×
INTELLIGENT WORK FORUMS
FOR ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!
  • Students Click Here

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Jobs

Code Accreditation for Mills

Code Accreditation for Mills

Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
I am trying to find an ASME publication describing the process by which a material manufacturer is granted and retains approval to manufacture and apply the required marking to product forms such plate, tubing, pipe, flanges, bolting, etc.

My company is involved in a paperwork snarl of epic proportion in attempting to certify some of our little piece-of-crap, but ASME stamped, air coolers to a shipboard standard. The agency involved classifies these coolers in such a way that design review is not required, but materials to approved specs from approved manufaturers are required.

These coolers normally are built from stock ASME materials. We are trying to be granted a deviation by proving that the ASME accreditition process is equivalent to the process used by the involved agency, and together with MTR's to persuade involved agency to accept these materials.

We cannot of course just purchase from the approved manufacturers unless the material in question is certifed to ASME as well as the ship standards, which I doubt it.

Anybody know of which publication applies?

Regards,

Mike

 

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

Go to the ASME Web site at asme.org.

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
stanweld, that much I knew, I just don't know which publication is the right one, there are many, many.

Thanks,

Mike

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

Define 'approval' and 'required marking'.  Take ASME SA-20: there are no 'approval' clauses and 'required marking' is addressed in 13.1.  Are you simply getting into an ISO 9001, sub-clause 7.4.1/Certification Authority requirement to have a documented basis for using the suppliers that you have used? Or, were they expecting you to use suppliers from their listing, like DNV's for example:

https://exchange.dnv.com/DNVX/ApprovedPublic/ApprovedProductsAndManufacturers.html
?

Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer
http://www.oilandgaspeople.com/cv/11499664
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/8/83b/b04
 

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

Below is a link to the GUIDE FOR ASME REVIEW TEAMS FOR REVIEW OF APPLICANTS FOR ASME CERTIFICATES OF AUTHORIZATION (A, M, PP, S, E, V, HV, H, HLW, H (Cast Iron), UD, UV, UV3, U, UM, U2, U3, RP, T, TD, TV)
http://files.asme.org/asmeorg/Codes/CertifAccred/Certification/810.pdf

Perhaps a particular Code Section or publication/paper giving guidance as to the use of alternative materials acceptable to ASME?  Perhaps like the following link: http://files.asme.org/asmeorg/codes/9383.pdf
 

FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

As far as I am aware, ASME does not certify materials manufacturers except for Nuclear. For further info, email infocentral@asme.org or call 1-800-843-2763.   

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
SJones, yes, it appears that DNV (the involved agency I referred to in my OP) expects us to use materials to DNV specifications from DNV approved suppliers. We have certified these (Class III) coolers to DNV on a few previous occasions and there was no problem with the agency accepting ASME materials for use in ASME designs. Per the rules we are told are applicable, it appears there is ample basis for accepting ASME materials.

The surveyor involved has a different opinion.

Stanweld, I had sort of thought that mills must have something similair to a C of A to produce materials to ASME specs, but maybe this is not so? Are they "self insured" so to speak?

Thanks to all,

Mike



  

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
After digging back through the papertrail on this job, I believe I can sharpen my question a bit, i.e.:

What, in the ASME world, might correspond to a DNV "Works Certificate"?

Defined as: Works Certificate (W)
A document signed by the manufacturer stating:
- conformity with rule requirements
- that tests are carried out on the certified product itself
- that tests are made on samples taken from the certified
product itself
- that tests are witnessed and signed by a qualified department
of the manufacturers.

Per DNV, this is apparently not satisfied by the MTR's.

Thanks again,

Mike

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

SnTMan;

Quote:

What, in the ASME world, might correspond to a DNV "Works Certificate"?

Nothing at the moment within the scope of Section I or Section VIII.

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
metengr, what about Sec II?

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

SnTMan;
I am able to review and comment on ASME BPVC letter ballots and I have seen nothing on the horizon for this activity.

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
metengr, I'm a little more curious about this whole issue now.

So, I open a mill and make plate and forgings, say. I represent them as meeting ASME specs and mark them as such. Is there any independent oversight of my activities aside from test reports, or is it entirely on me?

Regards,

Mike

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

Mike;
For ASME B&PV Code material or even ASTM material being certified, as such, it is all based on honesty/integrity of the Supplier, and the Purchaser must source check and/or audit/police or have someone audit/police their own product at the mill. Sorry, but true. Purchaser beware!

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
metengr, understood and thanks. Not necessarily a bad system, works well for the most part. Like anything else, some suppliers you trust, some you don't.

Regards,

Mike

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

If you pay for it and the manufacturer is reputable, you can always obtain third party certification on the CMTR's.

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
stanweld, yes true.

Relating to my original problem, by obtaining and reading yet another DNV spec, I think I can see a way forward. A couple of days of "lawyer" work, and we'll see.

Thanks to all for the input.

Mike

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

easy. 1st ask one of your mfrs to provide their QCM
with supporting docs. ASTM/ ASME/ISO, etc.
ASME Sect II defines all the materials mfg requirements,
includes ASTM materials. A mfr who certifies shall have authorizations to even use the names ASTM AND ASME
when materials are stamped/stencil.
There are cheaters of course who put glue to cover flange pinholes...
 

RE: Code Accreditation for Mills

(OP)
GenB,

Quote:

A mfr who certifies shall have authorizations to even use the names ASTM AND ASME...

What is your basis for this statement? Who authorizes?

Thanks,

Mike
 

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members!


Resources