×
INTELLIGENT WORK FORUMS
FOR ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!
  • Students Click Here

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Jobs

General Motors switching to Catia V5?

General Motors switching to Catia V5?

General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
I heard this through the grape vine and wanted to see if others have heard the same.

With Chrysler switching to NX for all Fiat programs and now GM switching to Catia V5.

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Don't believe everything you hear "through the grape vine" winky smile

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
Only reason I asked, I've heard they are benchmarking it and training some of their programmers in Catia V5. It seems they have so much vested into NX that it would make absolutely no sense in the switch. Especially financially.
 

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Reviewing the current state of technology is not all that unusual for any larger company to be doing.  Besides, if I wanted to start some 'rumors' of my own I could list several big name Catia users who are currently looking at NX, but all that means is that they too are paying attention to the current state of the industry and the direction that technology is going.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

On the cam side, here in LA, I've seen Catia shops move to NX. But not the other way around.

I like to reminisce of a big meeting 10 years ago at a very large airframe shop here in LA: I had been the only UG programmer there for several months. They used Catia and NCL. Both Dasault and UGS agreed to come in to have a face to face "showdown". One the one side of the conference table: The Catia Mafia. On other side: the UGS team. It was a pretty grueling couple days. Both sides had to provide finished programs of large airframe parts that we then picked apart for time, effort, cost, and efficient tool path. Long story short - they moved to NX. It's one thing to force the issue of programming in the same environment as the supplier but one again - efficient tool path wins on big parts. : )

But like John said, they still take a look now and then to keep abreast.

--
Bill

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I hear (albeit on the other side of the pond in the [sic]sunny UK) that there are 2 US companies that are perhaps looking to take NX on board and if just 1 of them takes NX on board it will instantly make them the biggest user of NX in the world eclipsing even the mighty GM....HOw's that for a well informed rumor? winky smile

Best regards

Simon NX4.0.4.2 MP10 - TCEng 9.1.3.6.c - (NX6.0.3.6 MP2 native)

www.jcb.com

Life shouldn't be measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the number of times when it's taken away...

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
Well good thing for me then, if anyone moves to NX.  You can see my paranoia about GM switching to Catia since I have been primarily a GM NX user for the last 15 years.

Like I said, I just wanted to get other peoples opinion and if they had heard the same.

Thank you all.

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

It works both ways. I worked in a plant that was all UG. Corporate signed a big PTC contract because they came in with a lower price than UG. At that point, each division had been free to choose their own CAD and the corporate was split between Pro/E and UG. We had at least 2 large divisions using Iman/TeamCenter. Because we had a sister plant using AutoCad, when they went to a 3D cad system, corporate forced Pro/E on them and we had to move to Pro/E, too, after 15 years on UG. Move forward 6 years and the corporate decides our business is too cyclical so the sell the division to a company that uses CATIA as the corporate standard. The plant goes through another round of training and change.

Sometimes decisions are made based on other than technical reasons.

 

"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."

Ben Loosli

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

as small persuaded UG/NX Cad operator with experience in V5:
In the last 15 years I have seen the automotive cad business.
In the 90th the supplier felt free to use the cad solution. I have seen many toolshops working for the automotives using ug switching to v5 because they must deliver in V5 with all engineering knowledge - no UG /Nx thats the mess . The fun is that the long term data storrage is done in step and dxf,pdf  

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

When I did automotive airbags in the early 90's we had PDGS and UG, pre-v10 days.
Chrysler work was done in PDGS and converted to CATIA.
Ford work was done in UG and coverted to PDGS.
GM work was done and delivered in UG.
Saturn work was done in UG and converted to CATIA by Perot Systems for delivery to EDS.

The automotive industry uses a little of everything even within one company. They are always evaluating what the other companies do, as well as other CAD systems.

 

"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."

Ben Loosli

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

What I can see among our current and possible future customers in aerospace shows a heavier preference for Catia; any future contracts with many of these customers will see us picking up a seat or two of Catia.  After 20 years using UG, I was relieved to learn that we wouldn't be throwing it out the door, but will retain NX as our primary CAD system.  While I look forward to picking up a new system, I dread the frustration that comes with having to (temporarily) forget everything you know about CAD in order to learn it.

"Good to know you got shoes to wear when you find the floor." - Robert Hunter
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

On the other hand I've worked in large OEM's that remained stuck in older versions of their CAD software (not UG or NX), one of which had just one password for all of several thousand users of their system. Switching modelling or machining between competing systems may be relatively straightforward, but migrating the drafting data is an absolute nightmare!

 

Best Regards

Hudson

www.jamb.com.au

Nil Desperandum illegitimi non carborundum

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

One of the things that has frustrated me about this issue, over the years, is that the decision makers are almost never the people who have to use the software. And as you know no one ever got fired for buying IBM or their affiliates. As much as I feel that NX is one of the top systems available, i have group on another continent that is trying to tell me how I will (can) use it. Frustration!

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I first heard of this in 2003, then in 2007...
Could be the same rumor floating around for quite some time now.

