Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
(OP)
Hello,
I will be graduating with my BSME in May of 2013. I plan on beginning my job search long before that, possibly as early as October. I'm going to be completely honest with any prospective employers, mostly because it's the right thing to do, but also due to the fact that a bit of verifiable dishonesty on an application can easily bite back.
In 2004 I was young, dumb and full of...bad ideas, I was convicted of misdemeanor criminal sexual abuse for having sexual relations with my high school sweetheart. I've kept a clean record since.
Years later, after getting my priorities straightened, I found out that I had a passion for machine development and decided to pursue an ME degree. Having never taken so much as an advanced level math class, chemistry or physics in high school and being awful in those subjects, I wound up needing close to 2 years worth of various science prerequisites before even setting foot into a Calc 1 class.
I'll most likely graduate with a 2.8 GPA and (God willing) some intern experience, although it's not much - I've really worked hard to get this far. At this point I desire nothing more than to live a normal, professional life.
Any helpful input would be really appreciated.
I will be graduating with my BSME in May of 2013. I plan on beginning my job search long before that, possibly as early as October. I'm going to be completely honest with any prospective employers, mostly because it's the right thing to do, but also due to the fact that a bit of verifiable dishonesty on an application can easily bite back.
In 2004 I was young, dumb and full of...bad ideas, I was convicted of misdemeanor criminal sexual abuse for having sexual relations with my high school sweetheart. I've kept a clean record since.
Years later, after getting my priorities straightened, I found out that I had a passion for machine development and decided to pursue an ME degree. Having never taken so much as an advanced level math class, chemistry or physics in high school and being awful in those subjects, I wound up needing close to 2 years worth of various science prerequisites before even setting foot into a Calc 1 class.
I'll most likely graduate with a 2.8 GPA and (God willing) some intern experience, although it's not much - I've really worked hard to get this far. At this point I desire nothing more than to live a normal, professional life.
Any helpful input would be really appreciated.





RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Plus, while it's not far off what I got, many folks won't be impressed with a 2.8 GPA.
So, you have 2 things going against you however, that certainly doesn't mean you can't succeed just that it will be harder, which it sounds like you're already used to.
If you're willing/able to be flexible in where you work, what field you work in etc. that will help compensate some.
There are plenty of generic threads about finding first jobs and difficulty so doing - take a look.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Of course I expect the entire landing-a-job-phase to be difficult, but not impossible. I absolutely plan on being flexible, I'm at least aiming to find something that is 'some-what' related to what I've studied. Things like traveling far, working for low pay and in miserable conditions are all things I'm very well accustomed to, at least I'd imagine that it would be a few steps up from all the years of retail and pink-collar work I've.
Right now I'm trying my best to secure an internship and pull my grades up a bit. I'm also considering a minor in Computer Science in hopes that a strong background in that field could help me stand out from other applicants. However, I'd end up pushing my graduation date further back to at least December of 2013 even if I take summers, but on the plus side I might get to ride out the rough economy for a little bit longer. Should I do it?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
If you where just two high school kids making out, I guess quite a few must think, there for the grace of god go I, but also like I say, the USA seems a bit harder on this than just about anywhere else.
Regards
Pat
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Two of my friends have similar deals. However, it was used against them because they did not disclose their youthful problems. They didn't think information would surface because they were such old offenses.
All the best in your efforts!
Pamela K. Quillin, P.E.
Quillin Engineering, LLC
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Reality is that there are likely to be numerous candidates applying for any position at the moment, especially one suitable for a fresh grad.
In this situation fairly blunt tools often get used to trim the number of applicants to be considered more closely. Things like criminal convictions and low GPA are among these rather blunt tools.
If you have say 50 applicants, and one of them has what at face value may appear to be a fairly serious and unpleasant criminal conviction, are you going to spend the time to get to the bottom of it or just use it as an excuse to down select & round file it?
It may be harsh, it may be unfair, but it's probably reality.
(Sorry OP I don't mean to be like one of Job's buddies here.)
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Pamela K. Quillin, P.E.
