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Speaking indirectly to employees

Speaking indirectly to employees

Speaking indirectly to employees

(OP)
Does anyone run into this:

completly random example here...

Boss thinks you're spending too much time on the phone (again, this is a very "randomized" example).  Instead of confronting YOU about your phone time, he complains to you about your co-worker John Doe who works in another facility spending too much time on the phone.  Really makes him out to be a bad employee.    

First of all, what is this behavior called?  Is there a better name for it than "indirect speaking"?  Some sort of very transparent smokescreen...    

-Plasmech

Mechanical Engineer, Plastics Industry

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Wussy-ness

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

In Dilbert-ese: PHB-ness

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Plasmech

I believe weakleadershipobia is the technical term for it.   

I know what you mean, and it's not fair to the employee who needs to have a behavior discussed directly with him/her; not fair to the employee who is being talked about and it makes the boss look just as he/she is - poor at managing employees.

Greg Lamberson, BS, MBA
Consultant - Upstream Energy
Website: www.oil-gas-consulting.com
 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

management by parable?  

Perhaps you should tell him about a former co-worker who tried and tried, unsuccessfully, to reach a client via email.  After giving up on ever getting a response, he rationalized by saying "the conversation probably would have led to scope creep anyway."

 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Not the same, but I work for a manager whom won't speak directly to the "offender", but rather will send an email to the entire department stating things in generality.  ALMOST.

He will most often state (to all) that one person in the dept has been observed doing (the offending act) and that this is against policy and won't be tolerated.  All this without ever speaking to the individual directly ever.

Poor management IMO.  He calls it diplomacy.  I call it avoidance.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Passive/Aggressive or some other PC term...  sounds like a P^3 manager (P!$$ Poor Performer) to me

The best way to test something is to squeeze it, slowly, until it breaks!

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

It's called "immature" and/or "ignorant".

Chris
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 08 3.1
AutoCAD 06/08
ctopher's home (updated 10-07-07)

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

You guys are being a bit harsh.  A general email to remind people of policy is not a bad thing.  If one person is doing something wrong, I'd have one conversation (or in this case email) with the entire department.

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."

Have you read FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

I agree - passive agression.  In other words, he is not good with confrontation.   

Call him on it - ask him if he thinks you are spending too much time on the phone too, or whatever he has chosen to complaoin to you about.  Another idea is to suggest that he should take up the matter with the offenders.   

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

A fine example of management sans leadership.  A manager should never gossip about problems with subordinates.  There is no constructive outcome.

If it's a big enough problem to talk about, it's big enough to talk to the individual directly about.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Pitiful.  A manager should NEVER discuss a subordinate's behavior with another subordinate, UNLESS, that subordinate is specifically chartered to be some sort of deputy manager.

Reminds of a time when my manager's manager hauls me and one of his subordinates into his office.  He then tongue lashes his subordinate in front of me.  Ten minutes later, he slows down enough for my compatriot to ask the reason for his discourse; it's the late weekly status report, of course!  Naturally, I had nothing to do with that, and was apparently inadvertently caught up the maelstrom.

TTFN

FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

(OP)
Glad I am not the only one who seriously questions this behavior.

-Plasmech

Mechanical Engineer, Plastics Industry

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

If my boss told me about a "John Doe" who uses the phone too much and I suspected he was really talking about me, I would probably say something like "You never need to worry about me.  I always make sure I don't spend too much time on the phone."  That makes him think I missed his point completely, and then he can either confront me directly or drop the whole issue.

Phil

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Perhaps relay a story to your boss about a hypothetical manager that is a jerkwad that is unable to communicate directly with his subordinates because of some gross character defect.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

...that was the point of my comment about parable management (and the fox & grapes allusion)
 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Where I sit I can see the exit of our building, and late one night I was sitting at my desk and my boss stormed out of the building.  I thought it was weird but didn't think anything of it.  A little while later I checked my email and he had sent me a pretty nasty email about a few things and said we had to talk about it tomorrow.  I emailed him back and said we could talk whenever was good for him and that I'd be in the office all day.  I went into his office twice that day to talk to him but he never brought up that email.  He still has never brought it up, it's like it never happened.

