1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
(OP)
I have to be honest, I find chat speak to be one of the worst thing that has developed from the internet.
I cringe everytime someone asks: how are u doing? How much time is gained from not typing two letters?
I also appreciate that language is about communication, if I'm fully able to understand the intent of the communication then I appreciate it is doing its job. I'm not talking about the paragraph of misspelled words that I get emailed every couple months, but actually paring down the language for brevity and ease of typing and particularily texting.
Am I a dinosaur unable to move with the times (my 17 year old sister-in-law thinks so). Is 'chat speak' the wave of the future? Is there really anything wrong with someone asking for help on Eng-Tips using a common form (although relatively new) of written communication?
Example 1:
http://www .eng-tips. com/viewth read.cfm?q id=194967& amp;page=1
Example 2:
http://www .eng-tips. com/viewth read.cfm?q id=195694& amp;page=1
I cringe everytime someone asks: how are u doing? How much time is gained from not typing two letters?
I also appreciate that language is about communication, if I'm fully able to understand the intent of the communication then I appreciate it is doing its job. I'm not talking about the paragraph of misspelled words that I get emailed every couple months, but actually paring down the language for brevity and ease of typing and particularily texting.
Am I a dinosaur unable to move with the times (my 17 year old sister-in-law thinks so). Is 'chat speak' the wave of the future? Is there really anything wrong with someone asking for help on Eng-Tips using a common form (although relatively new) of written communication?
Example 1:
http://www
Example 2:
http://www





RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
As people of my background die off or lose influence, that assessment may change. Already, business prose is nowhere near as flowery as it was 50 years ago. I see people from non-English-speaking countries trying to do a nice formal job with their English, and it seems so...Victorian, I don't know. And maybe to them, my somewhat informal style is shocking.
My email and posts are significantly less formal, much closer to my speaking patterns, than anything I write that's intended to go on a printed page. Everything's on a continuum.
I haven't seen too much chatspeak in the particular fora I happen to frequent in Eng-Tips, but I see some of it in another professional forum I read. Oddly, it's the non-native English speakers who seem most likely to do it. I wonder if it's because most of their English practice comes from online chats.
Whether it's "wrong" or not depends on the norms. Around here, most people don't do it, so it's certainly out of place, and to the poster's disadvantage since they're less likely to be taken seriously.
Hg, who took years to stop typing "ppl" instead of "people" after spending way too much time on the BITNET Relay
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
OMG GTR, TTYL!
:)
--
Erik
MO P.E.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
I'm on the upper limit of generation Y, or whatever you want to call it, and it still bugs the #$%$#@ out of me.
I don't like it in emails, online forum etc.
I can just about put up with it in text messages but A. I don't do them much any more and B. it's still a little annoying.
I'm less likely to respond to posts full of that @%$#@% than one in regular text. (Some regular members may want to use this to their advantage
Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with and use Acronyms and abbreviations that are common in whatever context I'm writing/reading e.g CAD, FEA, FMEA, FMECA for this site. Also I try to be tolerant of spelling mistakes & poor grammer on this site because English isn't everyones first language, We're Engineers not English Teachers (not so applicable in this particular forum) and I'm one of the worst offenders.
However, in my honest opinon (note not IMHO
When using a full keyboard, which I assume most people do when posting here, there's little excuse for it, especially for relative youngsters, learn to touch type!
In fact, learning to type/taking a keyboard course should probably be compulsary to graduate university if not High School these days. Probably wouldn't put an end to it though.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
I think you just convinced me that the OP is right, in fact I think it should be banned on this site
It took me several minutes to work out what the heck you were saying. (Still not sure about GTR, no I don't care don't feel the need to explain)
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
At least, unless the post was serious...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
The worst to me though is the 1337 crap. For those who don't know, it's called "LEET" speak, short(?) for "Elite" and they substitute numbers with similar shapes as letters. 1 = l, 2 = Z, 3 = E, 5 = S, 6 = b, 7 = T, 9 = g and 0 = o. So in that above name, 1337 is supposed to look like lEET. Then of course they mix them up since there are only 8 numbers that work, making the already truncated sentences look ridiculous. Kids use it a lot. I hate that crap...
(BTW, GTR = Got To Run)
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Sheesh. I'm over 40.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
(can't spell "l337 |-|4><0r" without 'em) would fall by the wayside.
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
I also wondered why KENAT was opposed to the use of IMHO - then on reading further I saw the difficulty in using ONLY abbrivations commonly known to the READER (not the writer).
1337???????? I didn't know how old I was. I hadn't even seen or hea5rd the term befor this thread :) [are smiley
faces also part of chat speak?)
LOL GTR ETC ETC ETC
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Y'all realize, yes, that the first round of eleet haqzors are in their 30s by now...
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
But it's when people start using lazy speak for correspondence that my skin starts to crawl.
I used to be a teaching assistant for a first year class.. This was an email actually sent out to all the professors and TA's (I saved it for posterity):
When one of the other TA's wrote back asking him to rephrase the question in english, the student actually filed a complaint saying that his request was discriminatory. If this guy made it through, he should be graduating in 2009. I shake my head every time I read that one.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
1337 h4x0rz 53cr37 |\/!3371n6! We pwn j00!
......Ok, that's enough, It took my entire lunch period to type that out. I'm part of GenY and it bugs the everliving crud out of me to see that drivel all over.