Quillin Engineering, LLC
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
But if you've got that far, they must see something in you. If you tell them the truth, they might shut you down. But I bet most employers will evaluate it in the totality of the situation and go from there. If they already feel you're sketchy, this will confirm their feeling and you won't get the job. But it's also possible that they understand you've made a mistake, moved on and give you a chance.
As far as getting a P.E., that's another manner.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I have met a lot of lazy's these days that want a job, but don't want to work.
Chris
SolidWorks 11
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I don't know how much of an impact it'll have in mechanical, but I also plan on taking the FE in April, before I graduate.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expungement
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I'd have hoped that if expunging it were an option the OP would have already take care of it so that it's no longer a significant issue.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Chris
SolidWorks 11
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
http://www.livestrong.com/article/201508-how-to-ge...
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
That's probably true but extremely unfortunate for this individual. Obviously I don't know the exact circumstances of the situation but they said it involved their high school sweetheart. To me, that sounds like a senior - freshman/sophmore type of thing. Something that wouldn't make much of a difference 3 years from then but because of the age difference around 18 it meant all the difference in the world. I know a few people in this situation and it's too bad. They aren't sexual predators in any sense...just someone who liked the wrong person in high school.
Anyway, I think bigTom's response is a good one. If you get the experience and maybe in a year or two can get your record clean, you will end up doing OK. The toughest part for you will be building the relationship with individuals first in ways that don't require your record to be brought up. At least then they will know you for your present state and not your past.
Good luck to you....
PE, SE
Eastern United States
"If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death!"
~Code of Hammurabi
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I am a date rape survivor from my teenage years. Catman9000, I hope to God that your "bad ideas" were consensual. That would be the first question I'd ask as an employer, seeing that on your record. If they weren't, you'd best start working with a local rape crisis center, get some training, and show that you truly understand how much hurt can come from that. Be honest and open with prospective employers.
If it was consensual, then be prepared to explain that, but also to be doubted. Men may not care about your record, but most women will. Of course I have no idea how much folks can ask about this, legally, but I'm just letting you know where I come from as a female business owner.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Behave yourself.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I understand that some responders may be a little irked with my past, however wouldn't you (especially the tax burdened independent contractors and business owners) much rather have someone like me spending my time and energy working hard at getting a normal, professional life together verses collecting welfare for the rest of my life? I honestly believe that the best possible way a man in my position can repay his debt to society is by becoming a contributing member of it. Am I wrong?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
30 year old man, 12 year old girl should get you drawn and quartered.
The ages that fall between change the shades of grey.
Date rape should get you drawn and quartered no matter what ages.
I was very confused by misdemeanor felony.
We all have misdemeanors on our record, unless you never got a parking or traffic ticket.
Regards
Pat
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
16 year old girl, 17 year old boy, absolutely consensual with no undue pressure in theory should be OK with just about anyone.
It does not work that way in some states in the USA.
They have statutary rape laws, where if a girl is under the age of consent she cannot give it. If you are of the age of consent and you have sex with such a person you are guilty of statutary rape, ( the common term for sexually mature but underage girls is jailbait.)
B.E.
The good engineer does not need to memorize every formula; he just needs to know where he can find them when he needs them. Old professor
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
The cop asks their ages, and the boy is 19. When asking how old the girl is, he is told she will be 18years old in 15 minutes and 20 seconds.
B.E.
The good engineer does not need to memorize every formula; he just needs to know where he can find them when he needs them. Old professor
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
The price of such an indiscretion can be quite high, but teenagers rarely think about potential consequences in the heat of the moment.
Maui
www.EngineeringMetallurgy.com
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Sadly, many sex offenders try to make it sound like this kind of situation or some other mix up when it isn't. Many of them are master manipulators/con men so it is difficult to have much confidence that any given person with a recorded conviction really was just a victim of circumstance etc.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
For most people, a listing under Megan's Law is sufficient for a veto.
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
After rereading sita's post and your next post, I'd say there is a nagging question about consent. She went out on a limb and exposed her soul. You responded with getting arrested at 17, which in no way implies innocence of rape. Your response put a question in my mind and it's not left.
