Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
(OP)
My current resume is ordered starting from most recent experience back to about 12 years ago. I've been unemployed for 10 months and according to the government, I am considered 'long-term' unemployed. I'd like to include my most recent work to diffuse any misconception by potential employers that I am hopelessly unemployable and that I've been sitting around for a year watching The Jerry Springer Show and Wyotech commercials.
The problem is that in addition to free-lance expert witness cases, my most recent work includes modeling gigs and volunteer or unpaid intern work, not all of which is specifically related to my profession. Do I lead with the most recent although it includes an on-line instructional yoga video, general secretarial duties for an industrial arts school and teaching dance to the blind? Do I find elements of those unpaid jobs that may be of some use, like learning new software and how to weld? Do I include modeling as a background figure in some local architectural photography, but not the print photos portraying a patient recently diagnosed with an incurable disease? Do I put that stuff in a cover letter which in all likelihood go straight into the garbage and not get read?
My gut reaction before was not to include any of the modeling or volunteer work, but I'd at least like to bring it up as a demonstration of my persistence, breadth of knowledge and experience, and toughness. A factor that generally comes up at interview in expert witness work is if you can take the heat of cross-examination in deposition or in the courtroom. What I've experienced as a paid expert does not come close to the grilling I've taken as a volunteer expert witness by Stanford law students in a mock trial competition. As an expert witness you must remain unfazed by character assassination by the opposing counsel and come back unaffected. I'd like to demonstrate that I have persisted in auditioning for performance arts and modeling although I have had to endure rejection after rejection, being told by various agencies that I am too fat, too thin, too tall, 2" too short, too old, not old-looking enough and not 'it'. Yet I have persisted and have been surprisingly successful at it.
The problem is that in addition to free-lance expert witness cases, my most recent work includes modeling gigs and volunteer or unpaid intern work, not all of which is specifically related to my profession. Do I lead with the most recent although it includes an on-line instructional yoga video, general secretarial duties for an industrial arts school and teaching dance to the blind? Do I find elements of those unpaid jobs that may be of some use, like learning new software and how to weld? Do I include modeling as a background figure in some local architectural photography, but not the print photos portraying a patient recently diagnosed with an incurable disease? Do I put that stuff in a cover letter which in all likelihood go straight into the garbage and not get read?
My gut reaction before was not to include any of the modeling or volunteer work, but I'd at least like to bring it up as a demonstration of my persistence, breadth of knowledge and experience, and toughness. A factor that generally comes up at interview in expert witness work is if you can take the heat of cross-examination in deposition or in the courtroom. What I've experienced as a paid expert does not come close to the grilling I've taken as a volunteer expert witness by Stanford law students in a mock trial competition. As an expert witness you must remain unfazed by character assassination by the opposing counsel and come back unaffected. I'd like to demonstrate that I have persisted in auditioning for performance arts and modeling although I have had to endure rejection after rejection, being told by various agencies that I am too fat, too thin, too tall, 2" too short, too old, not old-looking enough and not 'it'. Yet I have persisted and have been surprisingly successful at it.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"





RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
So if you're looking for a job as a yoga instructor or a model, that stuff seems relevant. If you're looking for an engineering job it is probably "personal development".
David
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
The main thing is to come across as positive. I like to see that people who are not currently working in their primary or chosen career field are at least doing SOMETHING while searching.
Good luck in your search!
-Tony Staples
www.tscombustion.com
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
I would mention the experience in the past 10 months, at least in passing. I know that modeling and teaching dance, as examples, highly involve the use of people skills, a very valuable tool in marketing, an applicable and useful skill in any profession.
As you have surmised, there are skills other than engineering employers need, and marketing experience is one of them. Don't ignore them.
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
Motto: KISS
Motivation: Don't ask
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Getting the interview is often a big part of the battle. Once there you can dazzle them with your technical skills.
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
I always have an extra section at the very end of my resume where I list things like this. For instance I used to be a ski instructor, I put that in my extra-curricular section and it has come up in a lot of interviews as a kind of ice breaker. I have also referenced it in cover letters to underline communication skills. Although I would always start my resume with my actual job related experience I think that your other experiences deserve credit also.
You may also consider a skill based resume. But they have their pros and cons also.
Good luck!
K
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East - http://www.campbellcivil.com
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
10 Aug 10 13:45
"Just a thought. Why not add another heading to the resume called 'other experience' or something like that. That way it is there but it does not distract from the main points on your experience. "
I don't follow any of the standard resume guidelines (nbr of pages, format, etc.) but added 3 comparable paragraphs to my resume:
COMPUTER SKILLS
* Software: MicroStation, AutoCAD R10, R12, R14, AutoCAD 2002, AutoCAD 2007 (tested, designed, and de-bugged AutoCAD and MicroStation add-on 3D CAD package systems); Design CAD 3D, IntelliCAD; HyperSnap (Beta testing). CADWorx (Eqpt and Steel, Piping.)
