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NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface
30

NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I hope it will be like in solidworks and it will possible choose between ribbon interface and standard interface, i don´t like the ribbon interface too.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Unlike most other applications using a Windows-style 'ribbon' interface, the NX 9.0 implementation will be fully customizable. This customization can be accomplishable either using the normal interactive customization tools and saving the changes in a Role or by creating/editing the 'Ribbon Tab' and 'Ribbon Group' files, roughly equivalent to the old 'Menu' and 'Toolbar' files. In fact, if you've done extensive UI editing in pre-NX 9.0 versions of NX using 'Menu' (.men) and 'Toolbar' (.tbr) files, there will even be tools which will convert these into 'Ribbon Tab' (.rtb) and 'Ribbon Group' (.grb) files so that you can at least get a starting place based on your past file-based customizations.

Now I'm hoping that perhaps some of the people who have been involved in the beta testing of NX 9.0 or who has attended one of the Siemens PLM Connections meetings either here in the US or in Europe, will volunteer their views and opinions of what they've experienced or seen with respect to the new 'Ribbon' interface. I think it would be useful if some of the comments about the NX 9.0 'Ribbon' interface came from average users who've actually seen the inteface rather than either people like me, who's obviously biased, or from people who have not yet even seen NX 9.0 and therefore are commenting based only on their experience with other products.

But before anyone goes completely postal, there will be an option to run NX using the so-called 'classic' interface, at least for the next couple of NX releases. However, those days will be numbered since ALL future functionality will be designed for locating them in the product interface based on what would be best for a 'Ribbon-style' interface and NOT necessarily for a menu/toolbar style interface (and resources will NOT be wasted spending a lot of time trying to optimize BOTH interfaces as part of these future functionality projects). This means that over time the menu/toolbar interface will start to suffer from a sort of software 'arthritis' as less and less care will be taken to keep up with the mainline changes being made to the 'Ribbon' interface.

Anyway, we welcome your questions as well as you concerns, but we would like you to hold off on your final judgment until you've actually had a chance to use NX 9.0. And just so that we know the time frame that we're talking about here, NX 9.0 is planned to be released in about 90 days or so.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

First,
you can use Ribbon Interface or decide to stay in old style.
Siemens PLM hasn't removed nothing, only added.
Second,
I like very very very very very very very very very very very much this ribbon interface style.
I use NX9 every day and I'm very satisfied, better then the old interface.
In NX8.5 with advanced role, you can see 170 command.
With NX9 as standard interface, you can access to 320 command.
Before to judge, try it.

Thank you...

Using NX 8 and TC9.1

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

So pleased to hear this, I've felt for a long time that NX had outgrown it's UI - only Alias being worse in my experience.

No chance of a screenshot then? :)

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

eh, catia v5 is not all that good too.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Here is what NX 9.0 will look like. This is the out-of-the-box presentation for the Modeling 'Home' tab:

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

(OP)
It is good to hear that the ribbon interface is fully customizable and that there will be an option to run nx with the classic interface. If the ‘ribbon’ implementation is different and better than Solid Edge, than is it maybe not so bad at all. I’m looking forward to use nx9 over 90days.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I like Ribbon UI in general, but have mixed feeling about it in CAD software.

I used SolidWorks for a number of year and when they added the Ribbon UI, it was not too bad. You still have the "classic" top bar where some functions are always present regardless of which Ribbon tab you are on.

When I used Solid Edge, I find their implementation of Ribbon UI to be HORRIBLE. It was just not intuitive and did not "flow" for me even after 2 years. I curse it every time I need to switch between windows inside Solid Edge because the function to switch windows is under the first tab and the last tab (if my recollection is correct). So, if I am in some other tab and need to switch to another window, I have to go to the first tab first. It was extremely annoying.

Currently, I am using NX and I felt at home with the UI. But I have to say, SolidWork's UI is the best out of all three. Not sure what SolidWorks is like, now. The last version I used was 2010 but I suspect it hasn't changed much...it is a dying software thanks to Dassault.

Anyway, I think NX's UI team should study SolidWork's implementation of the Ribbon interface closely but they probably already did :)

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

While using the 'Ribbon' UI, NX 9.0 will also have a 'menu' style optional path to all of the functions based on the 'classic' menu scheme. We expect that existing users who migrate to using the Ribbon UI will still find this menu useful for accessing functions based on their experience with older versions of NX. However, totally new user will probably be more likely to use the full Ribbon, and it's various secondary 'galleries' to find the necessary funtions.

Here is what that 'menu' scheme looks like:



While this is what one of the NX 9.0 Ribbon's 'More' gallery will look like:



And remember, if you use any of these functions on a regular basis, you can use Customize to move them up onto the Ribbon itself where you can optionally show them as a large icon with text, a small icon with text or just a simple small icon without text. or as medium icons without text in an on-ribbon gallery:

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Note that there will also be a quick way (without even having to go into Customize) to copy frequently used items, either temporarily or permanently, to one of the so-called 'side-bars', which you could think of as a sprt of fixed toolbars (which can be toggled ON/OFF):



And these can be just as easily removed or moved to one of the other 'side-bars':



Also there will still be something that we used to call the 'Selection Bar' where you can place popular functions as well as what's called the 'Quick Access Bar' across the top of the NX window where we've also added a full-time direct access to the 'Command Finder' something that people have been asking for since we introduced this feature:

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Looks great! I am glad there is a Menu for accessing functions the classic way.

Just one question about the screenshots. On the very top, where filename is usually displayed, there is a button called "Window". Is it for switching between windows in NX? If it is, then I probably won't use the classical UI and stick with Ribbon UI...if we ever upgrade to NX 9.

Thanks for the screenshots!

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The 'Window' button that you see in the NX 9.0 image is the same 'Window' button that you have on the menu bar in the classic NX interface, it lets you switch the display from one open part in your session to another.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

As an old user of NX I have kept my Roles from version to version.

I too feared the Ribbon Bar.
I like it.
Lots more room as icons can be of different sizes.

I find I have to use command finder often but am using it less and less.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I've also used solid edge and hated their ribbon bar, hopefully NX will do it much better, but I may those to use the classic style

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Much better - glad to see there's still a full screen option too

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

HOw does this affect the full screen mode? Or does this toolbar stay the same?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

What's new for Advanced simulation Module ?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

How versatile are journals between major NX releases? We are currently running 7.5 and have some serious man hours put into some of our custom journals. Would there be any upgrades in the software between releases that would impede our journals from working in the newer NX's?

Denis Huskic
Data Prep NX7.5
Kettering University
Class of '17

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote (NeilMGW)


Much better - glad to see there's still a full screen option too

In addition to the 'Full Screen' option, which works pretty much as it does in current versions of NX, there is also a new 'Minimized' mode which retains the Resource Bar, the so-called 'Selection Bar', the 'Quick Access Bar' as well as the 'tabs'. You still get a larger working display since the 'Ribbon' is removed but it's easier to work with since it does NOT require any keyboard 'gestures' to access your functions since all you do is select a 'tab' which will temporarily force the display of the Ribbon, make you selection and when the dialog appears, the Ribbon is once more removed giving you almost as much display area at does the 'Full Screen' mode. I actually like it much better.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Sounds even better John, just one problem - it's 90 days away! smile

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote (dhusk09)


How versatile are journals between major NX releases? We are currently running 7.5 and have some serious man hours put into some of our custom journals. Would there be any upgrades in the software between releases that would impede our journals from working in the newer NX's?

Generally speaking, as long as the functions themselves which are being called by a Journal have not changed (and we we don't mean changes in the appearance or where something was found in the UI, but rather at the functional level itself) then the Journal should still run on the latest version of NX.

What is captured in a Journal, unlike with the older Macros, are the actual system-level calls for the functions being recorded. These are captured BELOW the User Interface level, meaning that even if we move a function from one menu to another or from one toolbar to another, or in the case of NX 9.0, we do away with the toolbars and menus altogether (at least when running in the Ribbon mode), this should have no impact whatsoever on the playing back of the Journal even if it's while running on a later version of NX. In fact, in NX 9.0 you could record a Journal in either the Ribbon or the 'classic UI' mode and you'd still be able to play it back in the other UI mode with no problems.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

When I started reading this thread I thought, - This is a catastrophe! Siemens is porting the Solid Edge interface to NX!

But after seeing the screenshots I must say, that is refreshing and awesome. thumbsup2

Thanks John R. Baker.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

ribbon is microsoft standard. I like it.

I could put together a few enhancement ideas for updating sketcher after playing with 9.0 later in the month.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Can anyone answer my question please !!!, IS THERE ANY NEW FUNCTIONS FOR THE ADVANCED SIMULATION MODULE ????

