Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
(OP)
Here is my situation:
I am currently a soldier in the US Army, I am 21, and I want to be a mechanical engineer. My dad was a mechanic, but I have little to no technical experience. I get out of the army in a year, and am planning to go to Oklahoma to pursue my degree. However, I have a few issues:
1) I want to work while I am pursuing my degree, and I want to work in an area which relates to mechanical engineering. Anyone have any recommendations? Where to start, what to pursue? I have looked into being a machinist, but I am unsure whether or not it is a deviation from engineering.
2) Anyone have any information on apprenticeships and/or internships in Oklahoma for trade skill jobs? Is it something I should pursue?
I realize I sound like an idiot here, but I need some advice and a direction in which to go. I don't know whether to just work for a min wage job while in college and get my degree or get a technical skill first or what. I will have money to just pay for college and a house but I need to have a job when I get out, and other than job qualification for an unrelated job which I do in the army, I have very little on my resume. Please, anyone with any helpful tips or hints would be greatly appreciated! And the sooner the better. Thanks so much~
I am currently a soldier in the US Army, I am 21, and I want to be a mechanical engineer. My dad was a mechanic, but I have little to no technical experience. I get out of the army in a year, and am planning to go to Oklahoma to pursue my degree. However, I have a few issues:
1) I want to work while I am pursuing my degree, and I want to work in an area which relates to mechanical engineering. Anyone have any recommendations? Where to start, what to pursue? I have looked into being a machinist, but I am unsure whether or not it is a deviation from engineering.
2) Anyone have any information on apprenticeships and/or internships in Oklahoma for trade skill jobs? Is it something I should pursue?
I realize I sound like an idiot here, but I need some advice and a direction in which to go. I don't know whether to just work for a min wage job while in college and get my degree or get a technical skill first or what. I will have money to just pay for college and a house but I need to have a job when I get out, and other than job qualification for an unrelated job which I do in the army, I have very little on my resume. Please, anyone with any helpful tips or hints would be greatly appreciated! And the sooner the better. Thanks so much~





RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Check out your local community colleges and get with a counselor who can point you in the right direction. Might even give you a few tests to see if you "fit"
I hope your high school years were filled with math, physics, chemistry, etc. and you LIKED it - BECAUSE you will need it.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
w.r.t. Your resume: don't just put "Army, 4 years" on your experience. Surely you had specialized training and a few accomplishments to list, just like any other job. Accentuate anything that shows teamwork.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I suggest that you at least read the Wikipedia article on mechanical engineering to get you a better idea of what you're asking for: h
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RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I would try the CAD Operator route, you get experience in cad software which is mostly what mechanicals do most of the time. Take a few classes as suggested get a part time job doing this as you go to college.
There will be a point in the college career where its best to go full time. Because, the classes build on each other and taking them years apart can be a stretch on the mind when you have to recall previous material.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
A machinist is not a bad idea either. The ability to read prints, and understand manufacturing processes doesn't hurt. I work with quite a few engineers that started out as machinists before persuing their degrees. But I would still lean towards a career in CAD if you can do it.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I suggest to take some tests in math and science. And get a hold of a few 1st year engineering texts and see if you can understand the material after reading a chapter or 2.
This will ensure you don't have a hissy fit when you get in...
Also, no matter what anyone says here, make sure you do what you want. I highly recommend the field; we need more good domestic engineers ....
Good luck
Fe
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
To get the experience of the "old machinist" you would need to work as an apprentice, and at a "job shop".
As stated earlier, that job will give you experience with everything a mechanical engineer creates and "flows down" for fabrication.
You came up with machinist, so are you thinking you would like to be the type of mechanical engineer that designs wiggets, or parts of a larger wigget?
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Just fyi, I know what mechanical engineers do. Have been studying the job field for quite some time. I want to specialize either in working with spacecraft (which I know is aerospace, but I want to work specifically with spacecraft engines if I can) or power research (have not yet decided, btu whatever it is I want to work on designing engines/power supplies). I am pretty sure that the CAD operator will give me a good basis for design... However, has anyone done else done that personally? monkeydog: I would want to do the old type of machinist, but it may take too long for me, as I am trying to get my degree and become an M.E. as soon as possible. I want to design widgets...