UGNX5.0.4.1 MP6 \ WinXP-SP3
Productive Design Services
www.productivedesign.com

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

In detroit here, work with both GM and Chrysler...GM is staying with NX and Chrysler is going to switch to NX.  When?  Thats a guess.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

JycoCAD,

I heard from an excellent source that Chrysler needs... NEEDS(!) 200 designers/engineers that are fluent in both V5 and NX as yes, they are migrating (but extremely slowly)to NX for future programs but the kicker is that a large percentage of designers are still stuck on V4!  Even in Detroit, finding folks that have both NX and Catia V5 experience is a real challenge.  So many people moved on, moved out, retired, took the package or plain got pissed off and went and did something else that finding these people will prove to be tough.  I had an interview at Ground Zero (4th floor/KBE) two weeks ago and was glad to leave.  Depressing.  

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

GM  is not benchmarking Catia V5, they are benchmarking Catia V6.  Decision due in a month or two, supposedly.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

as far as I know / understood v6 is it the combination of Nx and TC - V6 is running only on database ... nearly 14 years ago I have seen something like that in i-deas.
Benchmarking - would be nice to get the results - the decision in big companys is driven by money and politics.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I received NX files a couple of weeks ago from Chrysler...

I've had Catia v5 training, back in '05 when it looked like we were going to go to a single in-house design system... But even for a small shop with 2-3 Tool/fixture designers it did not make financial sense. While most of our work originated in Catia, Catia just plain costs too much in the long term...

Though now it probably doesn't make much difference as we are so far behind in Maintenance on all of our software it will probably be cheaper to start over with something else.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
Yea, we got word yesterday that it's official for Chrysler.  Also Toyota is switching to Pro-Engineer is pretty big.
 

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Toyota is switching to Pro/Engineer??
mmmhhhh
I suggest to check the source of the rumor...
Toyota is using Pro/E for Powertrain for a long time.
 

Beppe Grimaldi
SISW Italy

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

No wonder Toyota has problems!  ;)  

(Sorry a cheap shot at ProE not Toyota)   

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

PS.
Why do you think GM should evaluate Catia V5, and not V6, while V6 was announced 2 years ago?
 

Beppe Grimaldi
SISW Italy

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
When I posted this, I had heard V5.  But I have since heard it was V6.  Then I was also told that they evaluate cad packages a lot.

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Quote (UGoverALL):


Why do you think GM should evaluate Catia V5, and not V6, while V6 was announced 2 years ago?

And in those 2 years, how many major companies have actually put V6 into production?

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
I don't know of anyone that has V6 in production.  Is there?

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Interesting dilemma about cadcam versions and suppliers that really hits the cam users...

On the one hand large corporations must stay (for a variety of reasons) many times 2-3 versions behind. Primary manufacturing suppliers are required to be using that older version as their primary data source. But almost without exception, we then use as close to the latest version because it has the better features to get the work out faster. The only exception is when the client wants the source files back for in-house use.

On the cam side, I think my point is that while large companies are the bread & butter for total seats sold, the small companies are the early adopters of the new versions. Large users tend to have a whole department assigned to finding out if new versions support all the older in-house processes. The smaller ones jump on and enjoy the ride. :)

--
Bill

   

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

@John...
No one in Italy.
I know Renault is piloting it.
The "v6" in production are nothing more than Matrix, renamed Enovia V6.
 

Beppe Grimaldi
SISW Italy

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

John Baker, what did you think of the comments left in the article dissing teamcenter?

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I work in the NX group, NOT TeamCenter.

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I guess this mmkes it even more official:

http://www.media.chrysler.com/newsrelease.do;jsessionid=F13572B7E5BADBA980841766074D46F4?&id=9835&mid=2

BTW, we also have a press release of our own, but figured the above one would be a more interesting read, under the circumstances winky smile

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

I've been getting NX from Chrysler for awhile now( well 4 parts so far).. all Dumb solids, My guess is its translated in.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

It's typical during a CAD change that parts are "dumb" solids...
it tooks years because all parts become parametric.

Beppe Grimaldi
SISW Italy

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Unless things are "different" for larger purchases I can't see show Catia can compete with NX price wise. Unless of course they stick it to the little guys who have no choice but to keep up with what the big 3 are using...

Many years ago we bought 2 seats of UG v15 (ADVDES bundles)@ $17,900 a seat and last I checked our Maintenance was around $2500/yr per seat... And as most NX users know maintenance includes software updates, tech support and access to GTAC.

I cannot remember when we got Catia v5, Maybe 2002, A new customer required we have it onsite. Translations were getting costly and it was time for the other user to move on from Camax Camand anyways... It was $33,000 for a HD2 (Hybrid Design), I believe they discounted it to $25,000. HD2 pretty much had same tools as we had with UG... Maintenance for that was $3300/yr for software updates alone... No tech support included. If you wanted that, you paid extra to a 3rd party.

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Quote (JohnRBaker):


Besides, if I wanted to start some 'rumors' of my own I could list several big name Catia users who are currently looking at NX...

Some news:

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20101124005365/en/Daimler-Selects-CAD-Software-Siemens-Platform-Worldwide-Car

John R. Baker, P.E.
Product 'Evangelist'
Product Design Solutions
Siemens PLM Software Inc.
Industry Sector
Cypress, CA
http://www.siemens.com/plm
http://www.plmworld.org/museum/

To an Engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
 

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

(OP)
Just heard GM is switching to NX 7.5 in May.  I guess it's a good thing they aren't switching to V5.  

Can't wait.

Justin
Designer

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

My employers are not going to like that, LOL... 2+ years of back maintenance to catch up on...  

RE: General Motors switching to Catia V5?

Nice! Are they hiring?

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members!


Resources