Sarcasm
Sarcasm
(OP)
After browsing these forums for a while I have noticed a lot of sarcasm in answers. Maybe some questioners desevre it for posting questions that a little hard work would solve but I have also seen it widespread in response to very good questions/answers.
As an example I recently replied to a thread with an answer that I obtained directly from a data/spec sheet, with my response drawing a sarcastic reply from another poster suggesting I was incorrect. However it is by no means limited to to that thread - I have noticed it in threads where I am in no way involved in the discussions.
I do not see the reason for it, other than for the "sarcasmee" to feel like a bigger person.
It may be a misunderstanding of cultural differences as these formums have no national limits but I see it as genuine bad manners.
I would be interested in others' opinions on the matter.
As an example I recently replied to a thread with an answer that I obtained directly from a data/spec sheet, with my response drawing a sarcastic reply from another poster suggesting I was incorrect. However it is by no means limited to to that thread - I have noticed it in threads where I am in no way involved in the discussions.
I do not see the reason for it, other than for the "sarcasmee" to feel like a bigger person.
It may be a misunderstanding of cultural differences as these formums have no national limits but I see it as genuine bad manners.
I would be interested in others' opinions on the matter.





RE: Sarcasm
- Steve
RE: Sarcasm
Sarcasm is most often used as an intelligent form of humor to satirically and paradoxilly portray the minutinae and uselessness in some aspects of everyday life. Sarcasm, despite its wounding potential, can help reinforce one's lack of worldliness in a playful, yet pragmatic manner. It can be directed at persons, objects, events, ideologies, establishments, or even with references to history.[8] It is often used as proxy to other forms of expression. For example, instead of becoming angry and yelling at someone in a conflict, a person might choose to use sarcasm as an alternative.
My thought: Emotion is very hard to determine in any electronic communication. Try to read what the person wrote, not how (emotionally) he wrote it.
______________________________________________________________________________
This is normally the space where people post something insightful.
RE: Sarcasm
Back in the UK I experienced much higher levels of sarcasm everyday in the office than I usually see here, so I can't say I get offended by the sarcasm too much here.
Maybe it's a cultural thing, though, there have been responses on this site that would make some of my current colleagues cry.
If a post really offends you then redflag it and let the moderator decide if it's OTT.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: Sarcasm
But, why wouldn't posting a bad question be considered bad manners? I've seen questions that 10 seconds of Googling would have answered. So some lazy engineer would rather waste our collective time because he can't be bothered to do a decent websearch, and a smart-ass answer is bad-manners? There are likewise, dozens of questions each week from lazy students, looking for a handout, and are often met with sarcasm.
TTFN
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RE: Sarcasm
Get over it, they are just words.
RE: Sarcasm
Engineers are a sarcastic bunch.
Hg
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RE: Sarcasm
I've always said, "better the right answer with a little snarkiness than the wrong answer nicely".
My thoughts only, I'm sure it's all because my mother didn't raise me right (grin).
SLH
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I myself have been tempted to post some replies to questions which I feel require a little commonsense and not much else.
RE: Sarcasm
.
RE: Sarcasm
The Red Flag functionality is available to every user on Eng-Tips and is provided to allow members to self-moderate these forums. If something exceeds your tolerance threshold, Red Flag it and the site administrators will decide if it should be deleted or modified.
"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
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RE: Sarcasm
I actually went thru all of your threads (slow at lunch today). I did not see any sarcasm in your threads. I did see that one of the engineers that has been most responsive to your posts, getting a little frustrated when trying to answer your questions. But no sarcasm.
RE: Sarcasm
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson
RE: Sarcasm
Keith Cress
kcress - http://www.flaminsystems.com
RE: Sarcasm
EngAP,
Hg is right. Engineers can be a sarcastic bunch. You've got highly intelligent people here with just enough interpersonal awkwardness to breed some of the best sarcasm.
And sometimes what is intended as humor might come off as sarcastic. I'll apologize if anything I'VE said seemed sarcastic to you. I'll assure you that I've got plenty of social ineptitude, but not quite the level of intelligence to pull of really good sarcasm.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"
RE: Sarcasm
"If everything seems under control, you're just not moving fast enough."
- Mario Andretti- When asked about transient hydraulics
http://virtualpipeline.spaces.msn.com
RE: Sarcasm
Wit is demonstrably in short supply on the Internet, I suggest you treasure every sarcastic reply you get.