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The NX 9.0 'Whats New' document lists 16 items under 'Advanced Simulation':

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

So we spent X million dollars on replacing the user interface and made sure that all the flaws and deficiencies in the ribbon bar had workarounds, Now, -Did we actually make something better ? -Did we reduce time to market ? -Make workflows quicker ? -Can the blend feature now handle that 5 edge vertice or is it marketing ?

Regards,
Tomas

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

2
I'd like to add my 2 cents having just taken part in the UK beta testing. Basically I hate the ribbon interface and I'm dreading the day I have to unlease it on our 600 users. I really think Siemens have missed a trick with the interface, the ribbon interface works well with microsoft applications where there are a couple of hundred commands, but NX supports over 3000 commands. I honestly felt lost using it and wish that the development had spent more time in developoin the ful screen capability and the way the menus are accessed from there, perhaps instead of following microsofts lead, they should have looked to apple and their coverflow method of browsing music could have easily been applied to the menus.

There is some fantastic stuff coming up, don't get me wrong, however the pain I'm going to have to go through converting some of our engineers who are so resistant to change doesn't bare thinking about. Me? I've always been as JRB says 'evangelistic' about NX, I'm a big fan of the software, and I'm sure I'll get to grips with is, but I'm afraid this is a step in the total wrong direction, in my humble opinion, Siemens have, as we say in the UK, 'dropped a bollock'.


Si

Best regards

Simon NX 7.5.4.4 MP8 and NX 8.5 (native) - TC 8 www.jcb.com

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The ribbon interface is coming from 2 directions.
1) Microsoft is developing the tools and code to make programming into a ribbon interface easy for the developers.
2) The other CAD companies have already done the ribbon interface and NX is playing catch up. Wildfire5 introduced it to us in 2008/2009. Creo in 2010 spread it across the whole system. SE and SW already have it, too.

Since John's pictures don't show up when I view Eng-Tips at work, I have not seen what he posted.

Simon makes a good point about the number of commands in the application. Creo is like NX, thousands of commands and which ones do you group together. MS Office products may have 20% of the commands a CAD system has making it easier to put into the ribbon interface.

"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."

Ben Loosli

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote (PeterCrookall)


Sorry for the off-topic post, but I have to ask, is this the 'Peter Crookall' from down under fame?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For Ben, and anyone else who can't access photos from PhotoBucket, I've attached a zip file of images that I've posted in my replies.

As for the 'WHY' of this project, NX MUST remain a competitive product and we cannot do so if we cling to things like an old style user interface merely because it's the way we've always done it, which of course isn't true since the UI has changed many times since I first started using UG some 36 years ago. Besides, new engineers and designers coming into the workforce today are already using Ribbon-style interfaces on the products that they've been using like Office and perhaps even one of those 'other' CAD systems, and by us not keeping up, we run the risk of looking like a product that will NOT be able to do the job for new customers who are looking at replacing whatever their current systems are today (there is very little 'virgin' business out there except in developing countries, everywhere else, it's a replacement sell). We must remain competitive in BOTH functionality AND usability, and right now, having an 'old looking' UI gives the impression that NX will be less usable than a more modern looking system and even if we KNOW that this is not the case, it does little good if the customer decides to not even give NX a second look. We have to sell what the market is demanding, and before anyone comments on the idea that we're somehow ignoring the wishes of our existing customers, how are we expected to continue to provide the new and "fantastic stuff" for our current installed base if we go out of business?

I'm sorry, but we must move forward. As stated previously, we are going to continue to support, at least for a couple of releases, both the current menu/toolbar based UI as well as the new Ribbon interface, to allow our existing customers a period of time to make the transition.

As for our coming late to the market, while some may see this as us "playing catch-up" we did not make this decision lightly since we knew that there were concerns out there about how the Ribbon interface was being implemented in other products, both from Microsoft as well as other CAD systems (including one close to home) and therefore we spent extra time, and yes, extra resources, working on a UI architecture which we think addresses most, if not all, of the complaints that we have heard being expressed out in the marketplace. And we will continue to refine and improve what we've done, based on feedback from BOTH new AND existing customers, over the next several releases since we are committed to providing what we think will prove to be the best possible implementation of this this technology for use with what is a complex product, but one that we know our users must be able to use to design and manufacture their complex products. This is no different than any of the commitments we have made in the past and I think our track record proves that we generally deliver what we promise.

So while we appreciate and are listening to your concerns, we also ask that when you do get a chance to use NX 9.0 that you give the Ribbon interface a fair test and if you do see where we can make improvements, please feel free to let us know since our goal here is to provide the best and most usable products possible.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

@JohnRBaker

Quote (Sorry for the off-topic post, but I have to ask, is this the 'Peter Crookall' from down under fame? )

I'll answer as I have to work with him! Yes it is.

Anthony Galante
Technical Resource Coordinator

NX5.0.6, NX6.0.5, NX7.5.0-> NX7.5.5 & NX8.0.0 -> NX8.0.3.4, NX8.5.0.23

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Peter, please drop me an email (if you look at my ID and add the appropriate periods (.) and then add the logical 'address', I think it'll get to me OK) as I'd like to see how you've been doing these past few years since I last visted OZ and we tipped a few 'Cascades' together cheers

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I'll post my five cents here. Apart from NX I worked extensively in Autodesk Inventor. When Inventor switched to the ribbon interface, I tried it and immediately loved it and has been happy ever since. love2 I think it's going to be good in NX.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For what my opinion is worth, I would advise people to use the full screen mode with a single, customized floating toolbar palette that you access with the alt key.

Advantages are:

  • Maximum real estate
  • Only the commands that you use are visible (nobody uses 3000 commands)
  • Minimum time is wasted moving your eyes away from the work and looking for commands (the palette pops up right where your cursor is)
  • No time is wasted switching between toolbars (or tabs)
  • Use mouse gestures for maximum speed
Having this setup allows you to play NX like a piano, rather than getting distracted by the interface.

NX8.5 Win7SP1 64bit i7-3770K@4.3Ghz 16GB Quadro2000

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I'm afraid to say I hate it :( I've been using Unigraphics since V16 but I've been looking at NX9 for the last month and it feels like 'change for change sake'. I feel the development time would have been better spent on more enhancements instead of changing the interface.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Anywhere to shut off the operation words? I have these icons memorized (for me, Chinese is next).......I don't need to see their descriptions. Descriptions take up too much space.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Are you're referring to the icons w/text that you're seeing in the NX 9.0 'ribbon' bar itself?

BTW, are you a beta tester or are your comments based only on what you've seen either here in the images that I've posted or what you have seen in a demo somewhere of NX 9.0?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Yes, is there a way to shut off the text that is next to the icons?

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

OK, I'm going to assume that you're NOT a beta-tester, but rather are going only by what you've seen here in the images that I've posted.

Except for the large icons, all of the others that you see either in the Ribbon itself or in one of the 'Galleries', that is the Small or Medium sized icons, YES, you can optionally include the text next to the icons or not. For the large icons that you see in the Ribbon itself, they will always appear with text since the Ribbon has a fixed height and removing the text on large icons, since they can't be stacked, would not save any space anyway so we simply leave the text on. However, you do have the option of using large icons in a Gallery and in that case you will have the option to include the text or not.

Also note that we've changed the behavior with respect to what happens to the icons if you change the size of the window that NX is running in or if you're forced to change the display resolution of the screen, which often happens when you're using a laptop hooked to a projector that is not able to support the higher resolution of the laptop and you have to change to a resolution of 1280x1024 or even lower. Prior to NX 9.0, what would happen is that some of the icons in the toolbars which went beyond the edge of the now smaller effective window boundaries would be removed and replaced with a single set of double-chevrons '>>' indicating that some icons had been removed and you'd have to select these double-chevrons to get access to the 'missing' icons. This was always a problem when I was doing demos where they didn't have a new, high resolution projector and so to mitigate this situation, I created a special Role for use with a 1280x1024 display where I only included the absolute minimum number of icons needed for my demo so that I didn't have to mess with the double-chevrons during the demo. However, now with NX 9.0 what happens is that we try and keep the icons but remove the text if it doesn't fit (BTW, you'll have control over which of the Small icons in the Ribbon will be the first to lose their text versus which ones will hang on till there's no choice but to remove the text) and if you were to continue to reduce the window size or resolution, the 'groups' in the Ribbon will be converted into a sort of gallery or drop-down but at least one large icon will remain as a place-holder for this new 'gallery/drop-down'. So the point I'm making is that while it might appear that the text next to an icon is wasting space, if we really need that space later on, we will automatically give up the text before we start hiding the icons.

Anyway, I hope this helps with your concerns.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I thought at first that the user would have complete control over customization.
But not being able to fully customize the interface like SW is disappointing.

