AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
(OP)
Hello all,
I'm looking for some advice regarding using AISC certified fabricators vs. Uncertified. This is going to be kind of long, so please bear with me.
As I understand it from the IBC 2006, special inspection is required in the steel fabricator's shop unless the fabricator is certified (paraphrased from 1704.2.2). As we all know, technically, the owner is supposed to pay for all special inspection. Therefore, in our specs, we have been calling for an AISC certified fabricator for the steel. This is done primarily to reduce any additional cost to the owner.We have worked successfully, in the past, with uncertified fabricators. To address the question of "quality of work", we previously included in our specs, a provision that the fabricator "have a minimum of 5 years experience in similar construction and similar complexity."
The question now becomes, how do we allow the uncertifed, but qualified (in my opinion), fabricators to bid on a project without incurring additional cost requirements, to the owner, for the special inspector?
One obvious sugestion would be to include language in the spec that the contractor pay for this at no additional cost to the owner. But if the owner is hiring the special inspector and requiring that the contractor pay for this, wouldn't there be some type of legal issue to this process?
Another idea was to put language in the spec that "should the Contractor engage a Non-AISC certified fabricator, an additional amount of $### will be included in the Contractor's final bid to cover the costs of the additional special inspection." Again though, the legality of this idea is unknown.
Has anyone else dealt with this situation and what were your solution(s)?
Thanks,
RW
I'm looking for some advice regarding using AISC certified fabricators vs. Uncertified. This is going to be kind of long, so please bear with me.
As I understand it from the IBC 2006, special inspection is required in the steel fabricator's shop unless the fabricator is certified (paraphrased from 1704.2.2). As we all know, technically, the owner is supposed to pay for all special inspection. Therefore, in our specs, we have been calling for an AISC certified fabricator for the steel. This is done primarily to reduce any additional cost to the owner.We have worked successfully, in the past, with uncertified fabricators. To address the question of "quality of work", we previously included in our specs, a provision that the fabricator "have a minimum of 5 years experience in similar construction and similar complexity."
The question now becomes, how do we allow the uncertifed, but qualified (in my opinion), fabricators to bid on a project without incurring additional cost requirements, to the owner, for the special inspector?
One obvious sugestion would be to include language in the spec that the contractor pay for this at no additional cost to the owner. But if the owner is hiring the special inspector and requiring that the contractor pay for this, wouldn't there be some type of legal issue to this process?
Another idea was to put language in the spec that "should the Contractor engage a Non-AISC certified fabricator, an additional amount of $### will be included in the Contractor's final bid to cover the costs of the additional special inspection." Again though, the legality of this idea is unknown.
Has anyone else dealt with this situation and what were your solution(s)?
Thanks,
RW






RE: AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
i've seen architect/engineers/owners say that the inspection is not necessary for whatever reason...just be aware that the team and testing firm should be notified of this and documented accordingly. if there is ever a problem and it goes to court, as you know lawyers will jump on any opportunity. which is why i also reitterate that litigation and special inspections are just now starting to marry up so proceed with caution and have folks in the firm up to speed on what is required...especially for those states that are not fully up to speed yet.
RE: AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
So, what's my point? Well, I guess don't hang your hat on the spec requiring certified fabricator. Usually, the engineer has no say in who is selected, and doesn't even know who it is until the submittals start arriving. So until we can educate owners to involve their design teams in the bidding phase, to evealute bidders, all we can do is reject non-complying submittals. We require certified fabricators for everything, and with few exceptions, reject any submittals that dont meeet that requirement. This has caused lots of conflict between us, the contractor, and the owner. We don't like doing this, but what else can you do once the submittals start arriving?
RE: AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
i'd say that if you must do the special inspection for non certified fabricators, make sure to hire a very good testing firm/speicial inspector that will not simply "paper" the inspection...this may be a difficult task though. i still like structuresguy's strategy. i'm even a fan of doing the inspection in addition to being certified.
RE: AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
Best regards - Al
RE: AISC Certification vs. Uncertified and Special Inspections
The specification should represent the intent of the code:
IBC Section 1704.2.2 basically states that inspections are required unless the fabricator is certified.
In my opinion the owner should always be responsible for inspection. They should have inspection whether a fabricator is certified or not. Who says the fabricators dont do everything asked of them during audit time, get certification, and then go back to misbehaving. I would rather have someone there.
AISC certification is just a PR move by AISC and a way for them to extort money from fabricators. If this was really required it would be in the code.
What is next, specifying that all steel fabrication must be done by union shops.
Save yourself the headache, strike the AISC certification requirement from your specification and just follow the code.