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Deciding Between two jobs

Deciding Between two jobs

Deciding Between two jobs

(OP)
I have interviewed with two companies and one wants to hire me today.  I am not sure of taking this job because it was not what I thought it would be in terms of design and the commute will be horrible going to and from work.  The other is where I want to go yet I am waiting for a response from them since I will have to do a second interview with them.  In addition it is located in the same city in which I am going to school to get my graduate degree in addition, I will not have to drive to work since I can take a train to work.  I want the job within the same city as my school but I have to make a desicion on how to deal with the other company that wants to hire me.  I dont really want the job that is further away but I am unemployed so choice is not a luxury for me really.  Should I tell the guy that I do not want to work at his company, wait, maybe or maybe not get the other job and just keep looking or should I just take the job since it is being offered? If you were in my position, what is the proffesional and ethical thing to do?

The resisant virtues of the structure that we seek depend on their form; it is through their form that they are stable, not  because of an awkward accumulation of material.  There is nothing more noble and elegant from an intellectual viewpoint than this: to resist through form.  Eladio Dieste

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

First - congrats on the job offer. I have had this happen a couple of times and I have handled this by telling company#1 that I needed a few days to decide. Then I contacted company#2 and informed the HR/manager I interviewed with that I had another job offer so his/her quick action would be appreciated. Just be open with them -you really would prefer company#2, but they must decide soon or you will take the offer from company#1. Nothing beats honesty sometimes - even in the hiring process.

If company#1 will not allow you a couple of days to decide, it isn't anywhere you want to work anyway.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Option 3: carry on like you did the day before.

How hard is it to pass up a job you don't want?

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Tick, when you need money coming in and pronto, that lax of an attitude will be a surefire way into losing your domicile.

As Elec suggested, tell #1 you'd like some time to think it over.  It's a big decision and any good company will not try to force you into a position by giving you the salesman-style "Better hurry, great offer going fast!" line.  Tell #2 you have already received an offer but are interested in them more, could they make an exception and speed up the process a bit.

If worse comes to worse and you have to make a decision, take job #1.  If #2 comes back with a better offer and you don't believe you'll be burning bridges, give your two week notice with #1.  If #2 doesn't come back, you'll still have a paycheck coming in.

Dan - Owner
http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

OP doesn't say whether he is currently employed (option #3).

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Nope,  but he does say that he is unemployed.

Eight lines down in the OP.

That being the case, I might be tempted to take the job offered and quit if a better job offer comes in.  Not very nice, but if they lost a big contract the day after you started,  they wouldn't think twice about letting you go. Business is Business.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Do you have second interview scheduled with the "desirable" company, or are you hoping that they will invite you back for a second?

In either case, there is no reason not to call the desired company and tell them "I have an offer in-hand from another company.  I'd prefer to work for you.  If you're interested, is there anything that can be done to speed the process up?  If you're not interested, please tell me now."

Likewise, there is no reason to not tell the company that made the offer that you need some time to make a decision.  You could even tell them the reason.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

hairpullAuugh!  I'm losing it.  I read twice and missed it.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

TheTick...

the second thing to go is the memory!

Dik

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

(OP)
MintJulep and Eleceng1:

What you are saying makes perfect sense.  The thing that bothers me is that there are not many engineering firms in my state that does buildings and are looking for Entry to Junior level structural engineers.  I have applied to almost all of them and I think I am down to the last one's. If I decide not to go with the one far away, I may be losing an oppurtunity to have a pay check versus the one that I one I want to go to yet they are still interviewing canadates for jobs.  Really, I dont want to the first job offer and want the second one.  I guess that is what I am really feeling at the moment of writing this yet, I need to have a pay check.  Still deciding on the best course of action.  I dont want to take a job and leave after two weeks because this is the one I want, assuming I get the job at the time.  It's crappy to do that to someone and though this is only business, still, I am not that type of person who leans on person knowing that I am using them for a short time only to leave after a while.  I rather get the job I want and stay and not go through the hassle of explaining why I am leaving.

The resisant virtues of the structure that we seek depend on their form; it is through their form that they are stable, not  because of an awkward accumulation of material.  There is nothing more noble and elegant from an intellectual viewpoint than this: to resist through form.  Eladio Dieste

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

It's not exactly clear from your posts exactly where you stand with the company that you want to work for.

It seems that you have had one interview with them.

After that interview did they say:

"We want to bring you back for a second interview."

or did they say

"We have some more candidates to interview and will select some to call for a second interview.?

In simple terms, do you have an appointment for the second interview, or are you hoping for a call?

In either case, the advice in my earlier post stands.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

(OP)
They said, they have more candidates to interview and looking to fit in 3 to 4 more people and it will take 3 to 4 weeks.  What they said is they usually call for a second interview if they are interested and will keep me posted.