Now I'm wondering... ponder
If I have only limited control about how much space some icons occupy and its spatial position and grouping in the interface, wouldn't be the current interface much more productive?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

There's nothing preventing you from replacing all of the Large icons (with text) with small icons (without text), or move everything into a gallery where you can use small, medium or large icons (with or without text). Not sure how much more 'customizable' we can make it.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hi John,

As a Beta Tester we're not allowed to say anything, but since you already mentioned some things I thought I might jump in.
I'm actually trying out small icons without text as we speak. And I must say I like it a LOT. Everything can be grouped very nicely with the extra advantage that you cannot accidentally move around the groups. And as John already mentioned, you can create your own stuff and throw out the standards if those don't fit your personal needs.
Everything is better organised, better visibility and more icons per "real estate"

How do you say it John? Something like not being the first per se but rather being the best.
Well as for being customizable, it's VERY good the new ribbon bar, probably the best out there.

Greetings,
Frank

2x NX8.5.1.3 Mach Design
on win7 64bit and MBP MacOS 10.8.3
NX Beta Tester
1x Solid Edge ST2

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Years ago (when we were still part of McDonnell Douglas) our development manager once stated that he'd rather be "late but great". And while many of us didn't necessarily agree with him, when you look back at who our competitors were at the time and then look around to see where those companies and products are today, you have to admit that perhaps there was something to what he said.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

As someone that got to see the demo in Dallas, I cannot wait to see the new UI in NX 9.0.

I have shown the pictures that John Baker posted to a couple of people here, and they can't wait either.

Chris Cooper
Senior CAD Specialist
Cleveland Golf/Srixon
www.clevelandgolf.com

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I think my main gripes with Ribbon 'anything' is that there are three main aspects that really annoy me.

1) You are limited to using the top of the screen only. No matter where your cursor is... you have to move it all the way to the top to enter a command. As opposed to what i can do now... I have the ability to have buttons all around my UI. The most used ones (like sketching for example) are on the side where my cursor seems to usually "sit". And it just seems to help/be more usable/be less annoying.

2) You are forced to click more to achieve the same. You have to click two (and sometimes three) times to start a command as opposed to what i can do now.... ONCE! This is really frustrating to me. I don't care how flashy the UI is. If it requires more clicks to do the same thing.. its annoying. Don't get me wrong.. i'm not a big proponent of clicks=productivity. Because this isn't the case. It's simply frustrating as a user to be able to achieve any command with one click... and then have to use multiple clicks just to start a command like as if you are forced to use a pull-down menu for EVERYTHING but lack the organizational benefits of the pull-down menu system (because most Ribbon UI's are poorly grouped and have been painful in that regard also).

And finally...

3) I can have as many (or as few) commands showing and all be a single press away. This allows me to have great tool/command discovery and flexibility and not 'forget' that i have this tool or that tool at my disposal even if i rarely use it. All while taking up stuff all screen real estate.

Now i'm all for UI change for the better. But the Ribbon is (thus far) seems to only cater to Joe Sheep that doesn't care about computers. He's just there to stuff around and make a pretty picture for his boss or daughter while the real users have to put up with it simply because its new. An example of "new" UI elements for the better are the radial style toolbars or the pop-up selection toolbars. Those things are great UI additions. They give you options and don't take away functionality or abilities.

By the looks of it Siemen's are at least looking at the Ribbon style with a bit more professionalism and making it more usable/customizable/etc. And although i will give it a fair go because of this aspect (which most Ribbon UI's don't even deserve they are that limited!) i still feel that when all is said and done it wont really be any better... just different and not quite as good.

Sometimes a change is nice even if its the same functionality because, lets face it, we sometimes get sick of the monotony. But i haven't got sick of hitting toolbar buttons yet. Especially when i have the power and flexibility to customise them in the ways i can now.

I see a few people mention SW's ribbon attempt. I loath it just like all the others. for the points mentioned above (but not limited to). Nothing beats what i current am able to do with normal toolbars. Its got nothing to do with having use toolbars for a long time and nothing to do with "not wanting to change". I'll change if its worthy of such. Just like i took to pop-up selection toolbars like a duck to water. If its not annoying and is a useful addition i'll eat it up! I just don't think the ribbon is a design that is this. Or at the very least won't be without a lot more additions and development. And having to trundle through this stage when you're already at a great stage... doesn't seem worth it. And not when i think about teh fundamental design design of the Ribbon tyle which means MANY commands won't be selectable without at least two clicks. And thats a real annoying thing from a usable point of view.

But we'll see!

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Perhaps you missed where I mentioned earlier that you'll have the option of placing commonly used items on so-called 'Border Bars', such as I did here...



...with many of the Freeform Surfacing functions placed on the 'Left Border Bar', which I can access without having to leave the Modeling 'Home' Ribbon. In addition to the 'Quick-Access Bar' along the top of the screen, where you can also add and remove items, and the 'Top Border Bar', which is being used as the new 'Selection Bar' but where you can add and remove additional icons, there are also 'Left' (as seen above), 'Bottom' and 'Right' border bars. Note that these 'border bars' are application specific, meaning that you can have one set of icons defined while you're working in Modeling and a different set when creating Drawings or when defining tool paths or when creating Sheet Metal parts.

When you get your chance to look at NX 9.0 I suspect that you'll find many more ways to leverage the various UI schemes and customization options than you what you expecting, particularly if you're current perception of Ribbon interfaces are the result of looking at what other vendors have offered in the past.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

John,

No i never missed where you mentioned that. I was simply stating things that i have found with all ribbon style UI's to date. And like i said... we will see. I will give it a go. And i think Siemen's are giving it the extra options it needs to be even considered a step forward. I have more trust in you guys than any other CAD developer at this point in time.

But i'm not going to blindly agree without thorough scrutiny because marketing/PR teams rarely (if ever) have my best interests as intentions. As you stated earlier... the Siemen's team don't want to be seen as being left behind so they change because of this. Not necessarily because this is a more effective or less frustrating interface to use. :)

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I agree about the NX's functionality had outgrown the current interface.
Also, the J. R. Baker's clarifications and reasons had been very useful.
Beyond that this interface looks awesome, exist the necessity (IMHO) to put some "personal" order among so many icons. And the use of tabs (ribbon) help to this goal.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For those of you who have made comments, good or bad, about the new NX 9.0 'ribbon' interface, we would like to take some of this discussion off-line if possible. Could you please contact me via email (just place a couple of periods in the logical place in my 'handle' and add what you'ed expect the Siemens 'address' to be and I should get it OK)? Thanks in advance.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Taking the discussion off-line is of no benefit to the users. Let's keep discussing it here, I'd like to read more some opinions please.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Trust me, I have NO intentions of NOT continuing to respond in public forums, be it this one or any others, where this topic may be brought up!

That being said, there are some questions which I would like to ask people which would NOT be appropriate, at least not being appropriate based on how I interpret the usage guidelines as outlined in the 'Eng-Tips Posting Policies', for them to be asked and answered in a public forum such as this one. If you have a problem with that, then please don't email me. We'll keep our exchange strictly public, OK?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

??

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Exactly WHAT is your problem with my asking the questions that I have? Why the "??" response?

As stated previously, my request to make off-line contact has absolutely nothing to do with how I or anyone else at Siemens PLM will be responding to this or any other forum dealing with NX 9.0 and the changes being made to the UI. I simply need to ask a few questions where it would be more appropriate if they were dealt with off-line.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Right above the thread reply box is the reminder:

No promoting, selling, recruiting or student posting

Personally, I have no problem with this discussion being here; but it could be construed as "promoting" since we are discussing the various merits of beta software. I respect John's decision to abide by eng-tips policies by taking this discussion off-line. If you want to keep it a public discussion (which I also think would be good), perhaps someone can start a thread in GTAC's NX CAD support forum...

www.nxjournaling.com

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I'm sorry cowski but I'm NOT asking to take this discussion OFF-LINE.

If you read the 'fine print' in the 'Eng-Tips Posting Policies' I believe that my responses cannot in any way be construed as "promoting" since I've been responding to legitimate questions posted by concerned users of our software. However, there are some issues which I would like to explore with the people who have posted their comments here, or anyone who may have simply been reading the posts, but if I do, there is a very good chance that this could evolve into something which I believe WOULD violate the rules established by the powers-the-be here at Eng-Tips and I have too much respect for them to abuse the privilege that I have enjoyed as a vendor being allowed to post here in the manner that I have been these past several years. This is what led to my asking that anyone who would be willing to answer some simple questions about this issue that, at least in my opinion, should only be handled OFF-LINE, to please go back and look at my request that they email me.

Thank for for your patience and that of anyone else following this thread.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Taking the discussion off-line is of no benefit to the users. Let's keep discussing it here, I'd like to read more some opinions please.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

What exactly don't you understand when I posted, twice now, once directly in response to you and once in answereing cowski, that "I have NO intentions of NOT continuing to respond in public forums, be it this one or any others, where this topic may be brought up!"?

WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM!!!!!!!

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Well, then sit back and read, senior Baker. I am sure other users want to discuss this topic.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

And I've done NOTHING to discourage that from happening. In fact, I've provided more detailed information and images than I suspect that most any of the people who have posted here, including yourself, ever expected to see this early in the 'life cycle' of our next product release, correct?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

No, you are wrong about that. A change to NX that alters a universe of users' personal interaction with a purchased product, and purports to deliver magical "productivity gains", is truly something that I expect to be discussed here, and not behind closed doors.

I would think you would put a value on users' opinions.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For being a member of the so-called "Reality-Based Community" you sure are having problems understanding a simple statement; "I have NO intentions of NOT continuing to respond in public forums, be it this one or any others, where this topic may be brought up!". Please point out where I've not answered any questions put forward in this thread concerning the changes to the UI being made for NX 9.0.

My request for people to contact me OFF-LINE has NOTHING to do with discussing the pro's and con's of what we are doing for NX 9.0. Perhaps someone who has already contacted me OFF-LINE might be willing to back-up this statement since they're aware of why I asked them to contact me and why it would not have been appropriate to have asked the questions, which I've already asked them, here on an Eng-Tips forum.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I e-mailed John a question yesterday. So I would like to ask the beta testers if they observered any slow down and or extra system resources being taken up by this new interface? If you are not allowed to comment I understand.

Below is the question I asked John off line.

Does going to the new Ribbion take more memory away from the system resources from a Graphics card, memory and or CPU point of view? Do we get performance enhancements going to the ribbion versus using the old interface?

I will let John reply with his comment he sent back to me if he wants.

Good topic

Thanks

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I am hoping for a reply to your question, SDETERS. We may actually get an answer from Baker, since I read he intends to continue to respond to this topic.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

In keeping with the idea of being open and above board (but only because SDETERS has suggested it since I normally consider direct email exchanges to be private communications) I'm posting my response, in its entirety (without any additions or subtractions), to his recent OFF-LINE question to me:


The UI (AKA ‘Ribbon’) project, as you can imagine, was implemented with improving productivity in mind rather than pure performance, but that being said, they had strict orders to NOT impact performance, and they feel that they have accomplished both aspects of that effort, improved overall productivity with no noticeable impact on the performance of the system, both in terms of how the user interface behaves or how the underlying NX code executes.

As for the rather formidable looking ‘drop-down’ shown in my example that I posted, be aware that the user has complete control as to which of the galleries or groups of icons as well as individual icons are visible, or if they are located on the main Ribbon tab versus even having to be on a ‘more’ gallery (AKA ‘pull-down’), or if you’d rather have them on one of the ‘side-bars’, which again the user has control over whether they’re shown or not (by definition, a side bar, even if technically ‘active’, will not be visible if there are NO icons on it).

As for the raw performance of the Ribbon UI, it’s hard for me personally to quote anything quantitative since everyone’s systems are different. For example, while I do all of my work on a Dell laptop with only 8GB of memory, it is a fairly fast 4-core configuration with a decent graphics card (for a laptop) however the hard drive has been replaced with a 500GB SSD ‘drive’ and since that swap-out, I have to admit that ALL versions of NX that I’m running on it have seen significant improvements in performance, particularly when starting a cold session and when opening large files (all my files are stored locally on that same SSD ‘drive’, and I’m NOT running under Teamcenter so that’s a factor as well).



I'll let SDETERS add any additional comments with respect to his reaction to my email response to him which I've now shared (at his request) with the general public, as it were.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

What measurement criteria were used to quantify the "productvity gains". Please cite examples.

I am anticipating my managers wanting to know how must faster we will be able to work, seeing how we will have a shiny new user interface.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Thanks John and all for the comments. This is a great topic

With the idea of being new interface is bitter sweet. I go back to my autocad days of custom icons and scripts ect. We went to the new and great Autcad 2000 I think it was, and all of my nice programs, hotkeys, and accelerator customization was junked. Long story short all of my auotcad icons now had smilley faces on them and none of them worked. So with any new interface I have flash back to the autocad days. But with a little bit of work I was able to adapt and make autocad workflows easier and quicker.

Now with that being said the other issue is how NX handles old legacy models, assmeblies ECT. NX does this great. So how long is NX going to hold onto the "old" UI interface?
This has to take up hard drive space to store two different type UI?

Will there now be two different sets of DLX MTX files being stored? Will the ribbon be stored differently than the current user interface?

Once again if these are questions that can not be answered I understand.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For capnhook, we have a process where we rigorously study actual users, both new and experienced, whenever we implement significant changes to the user interface of NX. The last time this occurred, prior to NX9.0, was when we released NX 5.0 (and we heard a lot complaints about those changes as well, but ask anyone if they're willing to go back to a NX 4.0 style interface). This process uses several tools which measures such things as the time it takes to accomplish certain tasks or workflows, the number of keystrokes needed, the amount of mouse travel required, etc. We even video tape the test subjects's hands and faces to see their reactions and physical behavior. The so-called 'usability lab', which is set-up when needed, is often utilized during the alpha and beta process, and certainly was this time with NX 9.0 beta testing earlier this year, as well as taking it 'on-the-road'. For example, at the recent Americas Siemens PLM Connections in Dallas this past June. During the week of the conference many people were asked or volunteered to participate in one of these sessions (another potential benefit if you attend these national meetings) where they not only got to help us gather data about that changes already being implemented but also with respect to some of the 'fine-tuning' which will be taking place over the next several releases. Note that all of this is done only after we had consulted with ergonomic and computer UI experts. And this is not limited to just the sytle of the UI, but also the colors used and other seemingly minor or incidental issues.

As for SDETERS questions, while we have not made a 'carved-in-stone' decision, the idea is that we will continue to support both the Ribbon interface and the so-called 'Classic' interface for at least a couple of releases beyond NX 9.0. The one thing that some people might notice before that is that in the next release, we may not make it as easy (or at least require more explicit user action) to switch from the Ribbon to the Classic UI (for NX 9.0, it's simply an option on the Prefernces -> User Interface... dialog). And while there's obviously some duplication of files needed to support both the Ribbon and the classic interface, they are not significant enough in terms of resources (i.e. disk space) so as to be a determining factor in when and if we remove the old files altogether. And NO there will NOT be TWO different .mtx files or for that matter, different Role files if you do switch between the two different UI styles. We've developed a single file format which uses a super-set of the current data records to record the Ribbon specific changes.

Anyway, I hope that answers your questions.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Almost John. Thanks for the feedback. Could you go more into depth about this single file format super set file. At the currrent time we use cohon's customize NX for Windows. This lets any user go to any computer in our company login and get all of special menus they have set up. The Menu files are stored on a network drive at the current time. This works nice. Will this still be possible with this new ribbon UI, Have the Users Super set file stored on a network drive?

Once again Thanks for all the feedback.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

While I can't speak specifically to what Rob has done, since I don't personally use his tools (but I know that many people do), I'm not aware of anything that we have done that would prevent him from producing a single set of NX 9.0 compatible files which will work with either the Ribbon or the Classic interface, even if some users on the network were running one style and some the other style. That being said, let me talk to Rob and I'll get back to you if he foresees any issues which will change the approach that he has used with past releases of NX.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Thanks for the feedback again. And also for looking into asking Rob about this.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I'm a NX user from NX6.
I use NX 8 hours for day and a lot of hours at home.
I'm NX 9 beta user and I assure the users that the new ribbon UI increment the usability of NX and save time.

Thank you...

Using NX 8 and TC9.1

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quick question for John; I love what I've seen so far in the screen shots (thanks for those), but I worry that I've also read lots of mention of Microsoft development, so I'm wondering if this new ribbon will be a Windows-only UI enhancement? Right now, the unified toolbar (or whatever it's called) isn't available to us Mac users who are stuck in an X11/Motif time machine, and I cringe at the thought of another major release of NX with minimal improvements to the Mac UI. I know we're a small portion of the market, along with the Linux guys I suspect, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I can't imagine that X11/Motif has enough of a UI toolbox to offer a ribbon, so I'd also wonder if there were any plans to migrate NX to the full native Aqua UI on the Mac? I know it's probably asking a lot, but I'm trying to be that squeaky wheel.

Thanks for the updates on NX 9.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hello All.

Adressing my question to John.
As an engineer using NX I am working with a dual monitor. In fact all of our engineers are using this dual monitor setup.
What I normally do is place all my Navigator screens undocked on my second monitor so I can have them active all the time and still be able to see my full NX desktop on my first monitor.
The one problem with this is alligning my navigators, so they fit neatly on my second monitor. It is difficult and win7 doesn't nicely remember the positions so they tend to jump around with each new NX session. I would like them to be alligned and also fully extended.
Would be a nice addition to the user interface if I can "group" my navigators in undocked position and being able to place them (all combined)
as a seperate window on my other monitor.

