Aspiring suspension buff
Aspiring suspension buff
(OP)
Hello, this is my first time on a forum like this. I have a few questions an a little history. I have a background in automotive repair which is what lead me to want to be an engineer. I find suspensions so fascinating and I love watching them in action. I'm starting my physics education and calculus to transfer into and engineering program hopefully soon. With that being said I was wondering if anyone could point me in a direction of good suspension books that will help me get more excited about physics and relate more of it to automotive so that I understand te numbers better.
I have a 2wd pick up truck that I kind of want to make into my own little engineering project by designing an off road long travel or mid travel front suspension and also to design a cantilever rear shock set up. Can you help point me in the right direction? Thank you!
Also are there any clubs I should be joining during my studies?
I have a 2wd pick up truck that I kind of want to make into my own little engineering project by designing an off road long travel or mid travel front suspension and also to design a cantilever rear shock set up. Can you help point me in the right direction? Thank you!
Also are there any clubs I should be joining during my studies?





RE: Aspiring suspension buff
there is a list of books in the faq for this forum. i think most suspension engineers have several books but most have rcvd by milliken.
long travel suspensions tend to be dominated by practical effects rather than theoretical niceties.
Cheers
Greg Locock
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RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
Vehicle suspensions are definitely a fun field. While you're in school, you should get involved with Formula SAE if you want to learn a lot about complicated suspensions. Baja SAE also does off road suspension, but I'm biased toward FSAE.
What school are you attending?
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
I've seen some lifted 4x4 trucks in which the front panhard rod and steering rod are inclined at a rather severe angle with the vehicle at nominal ride height, which will make the axle kick sideways enormously when going over a bump and will cause a jacking effect when cornering one way and a pulling-down effect when cornering the other way. Every suspension geometry book that talks about beam axles will tell you to keep a panhard rod as horizontal as you can within the range of normal suspension movement. It's rather apparent that the 4x4 truck enthusiasts don't seem to care much about road manners.
This is what's meant by "practical considerations". The ideals of camber movement and roll center largely go out the window to accommodate the way it has to be for it to fit in the vehicle.
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
Regards
Pat
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RE: Aspiring suspension buff
If you were to hypothetically make a leaf spring soft enough to allow this much up and down motion then it would have to be soft laterally and in torsion to allow the axle to move around, thus giving about as much guidance to the axle as a piece of cooked spaghetti.
Some desert race trucks are using independent suspension, but they are custom-designed, generally with lower control arms as long as possible (the chassis-side pivot point is essentially at the centerline of the vehicle). Some use Ford Twin-I-Beam, which has the pivot all the way on the other side, and even then has excessive camber change with vertical suspension movement away from nominal ride height.
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
Regards
Pat
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RE: Aspiring suspension buff
CSU Long Beach has a team for both Formula and Baja. I have competed against their Formula team.
These projects will help gain you practical experience and great job opportunities that would be impossible to achieve without SAE on your resume.
I'm biased toward Formula as I feel there is more engineering involved, but to each his own.
http://www.csulbsae.org/index.html
Ryan
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
I have seen the move from leafs to coilovers and linked suspensions in crawling and even in prerunning with really long beams pivoting from under the cab to get the most travel but I also know that one of the most popular modifications in prerunning is to just get leafs made by a company called Deaver. People are getting anywhere from 16-18" of suspension travel in the rear of there trucks. Using a cantilever shock set up(which is what I want to figure out how to calculate length and size of the cam and push rods) there getting away with having the whole bed clear for use as a truck.
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
So you tend to end up with a suspension which is dominated more by the practical considerations of not breaking things, typically by overarticulation, than theoretical niceties like bump steer curves.
That's not to say they aren't worth analysing, just that those of us who need to think about 1-2mm errors in hardpoints tend to think in a different way.
Cheers
Greg Locock
New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
How do you design something like a cantilever shock set up? How would you go about knowing the length of the sides of the cam(fulcrum?)? Or rod lengths for it? Also I can imagine that a shock ratio of 1:1 would be awesome but what is A standard when working with rear leaf springs for trucks?
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
The maths involve is about grade 3.
The physics is about grade 7 or 8 or wherever your schools do levers and mechanical advantage
Regards
Pat
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RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
Regards
Pat
See FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on use of eng-tips by professional engineers &
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for site rules
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
RE: Aspiring suspension buff
Lot less power in a mini-baja, think they're given a 10 hP lawn mower engine. FSAE start IIRC w/ a 660 cc motorcycle engine.
Fred Puhn, How to make your car handle is good general reading, graphical problem solving. Most examples were autocrossers, street racers or track cars. Probably <$10 used on abesbooks or amazon. A good gateway drug.
I haven't done more than glance and Miliken & Miliken (father & son). I've seen it used in a 400/500 course at University at buffalo. I sat in on the first class, prof. spent half of it discussing tire/grip relationships, i had the impression he could go on for a couple more.