The resisant virtues of the structure that we seek depend on their form; it is through their form that they are stable, not  because of an awkward accumulation of material.  There is nothing more noble and elegant from an intellectual viewpoint than this: to resist through form.  Eladio Dieste

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Calif (Structural)
The old saw "A bird in the hand beats two in the bush."
Still applies today.
Take the job that is offered and move later if the other one ever comes up, it may not.
B.E.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

I'd take the job at hand and see what happens with the other one.  It would not hurt to make your contacts at job #2 and let them know that you would like to work for them and are excited about the opportunity.  I would not mention job #1 at this point and go ahead and take it.

If the other job does come through, you can always give them 2 weeks notice and leave.  Just be honest that you have found something better to your liking and closer to home.

Ken

Ken
KE5DFR

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

If your concerns are holding off one decision in terms of allowing more time for a better proposal to come in, there is nothing wrong with that.  How long to hold off the decision is potentially the tricky part.  Have you received the first offer in writing?  Have you formally responded in writing?

In terms of potentially accepting and then moving on shortly afterward, it has been my experience that most companies start with a "probationary" period of about 90 days or so to see how a new candidate fits in to the work routine and interacts with others.  This works both ways as it provides you a taste of the work and people you would interact with regularly.  If you receive the second offer during that timeframe, you will have a taste of actual experience with which to compare firms.  That's what part of your training involves, comparing/evaluating information and making a decision.  How would the type of work compare, did you like or "fit" better with the people you met in one firm vs the other, are the chances of career development equivalent?  A lot of factors to consider.  You are really the only person with a vested interest in your career.

Good luck.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

(OP)
I have not received the first offer in writing but I am planning on writing him an email asking for a couple of days to see make a decision while showing that I may be interested.  I am also planning on calling or emailing the second company to see if are considering me for a job or not.  You see, the first interview I had gone to is the one I want but they said it may take a couple of weeks like 3 to four and that was during the first week of this month.  The second interview with the other company which was last week wants me to consider the offer yet I am more interested in the other.  So, it seems to me that I have to find a way to either extend the time so the other can make a decision or try to shorten it by calling them and see what they think taking me on as an employee.  I know it just business but I would not want to start a job,stay there for a week a two and then leave.  I've had too three jobs within 4 years and I am tired to jumping around.  I would like to stay at a place for awhile.

Calif

The resisant virtues of the structure that we seek depend on their form; it is through their form that they are stable, not  because of an awkward accumulation of material.  There is nothing more noble and elegant from an intellectual viewpoint than this: to resist through form.  Eladio Dieste

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Can ypu put the screws on company #2 in a nice way?  "Have offer, need to work, can't wait, what's you position?".  If you are what they want it could focus things.  I must admit I've never tried this kind of tactic, but jobs work both ways - they might not want to risk losing you if they want you.  Don't threaten, be honest.

- Steve

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

From the point of view of someone who does not make job offers lightly, I would be pretty disappointed in a candidate who accepted my job offer, and two weeks later left for their first choice.  Now I've lost the time I ivested in the search, and the several weeks I started training the new hire.  
I do not believe it is all about what is best for me-sometimes I think the ethical path is to consider all the ramifications of your decision.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

greenone,

While I would agree with you in a perfect world, the job market is far from perfect.  Gone are the days of holding until retirement age a job you started at right out of college.  Many (not all) companies these days look at their bottom line and simply say "Cut 30% of the workforce, starting with the highest paid employees."  Job security and loyalty are rare finds.  I held three jobs in three years simply because the market was poor... the companies didn't want to suffer a bit of red even though they had a lot of black the other years.

It may be the proper thing to tell both sides the entire story, but honesty won't feed my family.  Sometimes you have to look out for number one first, then you can be charitable.

Dan - Owner
http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

If you need a job right now, then I would take the one that is making you an offer.

If you want a better job, then I would wait to see if the company with the "right" job makes an offer.

I think it all comes down to how long you can wait, and how much you can risk not getting either job. To answer these two questions, you have to decide, not someone on an on-line posting board.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."   
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

(OP)
Ashereng:

I am more concern about the right thing to do by both owners.  I dont want to hold the guy for another position that may or may not be there yet push another to make a decision.  Also, I am unemployed so I need money to go to school and pay my bills.  In addition, I am young engineer and for the past 4 years, has not had the oversight and training which should be there for anyone wanting to be a engineer which to say, I am being picky on where I want to be.  I remember when I started the job search and I had my first interview, I told the project manager with complete honesty that although I work with firms, most of what I know comes from reading books.  Nobody really showed me anything about putting a building together.  He then asked me, do I think I can design a whole building together correctly?  I said, I dont know because no one has said, this is right, this is wrong.  He said, one of the problems in our industry is that there are alot of companies who do not train young engineer which brings our profession down.  He said he has seen it alot with people he has interviewed and appreciates me being honest with him.  At that moment, I knew I did not have the job because he wanted someone more skilled.  I am just kind of frustrated with looking for work and this career.  This career should have a manditory internship like doctors in which graduate must study under a licensed professional engineer and show some verifiable proof that he or she is competent.  Sorry for all the venting, just frustrated.