I would rather have you productive in society but I also want you to be honest with yourself, if you're not. While you are older and wiser than in high school, so are all of the people here and you've asked for their advice.
Pamela K. Quillin, P.E.
Quillin Engineering, LLC
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
My point is that once aware of the conviction, even if they don't nix you at that point, a potential employer may want to verify your story etc. and I was asking how easy that is to do.
If it's hard to verify, some may not bother and assume the worst.
As to your point about being self sufficient etc. I'm sure most of us condone that and encourage you in your endeavors.
Doesn't mean we're universally comfortable working around, or in some cases having our loved ones etc. working around, convicted sex offenders.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Besides my arrest record, court docket, disposition, terms of conviction and my rap sheet, I really have nothing that could corroborate my side of the story. And honestly, how many of you keep your love notes/photos/chatroom sessions from high school anyway?
Just as an aside, I'll also agree that my case is quite indeed an extraordinary one, but it does actually happen to young people across the nation more often than you may be aware of.
I didn't come on here to discuss the past or the complexity/idiocy of the legal system, if you have further questions about punishments: civil, criminal or otherwise concerning sexual offenses - that is something you should take up with a lawyer and not me.
Just as a final reminder; we are talking about what someone in my situation can expect to happen in the days ahead not what I've done in the days behind.
Finally, unlike many of the fellow students I share classes with, I never took an advanced math, a physics or chem class in high school. So when I finally did choose to pursue a BSME while in community college, I had to complete 2 years of required prerequisite algebra classes(math 094, 095, 098, 131, 135), 2 intro level physics(098, 105) and chem classes (100, 103) before I could ever even set foot into a basic engineering class. Despite the best wishes of some folks, I didn't come this far in my studies/life to 'f*** off and die', that's just not part of the plan and I'm too far a resilient of a person to allow that to happen.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
You aren't the only one who's been young. You goofed up as a kid. Who hasn't goofed up as a kid and an adult?
Your days behind are going to be discussed at some point and that may have an impact on your days ahead. You'll need to be able to handle it. You're getting defensive and rude with your responses. You'll die, figuratively, in an interview with experienced people.
People exist who know how to push buttons to crack others, break them down, and make them spill the beans in very short order in interviews. I've been in interviews like that and cracked. I'm not Pollyanna. I've been through crap in life that would bury, literally, most people. I'm not stupid. Yet, I cracked and went where I shouldn't have gone. Graciously deal with folks a bit longer than you have here. They've not been too tough on you, from my position.
Employers are going to push for the facts of the situation. You need to prepare yourself to provide factual answers without getting defensive and rude. The flow of this thread is something you can use to prepare those answers. People at potential employers are going to think just as the people here have. They may even articulate those thoughts in an interview. It's not been a waste for you.
You seem to have some outstanding issues about the whole thing. It may be in your best interest to square those away long before you begin interviewing. Otherwise, one of those high-pressure tactic people will crack you and you'll be spilling the truth before you know what's happened. That won't be pretty because you may learn things about yourself you didn't know and in front of others in the interview. Then what?
The pure truth of life is always best to deal with regardless of how ugly or beautiful it is. Truth does not change.
Reveal what you deem necessary and are comfortable with. But be nice because you did ask for help and revealed some of your situation. Stick around and continue learning. The people here are good and knowledgeable.
Pamela K. Quillin, P.E.
Quillin Engineering, LLC
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
You came here with half a story and asked for advice. If you can't see the flaw in that you won't make a very good engineer.
No one can give good advice without good data to base it on. Some might be very kind and say all is great, but unless we know the details we can't.
If it truly was a misdemeanour between two consenting teenagers it might very well be expunged and or ignored however if it was more serious it most probably will follow you and you need to accept that.
Also, I will within the rules of this site answer how I like in any thread I like. If you don't want comment don't post, and sure as %$^# don't tell me what, when and where I can post. For one it indicates a character flaw that may have lead to your having this problem. ie a lack of respect rights of others.