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Freshman and sophmore years are no joke in any decent engineering school. There should not be much time for anything else after you take 16-18 credits. If you do any work, look into doing some work for a professor. They often hire undergrads to work 10-15 hours in the lab. Great hands on experience, and an "in" for grad school, scholarships, and grants, and it's something you hop over to work from class easily in most cases.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
oddly enough, i did the same same 35-years ago . . . it took me 7-years to complete my studies (5-years part-time school/full-time work followed by 2-years full-time student and part-time work).
have you taken the college entrance exam (ACT, PSAT)? If not ,get this done forthwith. If so, review the material so you can best direct your academic studies. Check with the university(ies) you plan to attend and obtain the recommendations from the admissions folks. You will likely need your transcripts from high school or otherwise (if you have a GED).
the college entrance exam will give you an idea where your academic weaknesses are and which classes you MAY need to take before enrolling in the university.
obtain the BSME curriculum from the university(ies) you plan to attend so you can plan your studies.
seriously consider CO-OP program, this program allows students to have a work/study schedule whereby the student has alternating semesters of study and work. In some cases, the work/study may be concurrent. the university you plan to attend will have a list of CO-OP employers, etc. to aid you.
another consideration is to directly contact potential employers and investigate if they have a work/study (tuition reimbursement program) program for you to seek. You may be obligated to work for the employer for x-years upon graduation.
now, veterans these days MAY be having difficulties in finding employers that understand the relation between military duties/responsibilities and non-military duties/responsibilities (namely the jargon, etc.). this is because supervisors/managers/etc. do not have any understanding/experience of what veterans dis while in the military. just be aware of this possibility and do not let it impede your objectives.
if you are confident in your abilities and in obtaining your objectives, then consider obtaining student loans, grants, etc. to help you financially. believe me, attending classes on a full-time basis has benefits in that you are actively involved with other students and teachers. your education can be more rewarding and ful-filling. when i attended school on a part-time basis, i was merely a number to teachers and fellow students. i had to seek help from resources in which i little available time for. you also need to live within your means and not spend $ needlessly. i remember living off of $300 bucks/month, with 50% towards housing - not so these days. yes, you will need to pay back that student loan.
a long-winded response, but hope this helps and good luck!
Oh! btw, read the Eng-Tips site policies!!
-pmover
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I agree with B1A62, commit to full time day time school, and get a part time job. If you cant get the lab work setup, I suggest the service industry, like waiter or bartender. We are lucky to live in America where people tip their service people. Its great pay for little time, juts might lose a Friday night from time to time (thats when you make the most money).
I went ewright33's route and became a cad operator while in school. It was helpful, but if I had to do it over, I would have done the trade route, as stated by Fex32. The experience of creating or fixing what a mechanical engineer designs will make you invaluable when you become an ME.
Good Luck
knowledge is power
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
The Army will help you.
Chris
SolidWorks 10 SP4.0
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
31 May 11 14:21
Neither "machinist" nor "mechanic" directly relate to "mechanical engineering." The former fabricates, or refabricates, what a mechanical engineer designs, and the latter fixes it when it breaks.
I'm going to strongly disagree.
I think you're confusing the "theory and practice" of engineering - the drafting and design and calculation part of it certainly - with the "knowledge base" and experience that ADDS with the theoretical to make a full person's experience. To me, too few "engineers" CAN'T "feel" and see the flow of energy and stress and pressures through their part to the integrated whole. They know "book learning", but not operations and the real world of rust, dings, dents, scrapes, bad welds and bad conditions and real world damage and real world installation and repairs and tolerances.
Too many are hiding behind specifications and "what the bureaucrats wrote down in the reference" and are not designing and thinking and building better tools and machines. And, flipping it the other way, far, far too many ARE NOT applying the real world "bloody lessons learned" that are the foundations inside those same specifications and bureaucratic rule books. A very important part of your work as an engineer is to figure out the difference, learn who to consult and when to consult them (Hint: Consult your boss before the part breaks, but don't consult every time the part might break.)
