×
INTELLIGENT WORK FORUMS
FOR ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!
  • Students Click Here

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Jobs

Proper specification of a Plate
5

Proper specification of a Plate

Proper specification of a Plate

(OP)
We are having an internal debate about how to "correctly" specify a steel plate on drawings.  We have conflicting procedures based on fabricating, design, or drafting backgrounds.

width(in) x thickness (in) x length (ft-in)

short dim(in) x thickness (in) x long dim(ft-in)

thickness (in) x width (in) x long dim (in)

thickness (in) x width (in) x long dim (ft-in)

Does anyone have a definitive reference?

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I was taught to use this by my senior engineers, don't know if this has a reference somewhere.
thickness (in) x width (in) x long dim (ft-in)

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I've also been taught as slickdeals.  There are no units on the thickness and width, but there are on the length.

PL 1/2 x 12 x 1'-0"

PL 1 x 4 x 0'-8"

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I do the same as slickdeals and nutte

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

Excellent document steele6707. Reinforces what I was taught.

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I, also, was taught the same way as Nutte and slickdeals. That would be an excellent name for a porno, btw...

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

Yep

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

(OP)
Interesting.  While the way that is agreed upon by everyon here is in fact the way that I have seen it done in other design firms, I personally came up through a fabricator and was adamantly taught short(in)x thickness (in)x long (ft-in).  Consquently, I am looking at a drafting manual from the 80's which follows this same format as well.  Perhaps I am simply outdated?

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

(OP)
Growing up in the 80-90's I didn't think I would be classified as such so soon.  I guess you only know what you have learned...and I learned something new today!  Thanks for the documents, very good material.

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

You'll see flat bar called out VA's way:  FL (or Bar or something similar) 3 x 1/2 x 0'-8", even in AISC's 2002 Detailing for Steel Construction.  So to do it right, you need to know if the piece is cut from plate stock, or if it's coming from bar stock.  This is also on JAE's attachment, with the old way and new way being the same.

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I agree with nutte's comment - and, more important, with the reasaon why their are two legitiamte ways to call out plate.

If it is being cut from a larger plate, you need to put the thickness first.   That is what will be pulled from the rack and moved to the cutting and layout table: a 1/2 thick "x by y"  sheet of plate steel that will become a smaller piece.  Same for metric: 12 mm thick, or 16 mm or whatever defines the source.

If it is being cut from a long flat bar, then the width and thickness matter, but the final length are less important.  So it will be cut from a 3 x 1/2 flat bar 20 feet long, or a 4 x 1/4 flat bar 20 feet long, or a 1 x 1/4 flat bar leftover 12 feet long.  Regardless, all will be cut into 18 long pieces.  Or into 3 inch long pieces.     

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

I can't see how calling it up the wrong way could lead to errors.  I also don't see why the flats are called up differently than plates.  Why not T x W x L for both?

BA

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

And plate grade.

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

When in doubt, go to AISC and Charlie Carter... Can you believe there is a 3 page article on the subject? Well, there was a pretty long post on this subject and here I am.

Now, getting your junior engineers and CAD people to properly call out things is another matter. I had to resort to a beer tax when a PE would mess up simple steel call outs he would had to donate a buck to our company beer fund.... I think it just ended up that I was getting more free beer and still frustrated.

Charlie says:
"Actually, it should be highlighted
that there is very little, if any, structural
difference between flat bars and
plates. Consequently, plate is becoming
a universally applied term today and a
PL ½ x 4½ x 1'-3", for example, might
be fabricated from plate or bar stock."

Free PDF, just saved it to my library.

If this link doesn't work just do a search at AISC:

www.aisc.org/bookstore/itemRedirector.aspx?id=12882

HTH,
Andrew Kester, PE
Florida

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

The most common practice in Europe ( applied by German, French,Italian and other countries' steel mills ) is :

- Plates ( mm ) thickness x width x length
- Flat bars ( mm ) width x thickness x length  

In design and drafting width=short dim, length= long dim

That's in metric.

Once in a while you may see some variations, but ..hey you can always understand which dimension is which.
 

RE: Proper specification of a Plate

Flat bar was called off that way because it was a rolled shape, it is in the style of other rolled shape names except that thickness is used in lieu of weight. If you could, you always used flat bar because there was less work in the shop, one cut to use the bar instead of three to use the plate.

Michael.
Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members!


Resources