Regards
Pat
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Regards
Pat
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
This site offers a lot from the technical advice for engineers. Even if you just read through the posts, you can learn a tremendous amount.
Patricia Lougheed
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Your situation is unique and will require a unique solution. Take the good advice here and keep up the hard work. If you are genuine and sincere you will eventually get where you need to be.
Good luck.
PE, SE
Eastern United States
"If a builder builds a house for someone, and does not construct it properly, and the house which he built falls in and kills its owner, then that builder shall be put to death!"
~Code of Hammurabi
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
I was in your same boat when I started my degree pursuit 5 years ago...I was 8 years out of high school, fresh out of the military and ready to start college. But being so far out from my last time in a classroom, I had to start at the bottom, like you mentioned, getting spooled back up on the basics so I wouldn't crash and burn when I got to Calc 1.
That being said, I too didn't have the best GPA, but what I was able to do more recently that a classmate suggested is, if you have any gaps in your curriculum schedule ( say you can't fill your schedule up with a full 12 hours because of a prerequisite ) Try and see if you can fit in re-taking a course you struggled with early on. In my case, the biggest help was Calc 1. As you know, it carries a lot of weight credit-wise, and in my case, I got a C the first time through. About a year ago, the way the classes fell led to me being held up by pre-requisites, so I re-took Calc 1 and let me tell you, it was a great refresher, it was much easier the 2nd time around, and I got a high A. So needless to say, this jump in 5 credit hours from a C to an A helped out my GPA. Not the most time efficient option, but can make the best of a pre-req hold up. I would definitely be in the 2.8-2.9 range if I hadn't done this...I've got it up to and held onto a respectable 3.2 and have 2 classes left this semester.
Good luck
Adam
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Probably the smartest thing you have said in this whole thread. If you are asking engineers for legal advice it may not even be worth what you paid for it. The best advice anyone other than a lawyer can give you is to talk to a lawyer. Look, honesty may not always be the best policy. If you don't have to give the information, don't volunteer it. You said you were 17 when you were arrested. Were you tried as a juvenile? If so your record might be able to be sealed or expunged now that you are over 18. You need a lawyer to help you out with that. However, if you were to apply for a government job, especially one that requires a security clearance, you may have to disclose your criminal past even if the record was sealed.
For what it is worth, in my career I have never had to fill out a job application or disclose my criminal background ahead of time. Usually you send out resumes and if the company is interested in you based on your resume they will bring you in for an interview. At the interview is when I have always filled out the job application and the hiring manager doesn't always have it in hand during the interview. You need to carefully read what the application asks. Most applications I have ever filled out will ask if you have been been convicted of a felony. Unfortunately that still doesn't mean that the company won't do a criminal background check anyway, and with background checks being cheap and easy, more and more companies do them. Although no company is going to run a background check on you unless they are interested in extending you an offer. So all is not lost because the professional job search isn't all about dropping a job application in a slot and hoping for the best. By the time questions about your past come up, the employer will already have had a chance to meet you and form an opinion about whether or not they want to hire you. If you have to disclose your record on the application, it would be best to have an open an honest discussion about it at the interview. The worst part about lying on your application is that many companies will extend a job offer before performing the background check. I have heard stories of people getting fired after already being on the job for several weeks before the background check was performed.
It is also my opinion that it should be illegal for companies to ask if you have ever been arrested. An arrest is not the same as a conviction. In Amercia you are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty. It should also be illegal for them to inquire about your criminal history any further back than say 7 years. If you have managed to keep your nose clean for that long it means that you really have been trying to keep your life on the right track.
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
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RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Coming from a recent grad, I think your best bet is to try and use any networking / connections that you gain in school and even in life. Sexual charges notwithstanding, with a low G.P.A. your best bet is to try and stand out through having a good relationship with someone already employed or having proven yourself to be a good employee.
I would highly recommend exploring your schools intern/co-op program before you graduate.\
Best of Luck,
-Ian
"All models are wrong, but some are usefull" - George E. P. Box
RE: Will a 'bad sounding' criminal conviction from long ago keep me from finding work in the field?
Patricia Lougheed
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