered seeing the framing in our old house, and the new house has no exposed framing anywhere outside of the attic. And unless they're prone to haunting and lurking in Home Depot, plywood sizes are probably completely unknown.

TTFN
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RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Further, some people transfer into civil engineering programs having first thought they would study something else. There's no reason to presume they would already know construction practices. It's like the old joke about the safety sign at a swimming pool:

DON'T GO IN THE WATER UNLESS YOU KNOW HOW TO SWIM

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

IRstuff,

I meant any North American engineer - not any person.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

I like to think of myself as a stud: we are few and far between.

RE: What is the typical stud spacing for wood or metal studs?

Quote (dvd)

I like to think of myself as a stud: we are few and far between.

..about 16" to 24"...

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