Cheers
Greg Locock
SIG:Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: Sarcasm
Seems to me that folks here have at least half...
old field guy
RE: Sarcasm
A lot of it can vary based on personality, which in itself can have cultural underpinnings. The field of engineering I worked in in the UK was a bit "rough around the edges", a lot of the staff were ex forces or had come up through apprenticeships etc., I've mentioned in other threads that it wasn't very PC. A lot of the banter there, including sarcasm, would probably offend many members on this site.
At the end of the day if it upsets you red flag it and/or just don't log back onto that thread or respond to that poster again etc. Making a response is likely to either end up in flames (which will probably get red flagged anyway) and/or in you getting belittled by some acerbic comments. In fact I'm surprised that hasn't happened on this thread.
(By the way, is it really an ethical issue?)
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: Sarcasm
RE: Sarcasm
Wilde seems to pop up as a possible source, if so he was probably being ironic.
I must admit I don't much like the longer version you use, sarcasm is supposed to hurt (it is derived from Ancient Greek for "to bite or rend").
Cheers
Greg Locock
SIG:Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: Sarcasm
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: Sarcasm
I have found these forums helpful and do not intend to not read them just because some people are sarcastic. I just sense a slight level of hostility in debates and was interested in others' opinions.
KENAT - I am not particularly offended, I just do not see the reason for the comments. It takes someone time and effort to post a sarcastic response when no response would provide as good an answer and would have saved the person (and company?!? time and money).
IRStuff - I agree, I should have stated "sarcasmer". I also agree with lazy questions don't deserve good answers but I have seen very good questions met with sarcastic/rude responses. And for any novice in a field, a question they feel is a good one may seem trivial for an expert.
RARMBJ - I agree.
BigInch, csd72, civilperson, GregLocock - I have not found anything offensive, I am wondering the reason behind the tone of the replies. I have seen it quite a lot and noticed it hadn't been mentioned before so I thought I'd bring it up.
RE: Sarcasm
So if we see a clueless question, we tend to respond less than politely.
You can rest assured that if you turned up to my desk and persistently acted in a clueless time-wasting fashion the response would be FAR beyond anything you see here.
Cheers
Greg Locock
SIG:Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: Sarcasm
RE: Sarcasm
Cheers
Greg Locock
SIG:Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: Sarcasm
The replies you seem to object to often give me a good laugh, so even if wasted on the OP, hey may be of value to the others who wasted the time to open a useless thread.
Sometimes it is used as a little pain to reinforce the point of a lesson. Painful lessons are the ones we remember most.
Brits and Aussies seem to be much more cruel and accepting of linguistic cruelty than Americans.
The other side of the coin is, when I see overly polite language, I immediately suspect the sincerity and integrity of the poster.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
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RE: Sarcasm
On investigation, it seems I might actually be the sarcasticer in question. Sorry Greg I was ready to credit it to you or Issac.
Ops there I go again with a sarcastic ummm.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
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RE: Sarcasm
I would also be interested to know whether this is typical of conversations in the work place. My company has a good atmosphere so I do not tend to come across much rudeness, however I would be interested in others' experiences.
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Favourite funny answers to threads
thread1088-219172: Favourite funny answers to threads
Perhaps it should have been titled "Favourite sarcastic answers to threads"?
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson
RE: Sarcasm
In fact you didn't have the data to back it up as you will see.
I us that sort of technique in the hope that people will react to themselves with a Duhhh, I should check my facts or think more before I shoot my mouth of. A bit ofa sting does make us more cautious in future.
I do use such methods in the work place and accept such being used against me. In fact if I discover my mistake myself, I will take the P*** from myself. Like I said earlier, I think it is a British/Aussie thing.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
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RE: Sarcasm
"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
Have you read FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies to make the best use of these Forums?
RE: Sarcasm
Funny thing is although everything here in my part of the US workplace is more PC (or whatever you want to term it) the place back in the UK where you could excpect the kind of sarcasm EngAP doesn't like was a much better work place overall. If someone was being an idiot you pretty much told them (be it in the form of sarcasm) that, but (with the odd exception) no one took it personal. Here I waste so much time sugar coating stuff rather than just coming out with it.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
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Hg
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RE: Sarcasm
I have to admit when dealing with Americans, I find New Yorkers easier to understand re both accent and culture.
When dealing with Brits I find it easier culturally dealing with Northerners, Scotts and Irish or even Cornish rather than SE.
I agree very much with what Kenat has said.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
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I do find some brits are overly sensitive to these things, my wife included.
