how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
(OP)
hi all,
Can anyone tell me how to calculate normal liquid flow rate to standard liquid flow rate.
@ 345 F, 500 psig, I have liquid flow rate of 1400 gpm, molecular weight 60. I want to calculate flow rate in standard condition i.e. what will sgpm ?
thanks
Can anyone tell me how to calculate normal liquid flow rate to standard liquid flow rate.
@ 345 F, 500 psig, I have liquid flow rate of 1400 gpm, molecular weight 60. I want to calculate flow rate in standard condition i.e. what will sgpm ?
thanks





RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Is this a joke? Are you a practicing Chemical Engineer?
Where did you hear about "Normal" and "Standard" liquids?
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
W = mass flow (kg/h)
Q actual = W / density at actual T+P
Q normal= W / density at "normal" T+P
Q standard= W / density at "standard" T+P
"Normal" T+P = 0 C and 1 atm typically.
"Standard" T+P = 60 F and 1 atm typically.
In refineries we typically express gases in "normal" flow and liquids in "standard" flow.
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
It also surprises me that in a particular refinery gases would be referred to a base case in Celsius units while liquids are referred to Fahrenheit. In my experience either Celsius or Fahrenheit is used consistently for both gases and liquids on one site.
Katmar Software
Engineering & Risk Analysis Software
http://katmarsoftware.com
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
There are tables in the GPSA that could be used for hydrocarbons, if thats what you have. If you have hydrocarbons, you may have a difficult time finding the answer. At 60 MW, you've got nearly a Butane molecule and it won't be a liquid at at the conditions stated. It is really close the the criticle point too.
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Johnny Pellin
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Katmar Software
Engineering & Risk Analysis Software
http://katmarsoftware.com
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
I've seen the acronym sgpm being used by Honeywell on measuring instrumentation for liquids.
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
I suppose the exotic liquids along with very high and very low temperatures and pressures in a refinery or chemical plant would force some sort of standard into volume reporting. Either that or report everything in mass flow rates (come to think of it every PFD I've ever seen has been in mass units).
David
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Thank you for reply particularly who works in petroleum industry. And for Montemayor & pleckner, i hope now you realize the fact of standard and normal flow rate.
If you are still not cleared about standard and normal condition, go to any simulator like Promax and select any hydrocarbon stream with providing temp, pressure,composition & flow rate and when it converged, it will show you standard and normal flow rate which are totally different. And now i understand it's because of ratio of specific gravities.
thank you,
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
I come to this site in order to discuss engineering issues with professionals. Personal attacks and insults have no place here. I feel some applogies are in order.
Johnny Pellin
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
I realize that English may not be the first language of the original poster. I think perhaps some of the confusion arose when he asked how to convert "normal" liquid flow rates to "standard" liquid flow rates.
Many of us think of "normal" flow rates as the metric connotation of Nm3 per unit of time, as used for gases.
I think the confusion would not have arisen had the original poster said he wanted to convert "actual" liquid flow rates at the given temperature to "standard" liquid flow rates at a defined temperature.
I worked in refinery operations and refinery design for about 50 years myself and we used "actual" and "standard" to describe liquid flow rates at different temperatures, and we used tables to obtain hydrocarbon liquid densities at the different temperatures.
So perhaps you could find it in your heart to forgive Phil Leckner and Art Montemayor who have made many, many important contributions to this forum as well as to other forums.
Milton Beychok
(Visit me at www.air-dispersion.com)
.
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Second, in re-reading my post I don't see where this can be considered an "attack" as I was only seeking to understand if the OP was confusing fluid states.
Third, just to educate me in the ways of the refinery world, are you talking about standard "gpm" or standard barrels? It seems everyone here is answering the question in what appears to me at least to be in terms of standard barrels and not standard gpm.
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
thank you for excellent remarks and understanding. i used wrong word "normal" instead of "actual" in discussion. so, it's my mistake. Montemayor and pleckner, i know u guys are expert in your area and my intention of reply is not to hurt any of you.
thank you,
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
Perhaps I overstated my concerns. Mr. Leckner, I did not intend to insinuate that you insulted or attacked anyone. You did not. I was referring to Mr. Montemayor's reply. I am sorry if I stirred up hard feelings. As gcet007 makes clear, no harm, no foul. He took no offense. So the issue is best forgotten.
Johnny Pellin
RE: how to calculate standard liquid flow rate
From "Data Book on Hydrocarbons", page 145, we find a chart with a family of curves. Thermal expansion coefficient depends on molal average boiling point.
You divide actual flow over expansion coefficient to obtain flow at the standard 60 degF.
Expansion coefficients at 345 F, for different MABPs as follows:
MABP / Expansion @345F
200 / 1.255
300 / 1.21
400 / 1.185
500 / 1.165
600 / 1.155
800 / 1.13
1000 / 1.12