TO me, getting your hands "oily" as an Army machinist, mechanic, tool-repair specialist, repairman, ordnance worker, or even forklift driver or rigger or field engineer digging ditches with a trencher and bulldozer is applicable. Engine mechanic? GT mechanic? Sure. Telephone or radio repair? Instrumentation? Ground-based radar tech? GPS or instrumentation repair?
What's your MOS? What do you do now? What do you like doing? What do you hate doing?
You're not in energy production, but take a message from that phrase "Drill, baby, drill!" "Learn baby, learn!"
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
But I am electrical and know that mechanicals use CAD packages more then electricals. And the classes they take for mechanical CAD are more in depth and go into more different type packages.
Solidworks, use of 3D modeling, etc....as an example of mechanical cad package.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
Motto: KISS
Motivation: Don't ask
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
"has anyone done else done that personally? "
Yes. Got an Aero degree (BS then MS) at U of Washington, and graduated near top of class. With all of that, most of my colleagues (at least the ones who did R+D like I did) came from schools with specific courses in rocket engines. Princeton, Colorado State, USC, a few others. A lot of the newest spacecraft and launch vehicles are using engines designed in the former USSR, they are simply better than what mainstream US/Western aero companies have produced. Find a school, better a prof. (hint: he will likely have a last name that is hard to pronounce), with experience in the design of these engines.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
1) Which is the smarter option, for you engineers who are already in the profession: get a part time job and attend college full time to get my ME degree, or start out working in a tradeskill job related to, or at least partially related to, ME, then go into my ME degree? Which would give me a better foundation as an engineer? I know there are many different facets to engineering, but for now I just want to start at the lower rung, I don't want to get into R&D until I have good experience, because I see that as basically trying to build a house without ever having seen one or built one before (just an example).
2) If it would be better to work in a tradeskill job, what would set me up for working as an ME? In other words, would it be better to start out as an "oily" guy, working with my hands, or working as a CAD operator? Which is more applicable?
3) Has anyone had any experience with Oklahoma? I really want to live in Oklahoma, and I hear that OU has one of the better ME degrees there, but I was wondering if anyone has had personal experience...
Just to clarify: I am fairly certain that my current army MOS will set me up well for anything in engineering. I am in Intel, and I can't really talk about what I do, but it largely deals with managing people and information, getting to know all facets of any project, and basically being an information sponge by knowing what information to gather. However, I am tired of the army and of the job. It has many useful skills, but I don't enjoy it anymore and I truly do not like the military lifestyle anymore (I want to not be deployed, get my degree, and have my freedom back). For that reason, I want to get out. But my current experience, other than working on cars sometimes with my dad and a passion for learning and hard work ethic, is not in any way technical. I am very good at math and science, but I have been out of them for a while. And, as I said, if I am going to do a tradeskill first, I will have to get trained on the job. I am very wiling to do so, but I am unsure a) what professions I can start out at entry level with no experience and b) what the job market for those professions look like.
Thank you everyone so far who has replied! Please keep sending replies, this is all very helpful!
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
In retrospect, I wasn't as far behind the curve as I thought. A co-op (and 5 years in school) would have been an excellent idea. The engineers I've hired from Co-Op programs have all been significantly more useful than the ones that raced through school like I did. Co-Op programs have you working with engineers and under engineers for months at a time, most of the mystery and uncertainty (about the profession, not the work) goes away.
Personally, I think the get-a-mechanic/machinist-job-and-go-to-community-college scenario is really bad advice. From what I see (mostly from friends of my sons), it is the rare individual that can stay focused on an education when they are making $15-25 an hour. I've seen a large number of people start down that road and then in 5-6 years notice that they haven't signed up for a class in 3-4 years and stop calling themselves "students". I've seen a few succeed like the folks who suggested it above, but they've been rare. "Easing" into school by going to community college first has been a path to failure for millions of bright students.