* Microsoft Word, Excel, Lotus, MS Access, PowerPoint and Outlook; MSProject (PERT Charts, resources, milestones, work breakdown structures, task analysis (Ver 4.0), Primavera (interface development only).
PERSONAL SKILLS
Ornamental Iron: Casting, Pattern and mold-making, MIG/TIG welding, machining, plasma and torch cutting, steel fitting and erection, railing design, installation. Finish carpentry and stair fabrication, electrical and HVAC installation, interior, concrete and plumbing.
SELECTED PUBLICATIONS & PRESENTATIONS
(list of papers followed)
You may to consider some format like that. As I mentioned, my four page doc absolutely does not meet the "max of two pages" criteria commonly quoted, but it got me hired.
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Just put it in a section marked " other experience" like Racookpe said.
In that section when I had to look for a job, I used to add stuff like that, I was a licenced pilot, a licenced sailing instructor, a youth counselor, and any continuing education certs I had recently taken, plus any volunteer work I had done. You know the drill put anything in there you think will help. If its not helpful leave it out, or bury it in a summary at the very back of the resume.
B.E.
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
I would definitely mention volunteer work in the main body of the resume. I wouldn't include pictures as you had mentioned but I might be interested in the online yoga videos. Got a link?
Best of luck.
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
I ended up creating a new section on a separate page, more like an addendum to my resume, titled Interim Work and References. I listed four different short-term or temporary assignments, two of which are directly related to my field of construction defect forensics and expert witness testimony and included personal references for each of those. The job as a volunteer intern at an industrial arts school I described as being outside of my work history and experience but that it afforded an opportunity to adapt my skill set to new situations. I also have a very good personal reference associated with this job.
The modeling/acting stuff was a bit more difficult. I feel I had to put the Onglyza work in because I have run into my own image staring back at me from animated banner ads currently running on numerous, unrelated websites. These are high profile sites like Yahoo Answers, WebMD, AllRecipes, medicineonline, medterms and diabetesdaily. I figure at some point an interviewer might see it as well, so I thought I should bring it up first sort of matter-of-fact. The other work has not yet been published yet, so I didn't mention it. If asked about why I would include the modeling and acting work, my reasoning beyond the likelihood of seeing my image is that a skill any expert must have is to be able to present evidence in court and appear authoritative and trustworthy. Acting skills come in handy for that.
I did include small photos for each of the assignments and formatted the page differently from the main body of my resume. It's more like a promotional brochure than curriculum vitae look.
sam74, the yoga video has not yet been released pending additional funding I guess. This is why it's so important to get your money up front for stuff like this. I've emailed the art director and producer and have not gotten a single response. But if you go to any medical website and look up things related to diabetes, you will likely see my banner ad that starts with me in a meditation pose and changes over to a prayer pose. I attached the image that is seen the longest, so look for that.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
It's a little arrogant to assume that _you_ know what skills are important to a potential employer.
Worse, the separation of your new adventures might send a message you don't intend; that they're somehow less important or less deserving of respect than your technical skills.
I'd put the new stuff into strict chronological order with the older stuff, because functional or unusual resume formats arouse instant suspicion among HR weenies. I wouldn't even make it visually distinct.
I would try to work in something about how it _all_ enhances you as a person. ... not that there was any room for improvement, of course.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Sorry Mike. That doesn't work for me. I'll run my revised resume by a couple of HR weenies that I know and they hate it, I'll know I'm on the right track.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
They're not going to recognize you from the ad. If they do, they'll just have this vague idea that they've seen you before and assume that you look like someone they have met before.
But...it sounds like you really want to tell people you've been modeling and acting, and are looking for excuses to do so. In which case, go for it. Free country, etc.
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
I also asked if I should skip the Hobbies and Interests altogether and drop the personal references associated with each and she said no. She would include it since my image is out there. It's not that I want to mention either front desk secretarial or modeling work. If I did, I'd put it in strict chronological order as MikeHalloran suggests. But I certainly didn't want to put it ahead of employment in my field. If it weren't for the references, I'd drop both. As far as being recognized, for individuals who have not seen me on a regular basis, I'd say I'm over concerned. But two people who are within the very small community of construction defect experts, the community in which I am seeking employment, have contacted me to ask about it.
I suppose I have a bit of an ulterior motive in that if I can do a modeling assignment and make $100/hr and be free to take time off from a job to do that, I'd at least like to be able to have that choice. But I have to get to the point of having a full time job with enough accrued vacation time. And if the opportunity presents itself, I can at least point to a resume that mentions the prior work so no one should be surprised.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"
RE: Where to put most recent, but unrelated experience
Leave out all the unrelated stuff. Toastmasters ref was always a plus. Service experience summary is fine, too.