Pherhaps someone has an alternative solution or is NX9 handeling this differently now?

Br. Ronald

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

A quick question, which versions of windows will NX9 run on, i.e. 7, 8 or both? Thanks in advance.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For MichaelPrichard, I can't comment on the last part of your question relative to any future effort to adopt a more Mac-like interface for Mac-OS versions of NX (despite my own personal feelings, having been a Mac user in my personal life since 1985).

As for your initial question, the NX 9.0 Ribbon Project is for Windows only, Linux and Mac users will continue to use the 'Classic' UI.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

For nutace, as far as NX 9.0 is concerned, I'm not aware of any changes to the behavior of 'undocked' Navigators, irrespective of whether you're utilizing one or two monitors.

As for your general request for advice concerning your current efforts with this, perhaps it would be better to start a new thread dedicated to this specific issue since comments on this issue could get lost in the minutiae of this rather long yawn and sometimes intense thread swords

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote (multicaduser)


A quick question, which versions of windows will NX9 run on, i.e. 7, 8 or both?

Since we've already certified (albeit with at least one caveat) NX 8.5 on Windows 8, and since support for Windows 7 is not going aways anytime soon, the answer to your question is a definite BOTH.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I think its a training problem myself and either companies should keep up with training or it's up to the employees to just train them selves. I was an AutoCAD user mostly and five years ago my company told me to run NX5 and never even considered sending me for training. I had to take it upon myself to request the training and it was not initially approved so I had to ask at higher levels of management and then finally after I researched where and when only then it got approved.

Now my company is making the switch for everyone to get NX, and now we have a good work place training program. This has made a huge difference in productivity.

Currently Using NX8.0

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hi,

I am a Catia user and own a personal seat for machining. I have used NX on and off between jobs and almost bought one personal seat of NX but the dealer failed to honor the deal even after I signed the PO. Anyway first time I used NX back in 2006 and I really liked it and it got even better in NX5, NX6, NX7.
I customized some templates for the machining users. I think NX offers great functionality to customize the dialog boxes for the machining operations. The custom templates I made in NX can help any Catia user to switch to NX in no time for NC-programming. I hope NX folks didn't take that functionality out. Currently I am trying to bring in at least one NX machining seat at my workplace and eventually try to replace all Catia machining seats with NX.

Anyway back to this ribbon interface. I am 100% agreed to the points made by these users
HercalloY wrote:

Quote:

I think my main gripes with Ribbon 'anything' is that there are three main aspects that really annoy me.

1) You are limited to using the top of the screen only. No matter where your cursor is... you have to move it all the way to the top to enter a command. As opposed to what i can do now... I have the ability to have buttons all around my UI. The most used ones (like sketching for example) are on the side where my cursor seems to usually "sit". And it just seems to help/be more usable/be less annoying.

2) You are forced to click more to achieve the same. You have to click two (and sometimes three) times to start a command as opposed to what i can do now.... ONCE! This is really frustrating to me. I don't care how flashy the UI is. If it requires more clicks to do the same thing.. its annoying. Don't get me wrong.. i'm not a big proponent of clicks=productivity. Because this isn't the case. It's simply frustrating as a user to be able to achieve any command with one click... and then have to use multiple clicks just to start a command like as if you are forced to use a pull-down menu for EVERYTHING but lack the organizational benefits of the pull-down menu system (because most Ribbon UI's are poorly grouped and have been painful in that regard also).

And finally...

3) I can have as many (or as few) commands showing and all be a single press away. This allows me to have great tool/command discovery and flexibility and not 'forget' that i have this tool or that tool at my disposal even if i rarely use it. All while taking up stuff all screen real estate.

CNSZU wrote

Quote:

For what my opinion is worth, I would advise people to use the full screen mode with a single, customized floating toolbar palette that you access with the alt key.

Advantages are:

Maximum real estate
Only the commands that you use are visible (nobody uses 3000 commands)
Minimum time is wasted moving your eyes away from the work and looking for commands (the palette pops up right where your cursor is)
No time is wasted switching between toolbars (or tabs)
Use mouse gestures for maximum speed

Having this setup allows you to play NX like a piano, rather than getting distracted by the interface.

I really never liked the UI of Catia especially their PPR tree which requires lots of mouse clicking/scrolling. So I ended up writing my own small interface using winAPIs and of course some Catia APIs. However Catia has certain things which are really good.

For example
I can work on Catia for 10-12-14 hours a day without any strain on my eyes. Color and feel of graphics are much better than NX. No matter how hard I tried to customize the color settings in NX. I was never able to achieve the same feel you get out of Catia. In NX the color setting dialog box has very small icons which really puts lots of strain on the eyes, unless there is a way to make them big. So NX could look into improvements, be it documentation/training or software.
Maybe it is their tool-bars which have really nice 3d effect that gives such feel. I hope that NX offers some customization options for setting the colors and style of the tool-bars.

Attached are some snapshots.

* In this ribbon bar there is one major flaw. Save and Undo buttons are very close. If user hits Save instead of Undo then it is not good at least not in Catia where it flushes Undo buffer. So user could accidentally overwrite the file and lose lots of time.

* Moreover this ribbon suits the microsoft office products which are nowhere near cadcam systems. I hope it doesn't cause any problems especially when users want to customize UI. Even if it does then it is not a big problem because users will always adapt to the changes as they have to make their living. However, sometimes it leaves a bitter experience.

One more thing I would like to add is that you don't have to change for the sake of change or because new engineers, designers have a background in office products etc. It is an engineering system which is not an office word or excel to write text only stuff. Change is good as long there is no compromise in functionality.

As far as I know NX is the best cadcam system amongst the ones I have used in my experience. I hope they will keep it that way.

Just my 2 cents.


RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote (cnc07)


In NX the color setting dialog box has very small icons which really puts lots of strain on the eyes, unless there is a way to make them big.

Yes there is. Below is an image showing the default Color Palette on the left and the one on the right after using...

Preferences -> Visualization -> View/Screen

...and the 'Calibrate' tools to change the size of the color 'swatches' in the dialog.



As for the close proximity of the Save and Undo buttons, you can use customize to put some space between them...



...or do what most people do, just press Ctrl-Z to perform an Undo, like they do in most every Windows application.

Anyway, thanks for the input as there were a couple things there that I'm passing on to the UI design team, like perhaps we really should put a little 'air' between the Save and Undo buttons.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Thanks John. For some reason I never thought of using Ctrl+Z for undo in any cad system I have used. But I use this key combination whenever I need it while writing the code in visual studio, notepad++, etc. basically for all text editing purposes including writing the posts on the forums. I guess it is hard wired into my brain to use Undo button whenever using any cad system. And thanks for the tip on the Color Palette settings, I'll try it next time I use NX.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

John,
I have looked over the screenshots you posted, we are moving to NX9 next summer. Can you tell me if the in-command menus that pop up are still based heavily on pull-down style fields? The pull downs on everything (Including the selection bar) are soooo time consuming. Take for example the "Move Component" command. For the copy mode, there is a pulldown for only two options, copy or no copy! Every time I hit a pull-down I have to click twice. When doing this all day, it REALLY adds up. Glad to see you can add icons to the side bars, so I at least won't have to click twice just to get to a command. It would be wonderful if some keyboard shortcuts were added for in-command options, like what I described above. Like just hit "C" for copy or something like that. MUCH faster. Anything is better than pull-downs.

Just my opinions.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Adding icons to the side bars == toolbars, doesn't it? If toolbars were not deemed a "modern interface", why is this scheme being included?

Toolbars AND ribbons? Will there be any screen left?

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

At the moment, there are not yet that many changes within the dialogs themselves. For NX 9.0 the focus is on the first level, ie the ribbon bars, and over time more things will be looked at to improve productivity and ease of learning.

As for the so-called 'Side Bars' they are intended primarily as temporary repositories for COPIES of functions which will be needed for a short period of time and then removed when no longer needed. This is because it does not require the use any of the UI Customize tools to do this. Now if there IS a need to have permanently easier access to those functions that out-of-the-box are located on one of the 'More' panels, now that is when you would use the Customize tools to MOVE those functions from one of those 'More' panels up onto the Ribbon Bar itself. Note we're currently working on some additional options which will make it easier to organize the contents of a Ribbon so as to give you more usable real estate so that more functions can to given direct access without having to think of the Side Bars as permanent repositories for icons thus creating, far all intents and purposes, a new type of 'toolbar'.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Been having a go with the new NX ribbon the last few weeks, its fine. I've used top and bottom border bars for regularly accessed "non-modelling" functions (selection, utility and view type commands) and have pretty much otherwise left it unchanged. Finding that the galleries are kind of like a pull down menu system, but quicker.