As the Tick noted, ME touches EVERYTHING. My first fluids instructor in graduate school was working on biomedical research so we learned more about shear forces than any of us wanted to know--it is easy to think "what does ME have to do with blood flow in a vein?" but we do. Time spent as a mechanic, or machinist, or plant operator will make you a better engineer. I strongly believe that the time I spent turning valves and wrenches in a nuclear power plant causes me to design better stuff than I would have otherwise. BUT, if you never get the degree then you spend your life as a machinist--nothing wrong with that, but you might have regrets.
If you insist on living in the Tornado Belt, I would suggest writing to the ME department at OU, OSU, and maybe Arkansas (my alma mater) and ask about Co-Op programs and how to get into one. If you get back any "we have emphasized Co-Op" letters then you know you are talking to an idiot (yes, there are many of them with PhD's) who have never worked for a living and probably should be avoided. My youngest son got that advice from UNM and before I could convince him to ignore the advice he lost interest in school and quit. I wanted to kill his advisor.
If you really want to go into aerospace you probably won't end up living in Norman or Stillwater (or Fayetteville) after school, so you might think about a school with access to that industry. University of Alabama, Texas A&M, Univ of Colorado jump to mind.
My oldest son is about to finish 8 years in the Army. He wants to be an ME someday too. So far he has totally ignored all of my advice, but he is claiming that he's going to start a distance learning program this deployment for sure (same thing he said on the last three). I hope you have better focus than he does.
David
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Most of my peers, freshman year, wanted to be physicists, but there are only a handful of jobs waiting at the other end, so Physics 1 was the "weeder" class, and by 3rd quarter, my roommate who started out wanting to be a physicist declared as EngLit.
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RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
If your weak in math and science you will be one of these below standard students.
Most of the problems I saw was that students either wanted to party too much, work too much while in school, or were just lazy.
Ramping up in a community college prior to 4 year college is a stepping stone for some, like me. Its not a knock on anyone, depends on what knowledge and level schooling you had before hand.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I am often asked what a mechanical design engineer does in the telecom industry. My answer is "I'm responsible for everything you can see". Design tasks include everything from sheet metal enclosures, cables, paint, and labels, to PCB layout, LEDs, power distribution, EMI, and thermal management.
The hardware engineers are responsible for managing the electrons flowing thru the product and the software engineers are responsible for designing bugs. The mechanical engineer does everything else.
<tg>
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Here's an example from a school that does weeding in physics, as discussed. Stats from 2008:
SAT Reading% Math% Writing%
700-800 76 100 71
600-699 23 0 28
500-599 1 0 1
I guess one might argue 720 Math SAT is "weak" in a school with lots of 800 Math SATs, making one "below standard."
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RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
There's advantages and disadvantage to the regional campus, but if you're wanting to work outside of school it's probably a big advantage. Also, a lot of the regional campus have night classes for those that are working and trying to get their degree.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Not wishing to start a war, but when I see comments like
"Neither "machinist" nor "mechanic" directly relate to "mechanical engineering." The former fabricates, or refabricates, what a mechanical engineer designs, and the latter fixes it when it breaks."
I am reminded of things that I have seen in my career, maintenance & inspection wise, that lead me to believe the clever folks who design this stuff could benefit from a little "hands on" experience.
I'll cite an example;
A new model aircraft comes on the market, and this particular airplane has an inspection panel under the wing, near where the center section attaches to the outer wing panels. This panel is attached to the wing with approximately 15 100 degree 10-32 counter sunk machine screws, approximately 1/2" long. With one exception. One of the screws is only 3/8" long. If this particular screw is not installed in it's exact proper location, it will bite right into the wing attach lug of the fwd spar. No placard on the proper fastener hole, no annotation in the manuals, nothing but somebody's (misplaced) faith in a sweaty, overworked mechanic noticing the .125" length difference in a fistfull of screws in a plastic cup.
This is a "mechanic trap" of the first magnitude.
Now, somebody was clever enough to recognize the possibility of fouling the attach lug, they did spec a shorter screw, of course, but the knowledge of how things really happen in the field may have prevented an service bulletin rework after manufacture. (Which to the oem's credit, did occur.)