Calif

The resisant virtues of the structure that we seek depend on their form; it is through their form that they are stable, not  because of an awkward accumulation of material.  There is nothing more noble and elegant from an intellectual viewpoint than this: to resist through form.  Eladio Dieste

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

In the long run, you are much better off going for what you really want.  Don't count the "cost" of commuting a long ways, in terms of time and money, too lightly.  Quality of life is a huge factor and not always considered properly when the cupboards are bare.

It never hurts to be honest;  tell #1 you are interested but are waiting for a decision from #2.  Portray it as a fairness issue not that you favor one or the other.  Good luck!

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Calif,

Until you receive that first offer in writing and review/respond in kind, you still have time readily available to work with the possibility closer to you.  Make good use of that time.  It shows maturity on your part that you are concerned with beneficial outcomes to both parties.  

I agree with greenone that as an employer I would be disappointed with someone leaving for something else after a short time frame.  However, in the long run my group would be better off.  Having someone as part of a team that doesn't want to be there can be worse than not having a full staff.

Regards,

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Yes, it is a tough situation.

However, only you know what you need, and only you can balance the risks of what need to satisfy.

If you need money now, then you should take the job that is available now.

If you need a "good" job with the training and development, and you can wait for it, then you should wait.

Those are the issues that I can't decide for you.

With respect to the companies, yes, it doesn't look good to accept a job, and then leave within the month. Having said that, I personally, have experienced the opposit. After accepting a job at an agreed to salary, within the month, they decreased it by 20% unilaterally.

When companies need you, they say you should be loyal. When they don't need you, they say good bye and lay you off.

Anyone old enough to remember the 80's when petro companies laid off entire departments will understand that the first priority of companies is to take care of themselves, and the first priority for us is to take care of ourselves.

soapbox

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."   
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Your first priority is to take care of yorself.  The whole corporate structure has changed over the years and too many look up on employees as an expendable commidity.  They only want you to work and do not want to invest the time to train individuals.

If you can find a company that has a corporate approach that provides some training by letting you work in diferent departments and roles, you need to stay there long enough to get the necessary training.  If the company really wants to keep you now that they have invested the time to train you, they will have the benifits and compensation to keep you.

Try to find a senior engnieer to spend some time with and let him lead you and provide some guidance.  I know, I will try to help a youger engineer by showing him how to approach a problem and share any knowledge that I have with him or her.  

Sadly, the companies today, often won't provide the time to nuture the young engineers.

Where I work now, they have vendors come in for training on specific topics as well as have internally presented topics to help engineers in other dedpartments and disiplines.  I enjoy making a 30 minute to 60 minute presentation on my filed of expertise.

But it will not hurt to contact the 2nd company which you would prefer and let them know that you are very interested in working for them and tell them how you will be a benifit to them as well.  In other words, you have to sell yourself and your abilities to them.  Do some more research on them and ask some specific questions about somthing they do.  It will show your interest.  You need to show them that you are the best choice and that is now.

My wife used to work in HR and said the job seekers that were confident and had knowledge of what the company did had a much better chance of landing the job than some one that was just looking for a job.

Best of luck,
Ken

Ken
KE5DFR

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Plenty of good professional advice above. And to note you havent received any of the companies written offer yet. And to be honest I would be very careful to rely only on the written offer. and till then nothing is sure.
 
You are in the stream now, go with the flow.

Survival is the game.(as you are unemployed now! Not if you have plenty in your bank a/c) If you survive then only you can think of something more better.

And whatever the company may be, time only will tell you if you are going to get nurtured or not in that organisation. Too many a factors to think of. Is it guaranteed that you will get for sure what you want in #2 company but not in #1?

And in regards to learning I believe if the baby wont cry mother wont feed it. true, isnt it? If I wont show interest or ask persistently to my seniors they wont guide me either.
Good Luck.

Regards,

Siddharth
These are my personal views/opinions and not of my employer's.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Quote:

The thing that bothers me is that there are not many engineering firms in my state that does buildings and are looking for Entry to Junior level structural engineers.  I have applied to almost all of them and I think I am down to the last one's
I think most aspects have been covered pretty well. But if there really are only a small handful of companies that offer the work you seek in the location you seek, there is an extra impetus to not treat company #1 poorly.  If you hire on and leave in two weeks, you will guarantee to never get an offer there again.

I'm not saying that this consideration dictates your course of action. It is just one among many considerations, but  I don't think this aspect has been mentioned yet.

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

You need to learn all you can about propective companies. My worst engineering jobs were with companies with unqualified supervisors and managers. Translation: non-degreed oafs and clowns. Don't be afraid to ask.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

Star to Plasgears. Its worth noting, at least as I observed in Australia, that with the economic boom that is occurring here, good people are harder to find, and it becomes more likely that you will have to work with turkeys.

My employer supports further development and training initiatives, though in some areas leaves a bit to be desired, however, viewing of some of the third party consultants that we have had to deal with on a significant project makes me cringe.

The last thing that you want to do is to end up with an employer that ranks about the same level as the prior mentioned turkeys. Ensure that you find out as much as you can about your prospective employer, and always get the conditions in writing.

RE: Deciding Between two jobs

The best manager I ever had didn't have a degree.

But he knew his limits, and didn't try to do my job.  That's what made him good at doing his.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

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