Full And Reduced Port
Full And Reduced Port
(OP)
When do you use reduced port valves and when do use full port ones? I'm working with a client that has same size of both types of valves, but there is nothing in their specification that explains when to use a reduced or full port. I asked for their preference, but they said it's up to me.
I understand that reduced port is usually used for gas streams and places additional restrictions on the stream (such as pressure or temperature). That's the extent of my knowledge.
Thanks for your anticipated assistance.
I understand that reduced port is usually used for gas streams and places additional restrictions on the stream (such as pressure or temperature). That's the extent of my knowledge.
Thanks for your anticipated assistance.





RE: Full And Reduced Port
Gas or liquid doesn't matter. Calculate the need.
Best to you,
Goober Dave
Haven't see the forum policies? Do so now: Forum Policies
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Good luck,
Latexman
Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Independent events are seldomly independent.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
RE: Full And Reduced Port
I don't know why I just assumed the OP's valves were for control...
Perhaps the OP could tell us.
Best to you,
Goober Dave
Haven't see the forum policies? Do so now: Forum Policies
RE: Full And Reduced Port
DRWeig,
The full port/reduced port discussion never applies to a control valve. Full port and reduced port have very similar control characteristics (i.e., terrible, and quite non-linear), and neither should ever be installed in a throttling application.
bimr,
I have never seen the solids in a flow that would collect in the dam created by a reduced port installed on the horizontal, and plugging really isn't an issue. If you look at flow visualizations, the acceleration happens some distance upstream of the restriction and solids just don't seem to collect there. I have seen evidence of liquids accumulating upstream of a reduced port valve where the line was running vertically down to a 90 and then the valve when the gas flow was really small, but that is the only time and it wasn't much liquid. For lines running liquids, the damning just doesn't happen.
I have to go with BigInch (it really sucks to try to cram a big pig through a reduced port valve) and Latexman (I've seen many instances where supply and demand have had full port valves less expensive than reduced port valves).
I tend to always specify full port trunnion ball valves for any line big enough to pig (i.e., 3-inch and bigger). I've just had too many instances of "non piggable" lines that someone wanted to go back and install pigging facilities. It is painful to remove pigging bars and replace reduced port valves.
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
When is a reduced port ball valve a better choice?
thread408-20283: When is a reduced port ball valve a better choice?
good luck!
-pmover
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Here are some valve references:
http://www.pdhengineer.com/courses/m/M-4001.pdf
http://www.piping-designer.com/Ball_Valve
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Katmar Software - AioFlo Pipe Hydraulics
http://katmarsoftware.com
"An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions"
RE: Full And Reduced Port
That convention is far from universal. Your terminology makes sense, but I've seen more people use the "port" terminology for ball valves than I've seen using the "bore" terminology. The words seem to be used interchangeably by the masses. I've never heard the reduced (or standard) vs. full discussion used for anything except on/off valves.
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
With globe type control valves, where a smaller plug and seat have been used than the normal full sized ones, we would talk of reduced port or restricted trim. Different suppliers use different descriptions - but I can't lay my hands on them right now to see if they are geographically distinct.
The only real answer is to wait for Berenger to come back and tell us what he was actually asking. Like so many times in these forums we find ourselves answering a question that the OP never asked. My signature byline was chosen out of exactly this frustration.
Katmar Software - AioFlo Pipe Hydraulics
http://katmarsoftware.com
"An undefined problem has an infinite number of solutions"
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Independent events are seldomly independent.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Gotcha. I say that as "you can draw any line you want through a single point".
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
I do use a ball valve for control in one application quite frequently. That's for batching liquids into a weigh tank. The ball valve stays 100% open until it gets close to target weight, then it closes to 5-10% open to slow things down until it gets to the "pre-act" weight, where it closes. It works quite well and gives good, tight shut-off (no leakage).
Good luck,
Latexman
Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Bores of Ball Valves:
•Full Port - A full port or more commonly known full bore ball valve has an over-sized ball so that the hole in the ball is the same size as the pipeline resulting in lower friction loss. Flow is unrestricted but the valve is larger and more expensive so this is only used where free flow is required, for example in pipelines which require pigging.
•Reduced Port - In reduced port or more commonly known reduced bore ball valves, flow through the valve is one pipe size smaller than the valve's pipe size resulting in flow area being smaller than pipe.
http://www.petrovalve.com/valves/types/ball.html
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Independent events are seldomly independent.
RE: Full And Reduced Port
Good luck,
Latexman
Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers
RE: Full And Reduced Port
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
"Belief" is the acceptance of an hypotheses in the absence of data.
"Prejudice" is having an opinion not supported by the preponderance of the data.
"Knowledge" is only found through the accumulation and analysis of data.
RE: Full And Reduced Port