Machine Re-Location Help
Machine Re-Location Help
(OP)
Hello,
I'm new to the forum, so sorry if I've posted this in the wrong section! I'm a mid 20's lad due to oversee some machine re-locations from Central Europe (Czech Republic) to the UK. I'm just wondering a few things.
1) If the 3 phase machine in it's current location is running at a supply of 380v, would it have a negative impact running it at 400v+ in the UK?
2) Is there any other UK/Europe discrepancies I should be keeping an eye out for? The machine uses a 3 phase supply, pneumatic and hydraulic systems.
3) I've covered alot of questions for the maintenance manager like can I see all techical manuals, is there a planned maintenance schedule, any current service contracts etc. I'm trying to cover every aspect though, so any suggestion for questions to ask would be very helpfull! (I've also asked for a critical spares list, any previous breakdowns, things like that)
Finally, one of the points brought up in the board meeting was that we're going to avoid shipping machines during Jan/Feb due to potential freezing issues. Is this a good idea? Anyone had bad experiences shipping during the freeze periods?
As I said, ANY help is appreciated because this is my first trip away with work and I don't want to miss anything out.
Thanks in advance.
I'm new to the forum, so sorry if I've posted this in the wrong section! I'm a mid 20's lad due to oversee some machine re-locations from Central Europe (Czech Republic) to the UK. I'm just wondering a few things.
1) If the 3 phase machine in it's current location is running at a supply of 380v, would it have a negative impact running it at 400v+ in the UK?
2) Is there any other UK/Europe discrepancies I should be keeping an eye out for? The machine uses a 3 phase supply, pneumatic and hydraulic systems.
3) I've covered alot of questions for the maintenance manager like can I see all techical manuals, is there a planned maintenance schedule, any current service contracts etc. I'm trying to cover every aspect though, so any suggestion for questions to ask would be very helpfull! (I've also asked for a critical spares list, any previous breakdowns, things like that)
Finally, one of the points brought up in the board meeting was that we're going to avoid shipping machines during Jan/Feb due to potential freezing issues. Is this a good idea? Anyone had bad experiences shipping during the freeze periods?
As I said, ANY help is appreciated because this is my first trip away with work and I don't want to miss anything out.
Thanks in advance.





RE: Machine Re-Location Help
I got told in work that they 'most probably' run at 380. Can anyone confirm or deny this.
Regardless, if it was at 380v, could it impact the machine if ran at 400v?
Thanks
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
The EU is supposed to have harminized the supply voltages. The former 380 V system has been changed to 400 V and the former 440 V system has been changed to 400 V. That also means that 220 -> 230 and 240 ->230 V.
That is the theory. The truth may be so, too. But no guarantee. If you relocate and connect to a medium voltage supply, you can have your transformer set as you wish. If you are connecting to an LV grid, you may have to look at each individual machine.
Gunnar Englund
www.gke.org
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Half full - Half empty? I don't mind. It's what in it that counts.
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
Bill
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"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
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RE: Machine Re-Location Help
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(2B)+(2B)' ?
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
rmw
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
If at all possible, use covered trucks and load and unload them under shelter, or write your contract so sunny days are required.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
Mike's comments bring a few more random thoughts about shipping to mind - of course the shafts need to be blocked before shipping for best chance of not damaging the bearings during shipment. Also oil needs to be drained just before shipping to avoid spilling oil on the windings, then added back in shortly after receipt to avoid corrosion of the bearings.
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(2B)+(2B)' ?
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
Nice to see some manufacturing coming back to the UK - so much has moved to the old Eastern Bloc in recent years.
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If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
To jraef - The machine is in production as we speak. It's literally an unplug and re-locate job. So no idle time.
To electricpete - That the type of answer I was after. Previous experiences. Thank you very much for that!
To ScottyUK - Yes, it's brilliant news that we're getting some equipment back! It seems to be a one way system over the past 10 years or so! IF the machine was designed at a 380v spec, what potential problems could we have when powering up to our strong 400v?
Again, thanks for all your replies! I'm back on site tomorrow so will probably throw up a few more questions!
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
An anecdote that may be useful:
At one time I was working in an area where the utility changed their standard industrial voltage from 480V to 600V. We had a plant with a combination of new 600V motors, 480V motors from the old plant and from time to time, 600V motors from a sister plant.
The main service was a unit containing service entrance and metering, a 600V MCC, a section with an open delta auto-transformer dropping the 600V to 480V and a 480V MCC. We would be called from time to time to change out equipment for one reason or another. Often the feed to the equipment location was the wrong voltage and another set of dry type transformers would be added to re-correct the voltage.
You may consider an open delta auto-transformer installation for either the whole plant or, if most of the motors operate successfully, just for problem motors.
Bill
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"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
Measure the local supply voltage. Some places in the UK it is just over 400V, other places it is closer to 440V. An auto-transformer isn't all that expensive if you need to drop the voltage a bit.
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If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
Wye connected needs three transformers and a fourth, neutral conductor.
Open delta needs two slightly larger transformers and does not require a neutral connection. The open delta auto-transformer may be used on a wye system for three phase loads such as motors which do not need a neutral. The open delta leaves one phase at 277V to ground as a 480V wye system and the other two phases are a little more than 347V to ground. 347V is the normal voltage to ground on a 600 Volt system.
Bill
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"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
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If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!
RE: Machine Re-Location Help
The open delta boost does maintain the solid neutral if one is present. It does shift the neutral a little. The primary current is a little higher on one phase. Ground fault currents on two phases may will be limited by the impedance of the auto-transformer
I have used it many times without incident. If several open delta boosts are used on a gen set, best practice is to "roll" the connections to balance the slightly unequal currents.
The other option is the three transformer wye auto-transformer circuit. This circuit should have a neutral. With an equipment grounding conductor this brings the conductor count to five. I have seen issues with temporary power where the plug connected power cables had only four conductors and the equipment grounding conductor was used as the neutral conductor also.
We had a 30 Amp circuit inadvertently energized with the ends of the wires shorted. As well as taking out the 30 Amp breaker the main feeder breaker also tripped on ground fault. This left the entire work area in the dark during a 24/7 turnaround. The site was down for four hours until the cause of the outage was determined and it was deemed safe to re-energize.
The cause may have been poor coordination but I believe that the connection between the auto-transformer neutral and the equipment ground may have contributed to the tripping of the upstream breaker. With the open delta boost, there is no connection to neutral, even though there may be a neutral in the system.
Bill
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"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter