what would you do?
what would you do?
(OP)
i left my last firm after i was told i was uncooperative. well that's because i
a. wouldn't design without safety factors
b. i gave the owner's son (head of sales dept.) a one sided discussion on common respect and people's time.
i know of several jobs that are not built as per the engineer's design, the drawings don't match the calculations, and the as built conditions are "underdesigned."
what would you all do with that information?
i'm inclined to leave it alone.
a. wouldn't design without safety factors
b. i gave the owner's son (head of sales dept.) a one sided discussion on common respect and people's time.
i know of several jobs that are not built as per the engineer's design, the drawings don't match the calculations, and the as built conditions are "underdesigned."
what would you all do with that information?
i'm inclined to leave it alone.





RE: what would you do?
Even as a non PE, if it's a real safety concern rather than just a cost/schedule impact, I believe you have a duty to the public.
KENAT,
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RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
Tell them your concerns, it's up to them to decide whether to investigate and if so to prove wrong doing.
I've you're concerned about consequences I suppose you could contact them annonymously but they may not take you as seriously.
It's like calling the police because you think a crime is being commited, you don't have to have enough evidence to convict the person before you contact the cops - that's their job.
KENAT,
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RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
Sorry, but other than you leaving the firm and (b), the rest of this sounds unbelievable or sour grapes to me.
RE: what would you do?
bear in mind, i was the only engineer in that company. so it's not far fetched to have non-engineers who think they can dictate to an engineer how he designs.
RE: what would you do?
I feel you did the right thing by leaving a place where you did not feel comfortable. While reporting is ethically right thing to do, you need proofs and ability and resources to defend your allegation. If you do not have them, forget them and work where you feel comfortable.
RE: what would you do?
Just a couple of quick points:
1. Jobs often deviate from the plans and require small modifications to ensure they comply with code. I'll assume you aren't talking about that kind of thing, but rather about actual "cowboy" work where the contractor is allowed to do as they please.
2. You duty of care is to the public. That's the high school ball that rents the hall that you know doesn't have there right size of bolts, or the correct joist hangers, insufficient/incorrect welds, etc, etc, etc.
3. If it is just a lack of strict adherance to the code, that's probably not the end of the world unless it is genuinely unsafe. If it is genuinely unsafe, then it could very well be the end of your (emotional, professional, etc) life if anything ever happened and you knew you could have reported it.
Just my thoughts,
I wish you well while not envying your position,
YS
B.Eng (Carleton)
Working in New Zealand, thinking of my snow covered home...
RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
You could always talk to them in general terms before making any specific allegations.
Again though, make sure this really is a safety concern as it may have consequences.
KENAT,
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RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
Clue (1)
Clue (2)
Is the engineer in clue (2) above you or another? I thought you were the only engineer at this company? Did you ever stop and think that you might need to re-evaluate yourself so that you can attempt to make others see your position for your next job?
RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
I think you have a professional responsibility to report it. What would make you NOT report it?
RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
If that is the case, then you should have no problem retrieving a set. It seems the evidence you are looking for may in fact be public record.
At least you could review them as well as any as-built plans to reach a conclusion as to the validity of your concerns.
If you find errors on the plans and they were not caught on the as-built plans, it seems like this could be enough for you to bring it out in the open.
I struggled with a similar situation years ago where I knew something about a firm but didn't want to appear as "sour grapes" between them and myself. I did the right thing, and I trust you will too.
Good luck to you!
RE: what would you do?
Waiting till after you had a falling out with your employer to be concerned about this is a bad spot to be in. You may have been concerned about it the whole time you were there but as far as everyone else, including all the lawyers who are going to sue you for bringing this up, you weren't.
I can certainly empathize with your situation but now is probably the worst time you could bring this up.
RE: what would you do?
Went to work everyday for several years and happily did my job. Got laid off and climbed onto my high horse about all the things I couldn't believe they did and started asking the what should I do questions.
Nearly 10 years later nothing ever did happen despite what I thought at the time. Turns out that the people who make the equipment sometimes do know more than the engineers who design the equipment, and also write the code books.
A lesson I think many of us need to learn.
RE: what would you do?
RE: what would you do?
I think danberry as provided a good solution just make sure you keep a copy of the letter you send, its a good idea as your old company may have already addressed some of the issue's you have spotted and I have know idea how long ago you spotted these potential problems but if you report it now to some authority they might ask:-
1/ Why didn't you raise this when you were employed by the
company?
2/ Why have you waited till now to report it to us?
You may have already thought about this and have some good answers.
If you point out to your old company the problems and they choose to ignore it, then its there problem and if your questioned by some authority at a later date because of some accident you have a copy of the letter you sent them.
desertfox
RE: what would you do?
How different is danberry's advice from telling someone why you left?
KENAT,
Have you reminded yourself of FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies recently, or taken a look at posting policies: http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?
What is Engineering anyway: FAQ1088-1484: In layman terms, what is "engineering"?
RE: what would you do?
I wonder if your ex-employer would also use desertfox's #1 & #2 as a defense against you, if questioned by the authorities? Perhaps they might then sue you for failing to inform them promptly?
RE: what would you do?
However, if the OP is a PE, then he is legally obligated to inform the company of unsafe designs.
TTFN
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RE: what would you do?