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IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

(OP)
thread507-184821: ASCE 7 - What is the definition of "area"

I am looking at an existing building that is having some changes made along with a small, new addition (seismically isolated).  It is a Mercantile area and has an occupancy of 1350 or so.  I'm trying to decided if I can justify Building Cat II or if I need to go III.  The provision about 300 people congregating in one area is what I am concerned about. I found this older thread helpful, but I really don't have separate rooms - it's a large open grocery store.  Any opinions?  I can't say a grocery store is really public assembly in the way that a church or auditorium would be.

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

It is over 300 - done deal.

People dive out of parking lots into stores just like this during a thunderstorm.

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

(OP)
I guess my hang up is that CAT III states, "whose primary occupancy is public assembly...".  It isn't classified as Assembly (group A), but as a Mercantile (group M).   

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

Agreed - still 300 people and they will be "assembling" in it during  a good t-storm -

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

(OP)
Mike, I appreciate your practical opinion.  But the more I look at it, the more I'm comfortable with CAT II.  Reasons being:
1.  It says PRIMARY occupancy is public assembly.  I think a grocery sore is primarily mercantile.
2.  People need 5 sf of space in an area of assembly for standing room only.  If that is the case, a 40'x40' building would permit 300 people to stand with 5 sf of space during a thunderstorm and thus be CAT III.  So are all buildings over 40'x40' cat III?  

Thanks again.   

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

For both IBC 2009 and IBC 2012, the Cat III language reads:
Buildings and other structures whose primary occupancy is public assembly with an occupant load greater than 300.
...Variety of other definitions- mostly education related.
Any other occupancy with an occupant load greater than 5,000.

Assembly occupancy would be one of the Group A occupancies.  A grocery store would fall into Group M - Mercantile.  That would carry the 5,000 person limit in my opinion.

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

STR -

Stand before a judge and jury and explain your thoughts -  while I don't completely disagree with you - I still do!!

300 is 300 whether they are assembling or playing cards or whatever 300 people do when they are ALL together.  And God knows what they might be doing!!

RE: IBC Cat II or III with occupancy >300

Although primary occupancy is the key in deciding the building category classification, storage of hazardous materials also needs to be considered.
Per IBC 2006,  Section 309.1 - Mercantile occupancies shall include department stores, markets, retail or wholesale stores etc. However, there is a restriction on the quantity of hazardous materials that can be stored to qualify for mercantile occupancy.
Table 414.2.5(1)
  

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