And yesterday I found out that the context sensitive toolbars are customisable, so that could be pretty useful!

Think I might be being converted, my only concern is convincing everyone else!

www.jcb.com
NX 7.5 with TC 8.3

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Here's a chance to actually see a bit of the newer look of what the Ribbon UI will be like with the release of NX 9.0.1.

http://community.plm.automation.siemens.com/t5/NX-...

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Thanks.
We are still on NX 8, but anxious for to try this new interface. It looks promising.
Perhaps next year the managenent will hear us. sadeyes

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Now that I have used the Ribbon interface in NX 9 for a month or so, I mostly prefer it. However I find that the current implementation is very feature light, and doesn't include numerous (basic?) functions that I use regularly. If the intent is encourage users to move towards this then they need to be able to do most everything within this ribbon system. In addition, I find the default menu separations convoluted and lacking coherency at times. I think the team at Siemens needs to think a little bit more about sensible locations and groupings of these buttons. In the end, I feel like I still have to use the old 'menu' drop-downs and binoculars more than I should have to with a ribbon system (since they are now in some sort of unusual ribbon location, or buried within the context of the 'Menu' drop-down.)

Naturally, this can all be customized, but I think that a little could go a long way, in regards to defaults, when it comes to getting users to adopt this system. As of right now everything is just too fragmented to consider ribbons a fully fleshed out solution.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Oh, and one other thing that I find EXTREMELY annoying about the new interface:

Out of all the different options we get now while using the ribbons (ribbon, top/side/bottom toolbars, upper left shortcut bar, etc) not one of these are static. Unless I am mistaken, every one of NX's menus are dynamic and change with the module. Which means if you want a function you use all the time in a specifc location, you have to redefine it for each module. If we could have just one static location to drop tools (whether such tools can be utilized in the currently active module or not) it would help in developing locational memory for the user. Withe the toolbar system it seemed easier to create a locational environment, even though it was dynamic it was easier to manage because adding/removing an existing toolbar to a general location a simple right click and select. Now if I want to customize there is quite a bit more digging and clicking involved and more divided by the various interface options (ribbon, top/side/bottom toolbars, upper left shortcut bar, etc).

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

What you could do is to go into Customize and create a NEW 'Ribbon Tab' where you can place the icons (copies or originals) for those functions which you'd like to have access to across multiple applications. And while defining the new 'Ribbon Tab', you can select, under the 'Properties...' button, exactly in which applications you'd like this new 'tab' to be available.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Yes, I have done this and it does help. What I dislike about it though is that I still have to traverse to the ribbon tab to get to those functions. Meaning more clicks than before, unfortunately. But its something I can deal with...

As one of our CAD admins, one question though: is it possible to customize these ribbon tabs to where they auto-populate via text file or another method. I have the same question regarding ribbon groups and which tabs these they populate by default? With toolbars I could define via text file, place in the startup location, and all users would get the toolbar. Do ribbons offer this same level of functionality, or are they only user.mtx and role based? Hopefully something like this exists or is planned...role modifications are good and great but not a very good solution for users who have already customized their environment or if there are a bunch of users you want to deploy new toolbar functionality to.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

There's nothing preventing you from creating your own customized ribbon files, just like you used to create menu and toolbar files, and place them in the 'startup' folder where they will be activated when NX starts-up.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

How do you save the custom ribbon files? You mentioned that there are

Quote (JohnRBaker)

'Ribbon Tab' (.rtb) and 'Ribbon Group' (.grb) files
and that you can

Quote (JohnRBaker)

create menu and toolbar files, and place them in the 'startup' folder where they will be activated when NX starts-up

I am new to NX 9.0 and am a current ProE / Creo user. I just started going over some tutorials that were freely available online. Some of the tutorials available online were written for NX 8.5, which did not have the new ribbon interface. I created a custom 'Menu' ribbon so that I could follow along in the tutorials faster. The Menu button that is in the Top Border Bar requires two mouse clicks to get to each menu, while creating a custom ribbon with each menu only requires one mouse click.

I don't know how to save the ribbon I created and to make sure that it gets loaded everytime. I see that it will show up in the Customize menu and I can check the box to show it. How can I save the custom ribbon as a file? Where is the default startup folder? Thanks

Here are some screenshots:
Default Menu in Top Border Bar
Custom Menu in Ribbon

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Any changes to the UI whether it's toggling something on/off or adding icons to a border bar, as well as any changes made using the Customize tools, they are automatically saved in a file named 'user.mtx' and it will be used the next time you start NX so as to give you what you had when you last logged-off. However, it's recommended that you create a 'Role' for yourself which you can always go back to if you mess-up the UI in any way.

As for the documentation on how to use file-based customization to alter/add-to the ribbon interface, you can get a copy from GTAC.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Being an NX user for 18 years, using the toolbar configuration has been my "go to" when working fast in an unfamiliar environment. As is using NX on someone elses desktop....I would have my roles or .mtx file on a network or thumb drive, and very quickly get my "style" of workspace at my immediate disposal. I think from NX10 on the ability to change back to "classic" mode will be removed as JB stated.....can't support both UI's without arthritis. Good terminology John!.....
I feel that the ribbon UI is going to be combersome and take up more space to model in as I have noticed in my first looks at NX9. We as designers need more workspace, not less. I am sure I will adapt to the new UI, but at first glance I prefer the toolbar UI.

RIP toolbars.....

regards,

Al Makuch

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

You will have until NX 11.0 before the old 'classic' UI is retired.

Note that for NX 10.0 we've done a lot of what we call 'polishing of the UI', based on feedback that we got during the NX 9.0 beta testing and from the early NX 9.0 adopters. I suspect that once you start using either NX 9.0 or NX 10.0 that you'll soon see that while it might look like the interface takes up more space, it also offers you much more control over the access to the functions that you use all of the time versus those which you may access less frequently but still often enough that you don't want to go hunting for icons which have been switched off and that you need to toggle back on temporarily. Also note that we are still using the .mtx, and Roles, to capture all of your UI changes and for NX 10.0 we've even included the Resource Bar setting in the .mtx file (and Roles) so that even more of your preferred settings can be captured and 'taken with you' when you need to.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I have followed this thread with great interest and noted a few key points.

Those that have not tried the ribbon or only 'briefly' are skeptical and understandably reluctant (I was in that group). Now those that have spent some time familiarizing themselves with the new interface have generally liked it (I am now in that group now).

There will always be some that resist change, we are engineers', that's how it is! Move with the time, you may like it.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I also was in that group too, but eventually I did grow to sort of like the NX9 ribbon.

I do still prefer NX8.5 full screen mode though with collapsed toolbar collector, ALT key to bring commands to cursor, radials and shortcut toolbars etc. - for me this is this really good UI.

But as you say, move with the times!

www.jcb.com
NX 8.5 with TC 8.3

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I used to look forward to new software releases, now I dread them.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Last week I came in contact with NX 9 for first time.

It feels refreshing and polished, but after a few hours trying to customize it, a mayor shortcoming is evident.
The small icons are too small and the next size is only allowed with text, wasting a lot of space.
An intermediate icon size like the old and dear interface would be adequate.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

@carlharr
full screen mode is still available with ribbon interface

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

@deedub777

It is, but you don't have the same functionality and neatness such as collapsed toolbar collector, or tabs shown when hitting ALT for toolbars.
I found standard (ribbon) mode easier to use in NX9 than it's fullscreen mode.

I did think 9 ribbon mode is a MASSIVE improvement over the older standard display modes.
Galleries are great, and the new "selection-style" utility and view toolbars were good too.

But it does feel cluttered to me. I just personally prefer the 8.5 full screen mode to all other layouts of NX I've used.

That said, NX9 is very nice (apart from drafting) once you've used it for a while.

www.jcb.com
NX 8.5 with TC 8.3

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Note that for NX 10.0, you'll have the option of showing ribbon Icons in one of FOUR different sizes with all but the largest (a new size, larger than the current 'Large' icon) having the option to include text or not (the 'Extra Large' icon will only be available WITHOUT text).

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hope that this will not end in a war of more like Gilette and wilkinson sword: we have one razor blades, we have two, now we have (mach) three, and we have four... smile
I am still waiting for Gilette with 5 blades.
I am waiting for NX10 because it should improve the new things in NX9 and I hope that everything is stable then...

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Is there a process for importing/converting toolbars from older versions of NX to work in the ribbon environment?

(NX9.0 WIN7PRO)

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

@schellenbergj, totally off topic but gillette have had this 5 blade one for ages in Australia: http://www.gillette.com/en/au/products/razors/fusi...