Please don't lecture me about the compromises that "must be made",in the discipline of Engineering, I am well aware of them.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
My experience in the workplace is that there are very few jobs that don't have some sort of Venn Diagram overlap to other jobs.
Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East - http://www.campbellcivil.com
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
ewright33, My USN experience landed me in the bowels of one of their finest guided missle destroyers deep in the boiler and engine rooms. When I got out and hit Uni to pursue my ME degree, I immediately applied for and got an on-campus job in the power house which made power and steam for the campus (heat and absorption A/C). A contact I made while working there with a service engineer for a major power plant equipment OEM ultimately led to a job with that company. It was the only one I was offered in a time when most of those who graduted with me had no offers and ended up in Viet Nam. I have been in or close to that industry ever since (and still am although I work with jet engine technology now).
I would note that when I got out of college the first time that there were lots of aerospace engineers unemployed and driving cabs as we had just a year or so prior put a man on the moon and they were thousands of laid off engineers. I would also note that there are currently plenty of laid off aerospace engineers here in Houston due to the end of the Space Shuttle program. Think twice about that one.
Plenty of work, however in aviation and aviation engine derived power generating equipment - you might say faux rocket science. Gas fired and all green, you know.... Your interest in ME and your background in intellegence would make you an excellent candidate for the regulatory stuff we have to keep up with.
My story was kind of like Pmover's above except I beat him, I took 8 years to get a 5 year degree. However, my pre-graduation work experience (I later got a real Jr. Engineering job after working for a couple of years in the campus power house) was what got me a real job at a time when not having a job meant a ticket to SE Asia.
Some of that work experience was just plain mechanic work on ditch digging equipment, slinging tools, getting dirty and greasy, learning how to cut and weld, sand blast, paint, etc. and it pays off even to this day understanding how things go together and come apart (or not) and what the people who have to do that work have to go through to get it done. Some of it was in a machine shop, not as a machinist, but as an Jr Engineer who dealt with projects and problems associated with the machine lines. Invaluable. Being a hands on engineer is what has me employed today when most men my age are worried about being downsized.
Go for it and good luck. Just study hard and make good grades - hard to do with the program you have in mind. I wish I had done better in that regard, although what helped me offset the not so good grades was the work experience I brought to graduation.
rmw
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I got my second internship in a more traditional manner, through the school job website. The important thing is to keep checking the boards and apply early and prolifically. I usually start applying for summer internships around December.
I agree with rmw, it's tough to design something if you don't know how it would be built. Don't overlook anything just because it's not in the field you want to work in. I get a lot of strange looks at career fairs "...we don't design many airplanes at Cisco"
Don't underestimate the effect of your Army experience; Leadership and Teamwork, employers eat that stuff up.
The story so far:
In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I work for an OEM machinery builder and we are currently searching for designers. All of our applicants have at least a B.S. in mechanical. Many have a masters. Some have multiple degrees in related fields (math, physics, other engineering fields, etc).
90% cannot explain to me what each bit of "5/16-18 UNC" means.
If you have previous or concurrent hands on experience, schooling will help you to understand that experience on a higher level.
Otherwise there will be no context to relate the education to, and it will just be a stream of meaningless numbers.
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Also, you don't need to be a machinist to know this. Engineers are the ones that specify this.
(It does help i guess a bit if you have built your own little things from time to time, but not a necessity)
Fe
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Fe
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Very serious.
Take any of these guys that show up to Mech-Other asking questions out of statics 101. These are the guys showing up looking for work!
(as a complete aside, I've never seen it as "UnC", even if that makes more sense in a (Un)ified (C)ourse kind of way)
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."
"Luck is where preparation meets opportunity"
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Fe
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Are you saying those are very much the exception?
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."
"Luck is where preparation meets opportunity"
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
htt
http://www.sandv.com/home.htm
http://
http://www.powermag.com/gas/
Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."
"Luck is where preparation meets opportunity"
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
I design robots that no guy in the shop could ever dream of doing......
period.
(again, I can't believe we have to say this...)
Fe
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Two thumbs Fe!
Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."
"Luck is where preparation meets opportunity"
RE: Help! Future Engineering Student Lost And Confused
Fe