computer design software
computer design software
(OP)
I'm trying to update my company's computer design software, and I would like to get some opinions on which people prefer. We do building design...mostly steel and concrete (we also do some water treatment plants), and some wood and masonry thrown in there as well. We currently have RISA and an older version of RAM. We also have STAAD, but I have not used that extensively. Any opinions on what we should be using?






RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
Nowadays, I use SAP2000 for everything because I'm doing vibrations research.
The big downside to any CSi product is the interface. The programs are extremely powerful, but they provide enough irritating "features" that it's a real turn-off to me.
One thing to think about if you go from RISA to something like RAM is quality control. Like any other tool, it can be mis-used.
We've seen some pretty crazy stuff from folks who mis-used automated systems. It's obvious that they had the cad guy import a grid, add framing, modify loads and criteria, and hit "go" and then export dxf back to cad. Then cad guy cleaned it up and sent it out the door with inadequate checking. With tight schedules and low fees, this can apparently be very tempting.
On one job, the guy had "shored" turned on and the beams were undersized by 2-3x. The owner called us for help after the first bay almost collapsed when they tried to place concrete on it. There were W12x14 in places were W16x31 should've been. It was completely obvious that nobody checked the output. The insane sizes got by everybody. This was from a reputable firm.
We tried to start using RISAFloor at one point and one of our 15 year guys tried it first. He had a bunch of same length beams with trib widths 6"-12" different and it spat back a different reaction and number of studs for every beam. Got right by him and ended up on the drawings.
One of my buddies is a steel detailer and he said he wishes he had a quarter for every braced frame he's seen over the last few years that had W14x22 beams with HSS12x12x1/2 braces with huge axial loads. Both W14 nodes are attached to the diaphragm so it gets no axial load. If an engineer is mentally closer to the modeling procedure, then he'll catch this. If he's designing via nintendo, then maybe he will, maybe he won't.
I'm not saying that automated systems are horrible. One has to be VERY cognizant of the underlying psychology to avoid falling into these traps. You need to come up with some kind of quality control procedure.
My only idea is to forbid any drawing from going out the door without an experienced engineer taking a HARD COPY and highlighting each and every beam to ensure that a human actually freakin' mentally registered the size.
Anyway, off my soap box...
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
Here's an example. In RISA, you have a menu where you define what units you want to use. ft for length, klf for a line load, ksi for strength & E, etc. In SAP and ETABS, you have to use consistent units, kip & inch for example. Say you want to change the concrete props. You have to change to lb & ft and go into the menu to set the weight in pcf. Then you exit the menu and set it to kip & inch. Go back into the menu and set f'c and E. I think that's totally doofus. The other option, of course, is to input one of them in unfamiliar units, not the end of the world, but it's still doofus, LOL.
I think RISA is easier than anything else I've used. When their new version came out, I really hoped that they'd upgraded it to do buckling, time history, etc., but it doesn't look like they did.
RE: computer design software
Enercalc is good for discreet elements. It can be cumbersome for multi-spans beams, though.
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
"checking a model" sounds more like scanning through the menus to make sure numbers and settings are input correctly.
IMHO, the only acceptable way to check the plans is the old fashioned way. Print the plans and look at them, LOL. There seems to be something that's lost while looking at the screen. I don't know if it's the additional burden of having to deal with the program or if it's not being able to see everything at once at a familiar scale (like 1/8"=1'-0").
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
I've wondered over the last few years, with all the talk of EDI, RAM, SDS, etc. whether old fashioned checks like at your old firm will become less common. If so, then that would seem to me to be a disaster waiting to happen.
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
We have, however, had about 12 hours worth of seminars within our firm to come up with reasonable defaults for the program. I do agree with you, however, that we there should always be someone reviewing it with a fresh set of eyes.
I feel like our environment is so fast-paced that no one wants to take the time. Another thing I don't like about all these programs is that unless it is a connection detail, I rarely get to design anything by hand. I have done some concrete and masonry shearwalls and some very large combined footings, but I haven't done a beam or column by hand since I finished school!
RE: computer design software
Like you typed, nobody's going to have time to check somebody else's stuff, at least not in any firm I've worked for.
You have a valid concern wrt not doing manual calcs. This is an extreme example, but we had one licensed SE with 12 years of experience who came from a firm that used automated systems. He hadn't designed anything manually for years. He actually asked one of our 3 year guys whether deflections were checked with factored or service loads. He could barely calc wind and seismic loads. Granted, this was an extreme case, but lesser dulling of technical skills is bound to occur with lack of practice.
RE: computer design software
http://www.gtstrudl.gatech.edu/
They are proud that they can pass the NRC quality control tests for structural software used in Nuclear Power Plant design and maintenance. There is a free student edition with all capabilities but limits on number of joints.
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I have been called "A storehouse of worthless information" many times.
RE: computer design software
The only hand calcs I get to do for steel is connections (not shear too often, but many unique moment connections), designing side plates for WF beams subject to torsion, and some other miscellaneous stuff. I have done quite a bit of hand calcs for concrete. I have also done quite a bit for wind and snow (including irregular drift conditions).
I think I might be venting a little because we have a lot of projects in CA right now and I haven't done any design work in at least 6 weeks!!!
RE: computer design software
RE: computer design software
structure type (truss, frame, space)
joint coordinates
support joints/conditions
member indicies
member properties
loads
analysis (static, dynamic, etc)
output
The commands are very simple and since STRUDL has been around quite sometime, many programs like STAAD have similar commands.
Regards,
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RE: computer design software
The area where GTStrudl really shines is in tech support. If you have a question, you call Georgia Tech and talk directly to the software developers who are mostly professors in the Civil Engineering Department.
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I have been called "A storehouse of worthless information" many times.