Anthony Galante
Senior Support Engineer

NX5.0.6, NX6.0.5, NX7.5.5, NX8.0.0 -> NX8.0.3
NX8.5.0 -> NX8.5.3, NX9.0.0 -> NX9.0.2, NX10 Beta

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Quote:

Is there a process for importing/converting toolbars from older versions of NX to work in the ribbon environment?
Yes - you can load them interactively.
If you have a lot or are responsible for other users, download the document on this subject:

https://download.industrysoftware.automation.siemens.com/unigraphics/ugdoc/nx9/nx-9.0.0/NX_Ribbon-Customization_and_Transition.docx

Mark Rief
NX CAM Customer Success
Siemens PLM Software

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I have read through this thread with interest and also some bafflement at the apparent resistance to a ribbon based system. It is not exactly a new idea. If I remember correctly what used to be known as unigraphics / EDS systems Solid Edge V 9 used the same idea back in 2001... It worked pretty well then and as I had to subsequently transition into I-DEAS realised what a great idea it was.

(btw, if anyone has problmes with a ribbon interface they should try a session on I-DEAS V 9 and see what problems really are...)

I for one look forward to working on a ribbon based system again. In my experience customisation of any interface is usually a waste of time as by the time you get it how you would really ilke it software gets upgraded and all the custom stuff magically disappears with no possibility of retrieving it or it being compatible with the next version! I have become expert at using the CAD package OOTB so to speak as much as possible.

Rob.

Solid Edge; I-Deas 7 to 12; NX4, NX5 NX6 & currently NX7.5 / TeamCenter 9.1 & Ansys 14.5 on 6GB Windows 7.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Umm. You can't "see" any benefit to customizing a software's UI, and you see no reason to oppose the Ribbon UI?

Oh brother.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I think we need to consider modifying vs. appending...

Quote:

In my experience customisation of any interface is usually a waste of time as by the time you get it how you would really ilke it software gets upgraded and all the custom stuff magically disappears with no possibility of retrieving it or it being compatible with the next version!

I understnad your point here, but I want to point out that this is not necesarily true in NX, if you use file based customization. This is why we have the document that I referenced. If you interactively drag icons around to customize the OOTB ribbons, and save a role, you can have some issues going to the next version. But if you manage the customization and stick with full ribbons and border bars, then it's pretty stable from release to release. I have a custom toolbar that dates back Y2K or before, and with each release, I just drop the files in my usertools folder and it shows up in the UI. Now it shows up as a ribbon tab. Usually all I do is add new commands that I find myself using a lot.

Quote:

I have become expert at using the CAD package OOTB so to speak as much as possible.

Believe me, I understand this. Since I update NX daily or weekly, and need to study the OOTB user experience, I minimize my customizations to the OOTB UI. But don't be afraid to have an "add-on" ribbon or border bar if it makes your job easier.

Mark Rief
NX CAM Customer Success
Siemens PLM Software

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hi HercalloY

Don't get me wrong you can customise the interface all you want, but in my experience if you customise the process IE you get NX to do the work for you, you don't need to worry about customising the UI... We get all our standard drawings and 3D models from Excel sheets automatically so therefore worry less about the interface.. Don't buy a dog and bark yourself as they say.

Rob.

Solid Edge; I-Deas 7 to 12; NX4, NX5 NX6 & currently NX7.5 / TeamCenter 9.1 & Ansys 14.5 on 6GB Windows 7.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Minor clarification here - when I said

Quote:

I just drop the files in my usertools folder
I meant the folder structure defined by UGII_USER_DIR - such as startup, or application\profiles\UG_APP_MANUFACTURING for example.

Mark Rief
NX CAM Customer Success
Siemens PLM Software

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The ribbon interface is customisable sure but it sucks! It takes me more picks to get to an operator. In previous versions I couuld set up all my icoms in a few bars and have access to everything I needed with one pick. Tell me again how the new ribbion interface is better! I do have a choice on the cad software I use at work so now that I have dragged all the Catia guys over to UG I will be letting them go back to that system for their design work. I watched 6 guys yeaterday looking for operator icons that they used daily and had to keep searching for thinking what a waste of time. I would love to know if the people that program the software ever really use it because every time you create a new version you change the menu setup. Having designers searching for icons and other items makes them look more like monkeys fuc***g a football than Designers. Plus hours/days of lost productivity.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Hello ,
I just got my first taste of version 9 today and I am not going to like the ribbons. Microsoft did the same thing and it turned into a big pain. More picks to get to the same operator. I tried moving my .MTX file over but that does not work. I do have a customized set of toolbars that I have used for years and would like to keep some similarity between the 2 versions. I have 2 different versions of UG I have to use daily and you guys are not doing me any favors by switching. I know its happing but what a pain. I do need suggestions on how to get the ribbons set up the fastest to somewhat mimic my old menus. I am not an administrator.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Check Mark Rief's postings from last week (a few responses back-up from here) for a link to where you can get information about leveraging any customization that you might have used with previous versions of NX.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I just added my old custom toolbar to a new Ribbon.
Then I've added to it with the newer customizing method.

The old toolbars show up under Classic menu


RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Just wondered if it's possible to create a new group in an existing Tab?

For example, in the home tab I'd like to add a WCS group, and then throw in a couple WCS commands... (I don't want a WCS tab)

Thanks,

UGGuy...

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Ugguy:
Yes it is,
RMB on the toolbar - Customize, select the tab "Commands"
in the left area "categories" you will find the option "New Item" in the right area "new group" , drag this to the home tab.
Right click on the new group in the home tab - rename to something.

In the same customize -commands tab as the "new item" ( see above) expand the option "menu" - Format - wcs, drag the options you like to your new group.

( The difficult thing is to find the command one looks for in this customize dialog.... The old "menu" option is the key to success...)


Regards,
Tomas

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Note that in the NX 10.0 Customize dialog we are now including an ALPHABETICAL listing of EVERY command in NX and to make it even easier to find what you're looking for, we've included a 'Search' field which can be used to filter that full list of NX functions, as shown below where I did a search on all the commands which included the term 'WCS':

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

John; I saw that in the NX10 Beta, this is a 100% improvement to the NX9 which is , apart from the mentioned "old menu" rather impossible to use. I spent say 5 minutes yesterday looking for the WCS options before i discovered the "menu".
(I wish you guys could do a backport of this to NX9 ... NX10 is years away for us.)


Regards,
Tomas

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

OK, can some one please post how to get the old menus back?

I use NX seldom and I don't want to relearn it until I have to. (Besides, by the time they get rid of the old menus the new ones will have changed 3 times.

Dan

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

under Menu-> Preferences-> User Interface-> Layout tab. check Classic toolbars.

Though I recommend spending an hour and getting used to Ribbon. it's worth it.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Just so that we're all clear on this, NX 10.0 will be the last release to support the old Windows-style 'multiple toolbar' (AKA 'Classic tollbars') user interface.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

If you are familiar with the menus, you'll be glad to know they are still available (albeit in a drop down type format rather than the old style).

www.nxjournaling.com

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

so without ribbon bar in full screen i have the toolbars bar @ bottom (like in Nx8.5) when i switch to ribon bar the toolbar of tollbars disapear and appears like a drop-down @ top, i already saw someone working with the toolbar bar (ribbon) in bottom like the "classic view" how can i do it ?


NX8.5 - NX9 User

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I do really dislike the ribbon a better word is H8 it... and almost the whole office is united with disliking it....

Getting the classic menu...
Preferences -> user interface -> Layout ->Classic menu

The classic is a real useful....I am very sad...They are changin something that is not broken...
This is quite upsetting...

And almost all the places I have been use dual screen...and most of the larger screens are digital TV's converted to monitors....I disagree with the argument about managing real estate, Unless you have the icons text below icon Icon switched on....in that case i will reserve my comments for off line...

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

That's the fundamental problem with the ribbon interface, you spend more time searching for functions that used to have quasi-permanent locations. Now they are hidden all over the place.

Not impressed.

Proud Member of the Reality-Based Community..

To the Toolmaker, your nice little cartoon drawing of your glass looks cool, but your solid model sucks. Do you want me to fix it, or are you going to take all week to get it back to me so I can get some work done?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

First lesson: 'Command Finder'.

Second lesson: When you use the 'Command Finder' there's an option to add the newly found function, if it's not already on the Ribbon, to the current Ribbon tab.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

3
the command finder is a very good thing in itself, but it's similar to handing out gas masks to the people next to the leaking propane tank, you cure the smell but...

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Keyboard commands are a slick way to remove dependency on any user interface. I use the keyboard 80 percent of my commands. I only have to deal with the icons 20% of the time. This is why I was happy with the new accelerator key commands used for dimensions for drafting. You can modify layouts but the commands stay the same.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The Command Finder is a great tool I have to admit, but surely Siemens shouldn't be promoting it as the "answer" to the inadequacies of the Ribbon UI.

