Toppled building in China last June.
Toppled building in China last June.
(OP)
Remember this one?
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=248426
People are doing hard time:
http://b logs.wsj.c om/chinare altime/200 9/06/29/sh anghai-bui lding-coll apses-near ly-intact/
http:// blogs.wsj. com/chinar ealtime/20 10/02/11/v erdicts-in -shanghai- building-c ollapse/ta b/article/
http://blo gs.wsj.com /chinareal time/2010/ 04/22/prop erty-execu tives-get- life-in-sh anghai-bui lding-coll apse-case/
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=248426
People are doing hard time:
http://b
http://
http://blo






RE: Toppled building in China last June.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
"Whatever the traffic will bear."
Upton Sinclair,
"The Octopus"
Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
Motto: KISS
Motivation: Don't ask
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
I saw a beam for a 1 ton monorail in a Chinese plant that was attached continuously to a 16" deep beam that connected to a major parallel structural beam above it by 8x8 columns (2' long) at 4' on center. It was designed by an American educated engineer for a joint ownership design "company" doing work for a joint ownership owner and obviously never failed, so there was no punishment.
There is a big problem regarding the new Chinese design and construction firms, since they are a combined Chinese and foreign ownership and the traditions, rules and liability have not bee firmly established. Hong Kong could have some different problems where the "foreign management" could actually be some "good ole boys" from across the bay.
The manufacturing companies also have mixed ownership and just manufacture to the customer/exporter/marketer's specifications and leave the use and application of the products use to the exporter since you never know where they will be sold.
They are slowly adapting to many other international design and material standards, but language and translations seem to pose a problem.
Engineer and international traveler interested in construction techniques, problems and proper design.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
"I saw a beam for a 1 ton monorail in a Chinese plant that was attached continuously to a 16" deep beam that connected to a major parallel structural beam above it by 8x8 columns (2' long) at 4' on center. It was designed by an American educated engineer for a joint ownership design "company" doing work for a joint ownership owner and obviously never failed, so there was no punishment."
8x8 columns at 4' OC sounds pretty generous for a 1-ton live load, or am I not understanding what it looks like?
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
It was an over-designed structural solution to a very common arrangement with different solutions and member sizes.
When giving a seminar the next day the engineer asked many good questions that shows that communication and understanding is the key.
Dick
Engineer and international traveler interested in construction techniques, problems and proper design.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
For example, suppose you drive drunk here in the US. It's not well enforced, and you'll hear of people who have been convicted a dozen or more times. But if 100 people drive drunk, and one runs over somebody, that one will be in prison. And really, they were all doing the same thing. That seems to be the situation they're having with this in China, and drastic punishment of the one unlucky person that gets caught can never compensate for the other 99 allowed to do what they wish.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
You have to look at the local laws and determination to catch up with other countries in the rapidly changing international economy. In the end, the liability for a corporation lies with the formally empowered executives and the employed professionals that are responsible with the analysis and design of products/materials.
Dick
Engineer and international traveler interested in construction techniques, problems and proper design.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
Clansman
If a builder has built a house for a man and has not made his work sound, and the house which he has built has fallen down and so caused the death of the householder, that builder shall be put to death." Code of Hammurabi, c.2040 B.C.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
Seriously, though, I know an American expat in China, who knows a European who did jail time for a car accident where he may not even have been at fault, in our western way of looking at things. The expat's American wife rides her bike in city traffic, but is afraid to drive for that and other reasons, and having seen traffic in Beijing, Chongqing, and other cities, I probably wouldn't do either one.
RE: Toppled building in China last June.
In the past 10 years I have seen the changes, it is amazing, but will take some time since they have at it for a few years. Fortunately, they do not have deal with government regulations on the professiona/fields that are pinpointed or targeted areas.
The lure of the 9 story shopping centers (surrounded completely by connected 9 level parking ramps) with 1000 shops definitely does have an appeal that induces future changes. The old city layouts are defintely a challenge, especially for a country that supposedly buys more Buicks than the U.S. (according to a GM marketing person)in an effort to overtake Mercedes and BMW sales in the largest auto market in the world.
A huge city like Chongqing (aka "Chung Kin") with a huge population on a horrible geology/geography divided by a river and has an airport 30-40 km north of town where you cannot see the end because of the hill in the middle is an example of the problems inherited from history and lack of suitable property for man, women and children. It is a city of 7,000,000 and a municipality of about 32,000,000 but still has a largely rural population awaiting changes and more power for A/C.
I agree with you about the wine and beer except for the beer in Harbin.
The country is fascitating and has many challenges for technology, design and construction. The economic forces and shrinking of the world compound the growth potential.
It takes disasters to make use look at the reasons for failures and to understand why.
Dick
Engineer and international traveler interested in construction techniques, problems and proper design.