Welding Procedures
Welding Procedures
(OP)
Can a contractor use another contractors weld prodcedure?
What if they get permission from the local governing body?
What if they get permission from the local governing body?
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RE: Welding Procedures
That should not happen. Or has it already?
RE: Welding Procedures
RE: Welding Procedures
http://www.FerrellEngineering.com
RE: Welding Procedures
RE: Welding Procedures
The part that I find "funny" is that you can "buy" the license from AWS to use one of their Standard WPSs so you don't have to qualify the WPS by testing. The user merely demonstrates the SWPS can be implemented by performing what is essentially a welder qualification test.
If it is OK to use someone else's WPS, that is AWS' SWPS, for a price, why isn't it acceptable to use a WPS that was qualified by a different contractor? OK, add the provision that the user must accept all responsibility for it just as you would if you purchased the license from AWS.
If it is acceptable for AWS to sell a welding procedure specification and it is acceptable to either an AWS structural welding code or ASME, why isn't it acceptable for anyone to sell a WPS if it is properly backed up with a PQR? There is a real ethical problem with this practice.
I've been involved with projects where the contractors utilized the AWS SWPSs and I was not impressed by the documentation or the results. Based on my experience, I usually will not permit the use of AWS SWPS on my projects. The reasoning is pretty simple; the welding documentation submitted by the contractor is my first indication that the contractor has someone on staff or someone that can be called upon for welding expertise. If the contractor purchases a SWPS, it is a strong indication the contractor doesn't have the where-with-all or technical expertise to handle anything other than minor welding. On projects that involve a level of expertise above that of a backyard welder, I expect the contractor to provide me with WPS that are either prequalified or qualified by testing. If the documentation is correct, the contractor has provided me with a level of confidence that they understand the technology and the code requirements. If the documentation is not correct I then know that the contractor does not have the level of expertise needed and bears closer monitoring.
Best regards - Al
RE: Welding Procedures
I strongly concur.
RE: Welding Procedures
http://www.FerrellEngineering.com
RE: Welding Procedures
You do in fact make some very viable points. However, you must look at what SWPSs entail. They are only used for very common materials, such as carbon steel and some stainless steels, and very common welding processes, such as SMAW. Welding of these materials has been done since the dawn of time obviously.
The problem I see with selling or using someone else's WPSs is in fact the experience that may not go along with them. I would say this may be acceptable for materials which there are currently existing SWPSs available for, but what about materials that aren't? I would be strongly opposed to someone selling a WPS for low-alloy steel to a fabricator that has no experience welding it, and further, an SWPS is not available. To me, that is one of the main reasons why codes state that the manufacturer shall be responsible for their own WPSs.
RE: Welding Procedures
You make a valid point that the base metals covered by the AWS SWPSs have a long history of successful use. The same can be said of the prequalified WPSs permitted by AWS D1.1 and AWS D1.6.
There are valuable lessons to be learned when a company puts down cold hard cash to weld a test coupon and subject it to the regiment of tests required by the codes. Those lessons are not learned when the WPS is purchased.
Best regards - Al
RE: Welding Procedures
Unfortunately, the author(s) of those procedures have not assured that their procedures are actualy implemented in production. As a result, added supplier surveillance and increased trouble shooting has been required to rectify welding errors. Because the eyes of the consultants or the AWS are not present during production, essentially, the "the blind are leading the blind."
RE: Welding Procedures
gtaw, I completely agree. Point taken.
RE: Welding Procedures
RE: Welding Procedures
AWS pre-qualified WPSs at least require demonstration of a nominal level of welding knowledge. But who is filling these in, and who is reviewing them? Partly rhetorical questions: the answer to both is 'not a welding engineer/technologist'.
I am veering into another topic here, but (i) too many QA/QC managers feel they are qualified because they have observed a lot of welding; and (ii) fabricators are extremely averse to spending even a little money on welding engineering expertise (and think they can 'handle' it).
RE: Welding Procedures