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Regarding s/n ratio, a slapdown response may give other well-meaning posters pause before they start contributing to a thread that is already (or deserves to be) in the RF process, and if the thread is not deleted the slapdown may serve as a warning to other useless posters (though the worst of the useless posters won't have bothered looking through prior threads).
Hg
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RE: Sarcasm
What's the deal, you have no star.
Usually you get a star just for showing up.
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Also it's all sweeping generalizations, there were people back in the UK that couldn't take it - despite the fact some of them liked to give it.
Pat, I'm a Southerner, must be why we're at loggerheads all the time
monkeydog, not lately, I must be slipping down the MVP list faster than housing prices.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: Sarcasm
Hg
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RE: Sarcasm
- Steve
RE: Sarcasm
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
RE: Sarcasm
RE: Sarcasm
I have also trained myself to always hit the "Preview Post" button first. It helps to weed out some off-color remarks that get by as well as proofing spelling, etc.
If you "heard" it on the internet, it's guilty until proven innocent. - DCS
RE: Sarcasm
That doesn't mean I disapprove of sarcasm, far from it, I enjoy the ready wit and cutting sarcasm (directed at others) but I just worry too much about upsetting someone if it is me doing it.
There are times I yearn to let rip and I'm sure that occasional "mouth first brain second" incidents would do me some good.
My "mouth first" colleague and I were walking through the engineering office one time on our way to lunch when we passed a bunch of the women secretaries clustered round old "Bert" who was slumped in his chair and doing his best (unconciously) to slide to the floor.
"What's up?" demanded my colleague in a loud voice, "Has Bert died on the job then?" (I think he some double meaning was intended here).
There was a brief silence when it then occurred to my colleague that that was exactly what the tableau suggested and then the secs went back to being Flo Nightingales and ignored my colleague.
As it happened, Bert's funny turn wasn't immediately fatal (just as well as he had not given HR prior notice of an intention to demise in situ). As it also happened, it didn't seem to do my colleagues status any harm at all and a brief "oops!" gesture was all he showed that he might have better said nowt.
On the other hand, had it been my comment I am not at all sure that it would have had the same outcome.
I'm not just being paranoid here, I noted that another colleague, Dave, had a thing for one of the Girl Fridays in the office. He was about as non-PC as you can get and the sexual harassment laws meant nothing to him, nor, it seems, to the company.
He'd say outrageous things and pester her to distraction.
Then one day I was giving a presentation to the assembled staff and asked a question that called for some basic understanding of what we made and sold. I got blank looks from all and sundry except the Girl Friday who made the desired response.
"Come on guys," I said, "even Girl Friday understood." (I supress her real name).
Next morning I got a real chewing out from all and sundry from HR and line managers and well and truly had my card marked.
The problem was that I only meant that Girl Friday's job didn't require her to have any engineering and she got it yet those supposed to have some basic engineering knowledge seemed unequal to the task i.e. my remark was innocent of any malicious derogatory intent nor was it intended to be sexist or demeaning and yet I got clobbered.
Dave who had the maximum deviant intent at all times and under all conditions got away with it day in and day out.
Ce la vie. Lesson learned, don't say or do anything to upset anyone. In the end, the only one that gets hurt is yourself.
JMW
www.ViscoAnalyser.com
RE: Sarcasm
TTFN
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RE: Sarcasm
the sarcasmer... aka Dik
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Ouch. Greg, I thought puns were supposed to be the lowest form of humor.
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V
RE: Sarcasm
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
RE: Sarcasm
Guess most posters just aren't on my intelletual plane, not many of you stoop that low.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
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Nope, you are not going to weasel another star from me. Get that from one of your "Pat's Pub" buddies.
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Admitting that something takes a bit of work or that you don't know something and can't figure it out is just not acceptable for engineers, from the public point a view.
I don't mean to offend anybody or perpetuate a sterotype that engineers are arrogant. Just my 2 cents +/- $0.02.
-- MechEng2005
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TTFN
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And no, I am not being sarcastic
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KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
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The minute you stop finding things you dont know is probably the minute you die. Life is a journey not a destination.
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"...Life is a journey not a destination."
That would make the destination "Death"!!
Put it off as long as possible.
See the demotivator poster attached.
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RE: Sarcasm
See thread730-228954: eng-tips promoting laziness?
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
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tg
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...by the person who would otherwise be sarcastic, right?
JHG
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Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: Sarcasm
More often, those who are targeted are those with the thickest skins.
JMW
www.ViscoAnalyser.com
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"Sarcasm is the art of never being unintentionally rude."
JMW
www.ViscoAnalyser.com