×
INTELLIGENT WORK FORUMS
FOR ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!
  • Students Click Here

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Jobs

New MTR required?

New MTR required?

New MTR required?

(OP)
If a fabricator will hot form a head at 1650F (SA 516-70N), is a new MTR required?  They are essentially re-normalizing the material.  Is ASME VIII UG-93(b) applicable in this case?

If a certificate of compliance is issued, do they need to issue support documents (i.e. tensiles, impact tests, etc) or will they just submit a signed document?

Thanks!

RE: New MTR required?

Typically a partial data report is required I believe.

RE: New MTR required?

Please read UG-85 in Section VIII, Div 1.

RE: New MTR required?

(OP)
Thank you very much rustbuster and metengr for your responses.

Sorry, got my details wrong - the head is cold formed then re-normalized at 1650F.

metengr, UG-85 takes me back to UG-93(b) where it states that a supplementary MTR or a certificate of compliance is required.  The AI "shall determine that they represent the material and meet the requirements of the material specification".  My interpretation of this is that the documentation needs new tensile test and charpy test results to prove that the material properties still meet the requirements of 516-70N.  Is this correct?  We have received a certificate of compliance with no mechanical testing to back their claims.

RE: New MTR required?

Quote:

My interpretation of this is that the documentation needs new tensile test and charpy test results to prove that the material properties still meet the requirements of 516-70N.  Is this correct?

Yes.

RE: New MTR required?

Metengr,
Seldom would I question your answers, but this one gives me pause.  In 30+ years I have never seen a new set of physical tests performed after normalizing a cold formed head.  Is that explicitly stated somewhere in ASME VIII or is it the result of a trail of ASME paragraphs?  This is not a challenge.  If I need to correct my thinking I will do so.

Joe Tank

RE: New MTR required?

JoeTank;
It is great to question responses on this site because I nor anybody else have all of the answers, and in some cases interpreting the OP can be difficult.

First read UCS-85. The issue of Certificates of Conformance and reheat treatment has been one that I struggled with in the Code, and still do. In my opinion, reheat treatment should require a supplementary MTR because of assurance in establishing the required minimum mechanical properties of the plate. Some parties and AI's have accepted C of C, but as an Owner, I require tests for reheat treatment to assure minimum mechanicals are met.

RE: New MTR required?

JoeTank;
One item that does confuse people is a thermal treatment after forming. There is stress relief treatment which is below the lower critical transformation to remove the effects of cold work, and then you have reheat treatment - normalizing, normalize and temper and quench and temper to alter the effects of cold work and to remove the weld heat affected zone. The subcritical thermal treatment (stress relief) does not require any supplemental testing, you heat, monitor with TC's and cool.

Reheat treatment on the other hand will alter mechanical properties because you may not duplicate what was done according to the original MTR. Did this answer your question or alter your thinking?

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members!


Resources