NX 9.0.3.4
NX 10 (Testing)
Windows 7 64 (Windows 8.1 Tablet)

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The 'Command Finder' is simply part of an overall 'system'. After all, it was much appreciated by people long before the Ribbon interface was introduced (the 'Command Finder' was first implemented in NX 5.0.2, which was released eight years ago).

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Command finder is all well and good, but its always been a needed function since Siemens or the Ideas guys never put any real value (thought) in having any OOTB Roles configuration that made sense.

As far back as NX2, did anyone ever complain that all the same functions any user might want in any of the following applications, (Modeling, Drafting Sheet Metal, ETC) like, Layer, Curves, WCS, Object display, Measure Distance, Measure Angle, and a ton of other function, notice that (even in) the OOTB roles are in different locations for each applications. What idiot thought it would be a good idea to put the layers button in a different location for each applications (same goes for a ton of other functions that are not application specific).

I have always been the guy, where ever I worked that shared my roles the new guys (and a good majority of the existing group) that make sense, and I'm not even the IT or UG support guy.

All of the functions that are the same for any application, I place across the top, and any that are application specific I place on the left (I prefer the resource bar "ant" on the right, like it was way back in version 11 circa 1994). Also I place the Cue/Status at the top. I have used Unigraphics since 1992, and have always loved every change until NX5. For some reason they took a whole bunch of standard things and ditched decades of muscle memory that I still cant change from (anybody remember "Select" "Entry Complete" "reject", why in NX3-4 did they think it would be a good idea to ditch the functionality of middle mouse key for select/accept, in the multi select dialogue. Don't get me wrong I'm not advocating bring back the PFK, but when UGII V9 went to V10, it made sense to revise the UI especially since the PFK was going away. But even the change of "action object" to either/or "object action" or "action object" IMO is/was a bad idea, since there is no standardization to what works and what does not from function to function.

Obviously Siemens must think that Microsoft is really so wonderful that they MUST copy their UI. How long before they tackle the UI and functionality of Windows 8 with the huge kindergarten tiles, and the relocation of everything (just for the sake of change). I can name dozens of things they should have fixed before they decided to change where you find the buttons.

I personally will not be switching to the ribbon until I have to. Changing something so major as this just to compete with (look like) Solidworks, and all the other CAD systems is a horrible idea.

I would like to see a reply of all the users here that use NX9+, and whether they prefer the ribbon and how long they have been using Unigraphics (NX). Also, how many hours a day do you use NX, and did you previously prefer using the drop downs or selecting using the buttons.

I have used Unigraphics at least 40 hours a week since 1993.
I prefer the buttons to the drop down menus, I have always been very rigorous about the placement of buttons and not duplicating them and not using buttons that change every time you use them, and above all else, making sure each application has the button that is not application specific in the exact same place from application to application.
As stated before, I will be sticking with the (so called) classic menu until I cannot any longer.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I have been using NX for 15 years now starting from Unigraphics v15.
I like the new ribbon style as it gives much more capabilities in managing my buttons. You can get a lot more buttons (dropdown menus) in the same space compared to the old interface.
Not using NX the whole day for 5 days a week but I am the Application Specialist who is responsible for maintaining our NX environment. I do have 10 years of "End User" Experience.

I do admit it takes some time getting used to and for those who are commenting they will only switch when it is neccesary I would say, why not start experimenting with it already?
If you wait until you have no choice anymore than it will be much harder to get used to.

Ronald van den Broek
Application Specialist
Winterthur Gas & Diesel Ltd
NX8.5.3 / TC9.1.2
HPZ420 Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-1620 0 @ 3.60GHz, 32 Gb Win7 64B
Nvidea Quadro4000 2048MB DDR5
HP EliteBook 8570W Intel(R) Core(TM) I7-3740QM CPU @ 2.70GHz, 16Gb Win7 64B

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The cost of productivity of present employees seems to be a mute point to Siemens...."the old menu being phased out" I agree with ARZinAZ (Mechanical)I dislike the ribbon..

It may be due to the laying of numerous windows programmers who love the ribbon being layed off from the most sucessful software company "Microsoft cuts 'hundreds' in last wave of planned 18,000 layoffs"http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-cuts-hundre....... They are cheap...and of course nobody has had the blue screen of death while running the new NX9 so far in my department everybody has had the blue screen some more then once a week...LOL Windows..

It must be the that windows approach to computing..

Please note...
John R. Baker, is a very good guy....and a nx God..."BUT USE COMMAND FINDER" for all the solutions comment does hurt...make me feel unintelligent or I'm simpleminded, child like...
I have been using NX for over 23 years...

I hope they keep the old menu

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

I've been running UG since V15. 40-70 hours a week.

I like the new Ribbon. For me its a lot easier to personalize.

I upgrade almost every release so I don't lose but a few hours of productivity upon new releases. We are not dependent on other companies upgrade schedules. If we're paying $6000 or so a year to keep support and stay on Maintenance; I'm going to use it.

I'm the odd duck it seems, I like to be on the bleeding edge and crave change.
From what I can tell most CAD/CAM people hate versioning up.


Edited to add.
I've never had a BSOD while running any version of NX. I cannot recall the last BSOD I've had as a matter of fact. I've been on Windows7 for about 4 years.


RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Able to test NX 10.0.1. Liked it a lot , slick minimalistic design at least from User interface and gives a feeling of using a browser. Should have been even better if text below icons were hidden.

Hope some day we can get NX in browser/cloud etc ; )

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Randomdrafter have you checked out OnShape yet? By the same People who originally developed Solidworks?

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

When using NX 10.0 there is no reason why you can't remove the text from below ANY icon. Just open the Customize dialog, select the icon of interest, press MB3 and you'll find all the options that you need to control both the size and the text status for that icon.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

SDETERS , I have checked OnShape, but its a startup,we need NX to same like that some day ; ).

Not sure Siemens 4GD project will be completely in cloud. i guess Enovia V6 is cloud based.


John , i will check what you said, no single button like hide text for whole interface?

I guess the dock on second monitor will be significant benefit,at least when working on assemblies.


Edit - Just tried Icon only option using customize..works fine...

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Why do you want "the cloud" ?
And what is it in the concept of storing you designs on "somebody elses" servers that attracts ?
I do not really see the benefit in renting disk space on the web compared to owning an equivalent server, if somebody else manages that cloud server, i will have to pay for that work too. If one has confidential design data, should one then store that "in the cloud" ?
Or have i misunderstood the Cloud definition ?

4GD requires NX to be run together with Teamcenter, nothing else.
I think Teamcenter can be in the cloud. ( i.e managed by somebody else on somebody else's servers)


Regards,
Tomas

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Toost , we have our own cloud platform.

More interested in connected systems.from Modeling to Analysis/manufacturing etc.....

ps : Check Onshape as SDETERS mentioned for some possibilities.....Enovia 3D Experience is another one.[Not sure everything shown demo will work perfectly,they keep changing names regularly in last few years ; )]

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Toost,

Some software runs on the "cloud" machines while your computer is more of a "browser" that interfaces with the cloud machine. That gives you the ability to exploit the performance of the 'cloud' machine. Processor, RAM, GPU, etc. Your own machine would then become a 'thin client' so to speak. With appropriate security measures, encrypted connections, whatever... I'm sure it's just as reasonably secure as any internet-facing office computer could be.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

The cloud will align our collective synergies into an empowering, mission critical event horizon.

www.nxjournaling.com

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Nice discussion wink

I did'nt read it completely.

I'm working with UG and NX since 1985, since more than 30 Years!
I hate the ribbons, they slow me down.
But I have arranged me and my company and we made a lot of ribbons till now. So it works in the moment.
We also write NX-Training books and there is no smart way to show the user where to find the discribed function.

- "Command Finder" - the way, You did CAD 30 Years ago.
- Showing the Icon - I can't find it on the Screen, where is it?
- Downloading prepared "NX-Ribbons to the NX-Book" - You have to install something and can't start immediately.
- Accessing via MENU - the only possibility, but it's boring always hitting this button.

Greatings from old Germany
Walter

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

love that one cowski, just what i needed on a friday! so sick of buzz words!

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

John,
You mentioned removing the text below the icon on the ribbon bar. Is that only in NX10 and not in NX9? I have not been able to get rid of the text under the icons.

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Jimmyv44,

Menu -> Tools -> Customize

Right click on any icon and there should be options for Ribbon Style, which is where you can remove the text based on your choice. I could be wrong, but I don't believe you can remove the text in NX9 unless you have icons that aren't Large sized.

Tim Flater
NX Designer
NX 9.0.3.4 Win7 Pro x64 SP1
Intel Xeon 2.53 GHz 6GB RAM
NVIDIA Quadro 4000 2GB

RE: NOOOOOO NX9 use ribbon interface

Yes, the ability to remove the text from under LARGE icons was not available NX 9.0. That capability was introduced with NX 10.0.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Engineering Software
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Digital Factory
Cypress, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

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