 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Slow down every one.  So the boss, on paper, has done something wrong, is a P^3 manager etc etc

However, the boss is human too.  They may not have a good handle on what you are doing, is confused by it all and does not know how to handle it.  The boss is asking one of the subordinates to get their opinion.  From the bosses perspective you are spending too much time on the phone.  (I am not saying that there is not a valid reason).  If your colleague can rationalise the problem to the boss, every one is a winner (maybe).  The boss has not fired off at you (and lost face), you have not been fired off at (and feel narked by it) and it is water under the bridge.  Perhaps the person in the wrong is the colleague who is letting you know that the boss is talking to him.

Just playing devils advocate.

Tickle

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

"Really makes him out to be a bad employee"

Doesn't sound much like a solicitation for an alternate opinion.  And again, to talk to one subordinate with another is bad form, and presents a chilling and hostile environment.  If he says this about someone else, what is he saying about you to someone else?

TTFN

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RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

(OP)
Yea I wasn't like trying to hear the other side of the argument here because let's face it, there isn't one.  I really just want to know what this behavior is called...what it's name is.

-Plasmech

Mechanical Engineer, Plastics Industry

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

19 responses (including the OP's) and 15 names.
Plasmech, which name did you pick?
I am partial to weakleadershipobia.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

(OP)
I've got all the names on 3x5 cards, going to have a drawing at work tomrrow :)


Need to find a suitable hat first.


 

-Plasmech

Mechanical Engineer, Plastics Industry

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Tickle,
I prefer to have someone deal with me in a straight forward manner.  the situation described seem to make the boss out to be a weasle.  Plasmech please add "Weasle" to the list.

The best way to test something is to squeeze it, slowly, until it breaks!

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

If this kind of thing keeps up and someone loses a job or quits because of the behavior, add "defendant" to the list.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Geez, immediately three courses of action would come to mind:

1) Agree enthusiastically about how badly your coworker is abusing phone use in the office, and then not change anything about my own behavior.

2) Act as if the funniest thought just occured to you, and say "Well I'll be, he must really be a problem if he uses the phone more than me!".

3) Tell him, "I'm pretty sure you're talking about my phone use.  I appreciate that you're bringing this to my attention and I'll try to get it under control.  I'm depending on you to let me know if my behavior here is ever unacceptable.  I know you need to be careful with how you give constructive criticism to some people, but I hope we can have a more direct relationship since I thrive on direct feedback."

If I like my job, option 3.  If I'm tolerating my job, option 1.  If I'm looking for an exit, option 2.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Is your manager's name Michael Scott? Did he work at Dunder Miflin in Scranton, PA?

If he does a lot of stuff like that, he really is a poor manager. He'll probably throw you under the bus one day if possibly gets him out of a jam. I would make myself crazy wondering about all the trash talking he probably does to my co-workers about me, true or not. What a fun work environment!

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

do people actually watch that show?
 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

I was clueless

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

(OP)
What show are we talking about?
 

-Plasmech

Mechanical Engineer, Plastics Industry

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

WHat show?  I don't know.  Google doesn't have any hits under "Dunder Mifflin".  At least, I'm fairly sure it wouldn't.  I'm too lazy to check.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

They have a very well done website, very impressive looking firm.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

That show is great.  The situations are so real, and hillarious. I enncounter stuff like that evreyday.

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

When the original series started in the UK there was no build-up or advertising that I can remember, and no big names.  People got to it first by idle channel surfing, then by word of mouth.  Has "Extras" aired outside of the UK yet?
 

- Steve

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Yea I've seen Extras on HBO. Hilarious.

V

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Does the manager realize this technique is far too subtle to be effective on most Engineers anywaywinky smile.

My boss tells me someone from our dept spends too much time on Eng Tips I'll be trying to work out what their handle is, not worrying that he means me!

(Note above is humorous, I'm not quite that socially inept)

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Quote "(Note above is humorous, I'm not quite that socially inept)"

Are you saying we are so socially inept or linear thinking that we would not have seen that as humor?

(that was ment in fun too)  

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

I'd say something about some people needing it spelt out to them but as this seems to follow nationalistic trends, and I don't want to offend an entire nation based on a gross generalization, then I decline to comment.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Ahhh management material/

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

I have watched every episode of The Office, its excellent.

If my boss said "someone spends too much time on Eng Tips."
I would be momentarily happy, thinking he hired another engineer... (Me being the only engineer)
 

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Great show, real life stupid office games, if you work in an offuce you must watch 3 episodes of this show. (It takes 3 to get the humor)

RE: Speaking indirectly to employees

Management, it's been suggested before.

Sadly (or perhaps fortunately) in person the fact I'm BSing is all too evident.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

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