In personal emails I'll use AFAIK, IMHO, and some of the more common ones, but only with friends who know what it means. Family blogs, emails, on webpages, and CERTAINLY at work, I use complete, well punctuated sentences, as best as I know how.
Heck, I hate when people put Xmas.
--
Erik
MO P.E.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
For those of you missing it, these pre date text messaging.
Type them into your calculator, turn it upside down, imagine you’re about 10 (and if necessary male) and snigger with glee.
I’m not yet 30 and don’t use that drivel (text speak) except very occasionally in text messages, which now I’ve grown up I don’t send as much.
justkeepgiviner, while I doubt it I hope that student gets failed, or at least has the error of his ways made clear to him. Asking for easier exams so he can go home in the holidays, and using text speak in said request should be grounds for expulsion IMHO
L8er
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Say, does anyone (I guess baby boomer or older) remember the whole joke/story that went with 71077345? It involved adding numbers or some other such arithmetic and then that was the punchline. Since I was still in nursery school when I saw someone doing it, I didn't really process whatever geopolitical humor was going on there at the time.
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
So, if chat speak is taken to be a form of short hand, then it is what it is.
Not everybody knew or understood Pitman (or the other systems) back in the day, why would it be expected of chat speak now?
"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
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RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Chat/1337/IM speak isn't just shorthand, it's an attempt to show that they belong to the "club/gang/group/tribe". Trouble is, it's become so ingrained into some users and they believe it to be acceptable for general use. They just don't know any better.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
http://p
I think the version that I was told in the 70's was slightly different (more politically correct?), but the calculation was the same.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
57739 57734 40
which, upside down was "Oh hells bells".
Small things amused small minds back then.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
People that get no substantive response to their questions will either rephrase them or leave and not come back. I don't have a problem with either outcome.
David (born towards the end of the baby boom)
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
"Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?" Oddball, "Kelly's Heros" 1970
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RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
1337 is only annoying because it is outdated and those who tend to use it tend to believe they are being clever.
IMHO, chatspeak on the other hand, is already having a tremendous influence on English and other languages. It doesn't represent the future per se, but it is already a part of it.
In addition to chatspeak, there is two forms of outdated pagercode (one based around a common 3 digit number representing a particular statement, and one that is based on number for letter replacement, similar to but much friendlier than 1337). Anyone here page their g/f with "143" or "831" back in the day? C'mon, raise your hand! hehe
I like to pull out the old codes once in awhile cuz u can still keep messages sub rosa to the majority of other people. No real reason that should annoy others, unless of course they are using 1337. :)
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
By the way - what is lol ? My daughter says it is "laugh out loud" but I always thought it was "lots of love." ???
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
This is true to a point. Our language is constantly changing. Some terms that in the past may have been considered improper are now the prefered method of speak. You don't hear "I give my children a ride to school", but rather "I dropped the kids off at school" is more common, and if anyone said the first phrase, others would note that as a bit odd.
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Wouldn't "I gave my children a ride to school" be equivalent to "I dropped the kids off at school"?
I do hear the former phrasing about as often as the latter. Guess once again I'm old before my time.
Anyway, to summarize my opinion as regards the OP, Chat speak is not appropriate for Eng Tips.
After all these are:
I don't find it professional, or especially intelligent, to use Chat Speak in this context.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Although being a Brit maybe it's the whole cultural shebang.
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Dolly Parton was a size 69 (key in 69) and her doctor said this was too, too, too big (key in 222). He gave her 51 pills (key in 51) to take 8 times a day (multiply the 6922251 by 8) and that left her... and turn the calculator upside down and press equals (or times for us RPN folks).
I get chastised in non-professional forums at times because I make it a point to use good grammar and punctuation. I, too, think "chatspeak" isn't viewed favorably in professional settings, however.
I had problems with pain in my hands from typing since I took the class in high school [Aside - I was the only male in my typing class - it was still considered a girly class, but I saw the computer writing on the wall]. I found out about a keyboard layout that supposedly helped with this (from the author of ThisIsTrue.com). It's called the Dvorak layout and it has helped me tremendously. I went from 40wpm to 60, reduced my errors, and I can type page after page without tiring. It took about 6 months for me to make the switch about 10 years ago, and I've never looked back.
If you "heard" it on the internet, it's guilty until proven innocent. - DCS
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
If you're gonna pick grammatical nits, I should point out that "dropped...off" ain't no split infinitive. [Right here is me refraining from going on a big rant about the ill-foundedness of the prohibition against split infinitives.] It's a phrasal verb, and not only is it allowed to be split, but in some cases splitting is required--you can say, "I dropped them off," but you can't say, "I dropped off them."
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Irregardless, I ain't unloosening that bolt myself.
--
Erik
MO P.E.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Which reminds me of Stan Freberg's "Green Chri$tma$" routine "...As sure as there's an X in Christmas, you can be sure those are Tiny Tim Chestnuts roasting..." If you've never hear anything by Freberg, check it out. Nearly 50 years old but still good.
RE: 1337 or Chat speak on Eng-Tips
Or then again is that snobbery.
Latin abbreviations are OK while modern ones aren't?
QED etc seem perfectly reasonable to use in a proffesional setting, text speak perhaps not so much.
(I was going to put something smart with Verily, forsooth and twixt here but it's just not coming)
KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...