Parking Space Requirements
Parking Space Requirements
(OP)
I'm laying out a parking lot for a ballroom/assembly hall facility. The Township code states that one space must be provided for every 3 permanent seats, but that 1 space must be provided for every temporary seat. Can anyone explain why the requirement for temporary seats is so much higher?
Thanks.
Thanks.





RE: Parking Space Requirements
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
http://mmcengineering.tripod.com
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
From the standpoint that so many temporary seats are allowed, I guess it could be planned for. But, is the fire marshall or a building official going to be at each event to count the people and make sure the occupancy is not exceeded? Never seen one yet. Unless someone complains, the FM or BO rarely hear about it. So, the only way is to go with all fixed seating, which the code is obviously encouraging you to do.
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
http://mmcengineering.tripod.com
RE: Parking Space Requirements
What the logic behind that is I'm not sure. In my opinion that seems pretty high for the temporary seats, and the town may end up with a very large empty parking lot most of the time. For example in my area (Dallas/Ft Worth) stadium seating for events like HS football games is around 1:5 parking space per event seat.
I've had luck getting variances to parking requirements with City planning/zoning departments by just discussing it with them. A good resource is to compare with similar jurisdictions in the area and see what their requirements are.
If the property shares parking with adjacent uses, like retail or commercial, you might be able to convince them that the uses will not coincide. (For example a bank use would be 9-5, and an assembly use likely in the evening)
A ballroom/dance hall might be a very unique situation as well. I can imagine a building with very few permanent seats but with great capacity for temporary seats. Perhaps a parking requirement based on square footage of the building. For example restaurant 1 space/100 sq ft, retail 1 space/200 sq ft, or office space 1/300 sq ft, etc. A similar use might be a church, see what the town's parking requirement is for that.
Perhaps taking the building occupancy rating and coming up with some reasonable ratio to parking.
RE: Parking Space Requirements
I only ask because the Township code also states that at minimum, 1 space per two people shall be provided as based on the max occupancy determined by the building and fire code. Since the Twp code directs you back to the NFPA Code and the IBC, I assume that means we need to provide either max occupant load/2 spots or total number of temp seats provided, whichever greater.
Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated!
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
By the way, GoldDredger, appreciate your lot-sharing idea, but we went down that road already and unfortunately the neighboring properties don't want to play ball.
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
This is common practice, even though dangerous to from a fire code and parking code standpoint.
My guess is the township is trying to anticipate cars parking all over the neighborhood (and lack of access for fire trucks) thus the extra parking.
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
Many times everybody drives alone in one car to these events. So 1 parking place per 3 permanent seats sounds like too few parking places. Rather that go through the long process of changing the parking ordinance for permanent seating, this may be a knee jerk reaction on how to solve consistently over-crowded parking lots by changing the temporary seating parking requirement.
Government runs more on emotion than on logic. I discovered the hard way that it is best for private engineers to stay out of those political decisions. You don't want to be labeled as a trouble maker. Rather encourage to Township board to hire an engineer to do a complete review of parking requirements in the District. That way you will get a logical solution.
RE: Parking Space Requirements
You may be able to negotiate a hard surface parking lot for a certain number of spaces (based on the 1:3 seats requirement or max OC of 1:2), then add the overflow parking for the additional seating required for the temporary seats. The client gets the nice grassed areas they can use and the city gets the parking the code requires. Additionally, the grasspave will help reduce any stormwater requirements you may have.
Nate the Great
www.ceieng.com
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
RE: Parking Space Requirements
When I had my repair concrete driveway I had the same issues...I think it is the fact it can be installed together.
I suggest advising with a concrete contractor on your individual matter.
Lenny
RE: Parking Space Requirements
Most parking requirements are part of LOCAL land development ordinances. They are not standard and are often the whim of local politics. To determine the "WHY" of your question, you'll need to dig into the reasons for passing the local ordinance in such a manner. This will usually mean digging through the minutes of boring meetings and finding that the reason is probably because Joe Councilman's brother-in-law's grandmother owns the property around the development and Joe's brother-in-law has pictures from the last Christmas party.