Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
(OP)
ASTM A694 F60 is an unlisted material and therefore the use of which is not endorsed by the standard. Therefore there isn't a corresponding P-T rating available for the material.
What about the use of Incoloy 925 bolts. Incoloy 925 UNS N09925
http://www.vegasfastener.com/raw-materials.php
It has a UTS of 175 ksi and YS of 117 ksi vs 125 ksi and 105 ksi respectively for B7 grade bolts (High strength bolts).
Is the use of Incoloy bolts endorsed by ASME B16 standard?
A client spec advocates it's use from a galvanic corrosion consideration for SS flanges. Will this selection be correct from the above consideration that is not endorsed by the B16 flange standards?
What about the use of Incoloy 925 bolts. Incoloy 925 UNS N09925
http://www.vegasfastener.com/raw-materials.php
It has a UTS of 175 ksi and YS of 117 ksi vs 125 ksi and 105 ksi respectively for B7 grade bolts (High strength bolts).
Is the use of Incoloy bolts endorsed by ASME B16 standard?
A client spec advocates it's use from a galvanic corrosion consideration for SS flanges. Will this selection be correct from the above consideration that is not endorsed by the B16 flange standards?





RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Regards,
Mike
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Can you please explain what that would mean?
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
If, for example, you are working to ASME Sec VIII, Div 1 Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code, the answers to your questions are most likely contained within it.
On the other hand, if you are designing a widget that is not to comply with a Code of construction, you have more freedom to make your own decisions.
Regards,
Mike
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
I have raised the question as it is not clear to me from the contents of the standard on the subject point.
The widget that I know of is one on the PC desktop. I am not trying to make one of them for sure.
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
"Sharing knowledge is the way to immortality"
His Holiness the Dalai Lama.
http://waterhammer.hopout.com.au/
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
A caution: 1) Both the flange and bolting materials need to have allowables specified by the Code you are working to. Your proposed materials may or may not. If not allowed by Code case or interpretation, you will need to find alternates.
Regards,
Mike
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Surpriosing how many specifications refer to ASME B16.5 or16.47 and then call up materials that cannot effect the flange design to meet the operating and test criteria.
"Sharing knowledge is the way to immortality"
His Holiness the Dalai Lama.
http://waterhammer.hopout.com.au/
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Yes a seperate flange calculation has be done when an unlisted material is to be used. It becomes all the more difficult when there isn't an allowable stress available for the unlisted material.
I wonder why is ASTM A694 forged steel is an unlisted material for B16.5, B16.47 and B31.3, whereas it is a listed material in B31.4 and B31.8. A flange P-T rating that is the same as for A105 is given in MSS SP 44. MSS and ASME standards are referenced from each other but not specifically the MSS SP 44 in B16.5.
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
You got that right:)
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
It goes to show that engineers need access to these standards but how many companies invest in them, let alone allowing the time to engineers to study them?
You cannot rely upon manufacturers/suppliers. You cannot rely upon adopted specifications where someone in ignorance has changed the bolting material to save costs.
ASME B16.5 2003 is 234 pages long so is not a picnic understanding.
You could invest in this software to design your flange connections http://www.paulin.com/AxiPRO.aspx
"Sharing knowledge is the way to immortality"
His Holiness the Dalai Lama.
http://waterhammer.hopout.com.au/
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
See, first, Notes 8 & 9 of Tables 5 thru 15, see the notes for Figs 1 thru 7 and see also 6.4.4.
The above assumes the flange otherwise complies.
Regards,
Mike
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
6.4.4 Other welding end preparations furnished by
agreement between purchaser and manufacturer do not
invalidate compliance with this Standard.
Does the above allow having a shorter hub length (dim Y, fig 5 through 15)? If so, how much shorter is acceptable.
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Regards,
Mike
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
A flange design check was made using the ASME Sec VIII Div 1 App. 2 for the changed hub length. The flange design failed for longitudinal stress at hub small end. Even the standard flange was failing for this calculation. A standard flange does not need to be qualified by a calculation.
Eventually the TDW fitting was accepted by the owner company based on that TDW fittings have been used without problems.
RE: Use of unlisted materials in ASME B16.5 B16.47
Interesting that though a thing may not satisfy a calculation regarded as generally aplicable, it still works. Maybe tells more about the limitations of some of our calculations than anything else.
Regards,
Mike