Stamp Removal
Stamp Removal
(OP)
Is an engineer allowed to remove his stamp on an existing project even though they have been payed for it?
For example if Engineer A works for Firm B, and they are under contract. Engineer A asks the EIT's to do the design it, after which Engineer A checks it and stamps it. Engineer A then quits Firm B. Firm B then replaces Engineer A with Engineer C. Engineer A requests that his stamp be removed and that Firm B cannot use the design, though most of the work was done by EITs in Firm B,the contract is with Firm B, and Firm B payed Engineer A for his work. Is the work the property of Engineer A or Firm B?
For example if Engineer A works for Firm B, and they are under contract. Engineer A asks the EIT's to do the design it, after which Engineer A checks it and stamps it. Engineer A then quits Firm B. Firm B then replaces Engineer A with Engineer C. Engineer A requests that his stamp be removed and that Firm B cannot use the design, though most of the work was done by EITs in Firm B,the contract is with Firm B, and Firm B payed Engineer A for his work. Is the work the property of Engineer A or Firm B?





RE: Stamp Removal
Signature under construction, sorry about the mess - Steve
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
As long as the design that you approved and stamped is not changed, I can't imagine any circumstances where you would want your stamp removed. If the EITs change the design, Engineer C should stamp their new work but that doesn't seem like reason to take Engineer A's stamp off the superseded design.
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
It seems reasonable for Engineer A to ask that someone within the firm take over the project and become EOR if there is substantial work left to be done or changes to be made. But to ask that his stamp be removed from former work because he doesn't work there anymore sounds like trying to get out of responsibility.
ZCP
www.phoenix-engineer.com
RE: Stamp Removal
Same deal at the firm before that, and the three before that one.
Signature under construction, sorry about the mess - Steve
RE: Stamp Removal
A drawing with no stamp in many industries is just a piece of paper with a bunch of lines on it. Removing the stamp could make the drawings worthless and I would never pay someone to not do work for me.
No work or drawings, no money.
Pretty simple equation.
RE: Stamp Removal
Regards
RE: Stamp Removal
You should keep a copy of the drawings you stamped. They can change your design.
The way that should be done is the next engineer clouds the changes he/she made and stamps the drawing with a note that says " this stamp for changes on Rev 1 only" or words to that effect.
However they could just change something on the drawing or verbally OK a change in construction or document it on a RFI. Either way there could be a change you don't know about. It could be trival or something serious.
I would demand a set of record or as-built drawings as well. They should be willing to give those to you. There may be some other drawings or vendor submittals you are entitled to as well. Your stamp is on the drawings and your the one of the ones whom the lawyers would come after.
Your entitled to protect yourself.
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
Do not worry, Eng A is hosed big-time, you are totally clear. An EIT is supposed to do legwork, including calculations. An EIT is, by definition "In Training".
Signature under construction, sorry about the mess - Steve
RE: Stamp Removal
But....
This would then open up Engineer A to legal proceedings as the drawings then become worthless to the firm B who already paid for them via Engineer A's salary (per JamesBarlow comments above).
It's not that the drawings and stamp "belong" to the firm. The drawings and stamp are simply instruments of service and Engineer A willingly took a salary to provide that service.
By "pulling stamp" Engineer A is effectively stealing the salary that was paid.
RE: Stamp Removal
Stay with "Firm B". Don't worry about "Engineer A". Let "Firm B" worry about "Engineer A".
If you are asked to redo your work, be a good soldier and do it. This won't be the first time your work is lost or undone. Accept it.
Remember that you are not responsible for Enginer A's actions. If anything, he was responsible for yours on behalf of Firm B. Firm B signs your paychecks. It is Firm B's responsbility to see that you are properly managed and trained.
RE: Stamp Removal
Dik
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
To pull a stamp, that is usually reserved for mistakes discovered after the fact, not employment and bridge burning issues.
"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
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RE: Stamp Removal
Each jurisdiction may have different rules but generally, if engineer A stamped a set of drawings that has been permitted by AHJ, engineer A's stamp "remains" with the plans. Engineer B, one the responsibility is delegated to, is responsible for all subsequent work involving modifications to the original permit set.
If the delegation is made prior to permit, engineer B shall review all previous design done under engineer A and put his stamp. Engineer A is not "recorded" as the engineer of record by the AHJ.
The above apply to standard AEC projects involving buildings/public works. I would check with the AHJ on how to proceed.
RE: Stamp Removal
RE: Stamp Removal
Sounds wrong to me. AHJs deal with how the design and construction comply with applicable codes. City building departments may or may not require stamps for certain projects. Most places I have worked if I went to the city and wanted to pull a stamp they would let me if I had a good reason. Lots of things get built without a stamp.
There are reasons to pull a stamp. As noted above just being POed at your previous employer is not a good one.
Changes I have heard of that would cause me to pull a stamp were 1.) In a "value engineering" move the general contractor changed the HVAC system. that changed the electrical load. 2.) The owners of a building changed the purpose from something like a group home to "Assisted Living" facility. The change didn't change walls etc. but it does require a little more detail in the electrical system.
More than once I have told people wanting me to sign off on a "Value Engineering" proposal to get their own engineer to sign off on it. Value engineering is OK if that's what it is but a lot of time it's a cover for buying cheaper, smaller equipment or doing less.
RE: Stamp Removal
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Dik
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David
RE: Stamp Removal
almost anyone can be a target... either individually or jointly...
Dik
RE: Stamp Removal
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My understanding of how the US PE system works at any rate.
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Dik
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Your right. If the teck/EIT won the lottery or inherited a lot of money he would go to the top of the list.