Steel Shop Drawing Quality
Steel Shop Drawing Quality
(OP)
Hi all, I was hoping to get some insight on something.
I have a renovation project, fairly small in size, but with some added complexity. The fee wasn't high enough for the 'big guys' to come out to play (general contractor, or subs) so we are stuck with some lower end contractors, in terms of experience.
Without saying too much, we are removing the wood floor system of a typical mid-west city brick storefront building (1920s probably), and replacing it with steel. We are removing the second level wood floor, and creating a clear story. We are putting steel back to replace the restistance the wood floor was bracing the walls with. The design and drawings went great, it looked like it was going to be a beautiful project. Then we got the steel shop drawings...
Basically they are a direct redraw of my drawings. No piece sheets, no erection type plans. They didn't even bother calling out the grades of steel. We rejected them three times and now the project is severely behind schedule. After a few meetings it became clear the contractor didn't know what industry standards were. We even sent him shops from other jobs, and told him, this is what we expect. But still no luck, he seems content to just copy what ever I give him, and say 'i will build it right in the field'.
We worked with it enough, and we think now at least he gets what the project is. But what standards are out there for shop drawings? Does the AISC have something the contractors are required to follow? I've looked through the 13th edition, and they do have sections on shop drawings, but provide no specific requirements. The project specs were equally toothless. Should my company add more specific language for submittal quality? We kept saying these don't conform to industry standards, but couldn't find anywhere on what those standards are, or why the contractor must follow them.
As always, you thoughts are very appriciated!
I have a renovation project, fairly small in size, but with some added complexity. The fee wasn't high enough for the 'big guys' to come out to play (general contractor, or subs) so we are stuck with some lower end contractors, in terms of experience.
Without saying too much, we are removing the wood floor system of a typical mid-west city brick storefront building (1920s probably), and replacing it with steel. We are removing the second level wood floor, and creating a clear story. We are putting steel back to replace the restistance the wood floor was bracing the walls with. The design and drawings went great, it looked like it was going to be a beautiful project. Then we got the steel shop drawings...
Basically they are a direct redraw of my drawings. No piece sheets, no erection type plans. They didn't even bother calling out the grades of steel. We rejected them three times and now the project is severely behind schedule. After a few meetings it became clear the contractor didn't know what industry standards were. We even sent him shops from other jobs, and told him, this is what we expect. But still no luck, he seems content to just copy what ever I give him, and say 'i will build it right in the field'.
We worked with it enough, and we think now at least he gets what the project is. But what standards are out there for shop drawings? Does the AISC have something the contractors are required to follow? I've looked through the 13th edition, and they do have sections on shop drawings, but provide no specific requirements. The project specs were equally toothless. Should my company add more specific language for submittal quality? We kept saying these don't conform to industry standards, but couldn't find anywhere on what those standards are, or why the contractor must follow them.
As always, you thoughts are very appriciated!






RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
In either case, let your client know that you have significant misgivings with his "hired cousin" and suggest he hire someone else to prevent his investment from becoming a pile of rubble. As an engineer you are responsible for the compliance of the final product. How it gets there can't be your responsibility (ie you have no authority over means and methods).
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
keep the client informed, and get compensated for the extra time you are spending holding the subs hand.
I have had subs that wanted to fabricate beams columns in the field.
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
It may be the amount of work does not warrant full blown shop drawings.
Dik
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
Dik, I see what you are saying, but I feel the complexity of the job requires a little more. We have some complicated connection, which are exposed, and I'd prefer him not to 'field fit' with a torch and a big hammer. We've done plenty of small jobs, where just a E sheet works, but this is more.
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
http://www.FerrellEngineering.com
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
If the connections are complicated, are they suitably detailed on your structural drawings?
Dik
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
Michael.
Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
Dik
RE: Steel Shop Drawing Quality
I did detail 90% of the connections, and just left a few double clips and a shear splice for them to do. All the informations is there in some form, I'm just hoping that their execution is better than their drawings (breath not held).
I think I'll suggest pittguy's tatie to the bosses, and see where it goes for the future.
Thanks for the insight!