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Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Benefits of obtaining a PE license

(OP)
Hello all,
I am a Mechanical engineer with 4 years of experience in design / FEA field. I also have a Masters degree in Mech. Engg. I am thinking about obtaining my PE license in the state of TX but I wanted to look for any inputs from experienced  people as to what is the real advantage of obtaining this license.

I dont see myself starting my own firm in the next 5-7 years. Are there any real benefits in investing time in preparing for the exam now? Does it have a value only if you are a consultant in any particular field or Is it just another certification?

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I find that HR types love to see PE on your resume. I have not used mine much, but I am glad I have it.

-The future's so bright I gotta wear shades!

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Master's in Mechanical.  PE in Alabama.  NCEES record.  I am a consultant, but I got the PE for me...not some planned benefit.  It is important if you want to do anything in the construction area (HVAC, Commercial Piping, etc.), and as a consultant, it gives some credibility.  States are moving in the direction of requiring a PE for professional witness testimony with some exceptions.  If you are ever going to do it, do it now...I encourage everyone to pursue it.  As far as a "global benefit", I think it opens up some career opportunities that otherwise might not exist, but it is critical for architects and civil engineers...doesn't seem as critical for general mechanical engineers, particularly those in large firms or industries.

Garland E. Borowski, PE
Borowski Engineering & Analytical Services, Inc.
Lower Alabama SolidWorks Users Group

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I'd say go ahead and do it if convenient.  Especially if your employer will cover the cost.

One issue is that while you may never need it at your current employer, you might wish to have it if you change, and it takes a couple of months or more to go through all the paperwork.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Search for job listings in your field or mechanical engineers at careerbuilders.com

Most likely, you will find that your employment opportunities are much greater with the PE as compared to without.

I was in your shoes 30 years ago. As you progress later in your career you will see that the time invested early in carreer will be rewarding as to more opportunities available.

In addition, engineering is evolving to the point of specialist where a BS is only the first step.  Let me give you an example (It is practically mandatory that in this era, teachers require a master degree to obtain a position. A BS is no longer sufficient by itself).

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Search this site.  This topic has been covered before, with good information provided by many people.

Regards,

Cory

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

At your age, i would net even hesitate to get it. Like it or not, they are going to require it sooner or later.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Other than window dressing for me, it is probably not a bad idea to get one. You would be surprised at how much it dazzles some employers who think that it is the crowning achievement in the profession and it even has a "professional ring" to it. Even a masters degree doesn't usually evoke such response.
Of course, if you do municipal work etc. it may be necessary to sign off on drawings and thus would be mandatory.
So, my 2 cents says get it!
I'm not sure if you must renew it every year if you don't need it, especially given the high fees for renewal, which is a joke. I personally have never needed it in 30 years and have never renewed it, but I am still a PE since I passed the test.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Ditto what GBor said.

I have one, but have never used it since my work is in the area of manufacturing automation engineering.  I maintain an inactive status so that I can put the "P.E." behind my name.  The benefit for me over the years:
(1) legitimized my claim to be an "engineer".  In my field, it seems like any joker holding a wrench can call himself an engineer, and get away with it.
(2) It opened a few doors for employment opportunities.
(3) In my moonlighting business, there is a definite "sales & marketing" advantage to having it.

TygerDawg

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

It surely adds credence to your qualificaitons.

For one, you will not lose anything. There is only gain to be had. How much is upto you.

In normal MEP/civil/structural consulting firm, a PE license makes the difference of about 10% in salary whethere or not you stamp the drwaings or not.

In consulting business a PE is far more valuable, err essential than a ME degree.

It will also makes a difference when a promotion time comes up and everything else being equal, one with a PE holds a clear edge, even in non-consulting business.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

If you haven't renewed, then your license is void by now, and you can't use a PE title.  At least that's the way it works in TX.  It doesn't just mean you passed a test.

See if your employer will pick up the renewal fees.  I think $225 or $235 or so in Texas (IE, they use it to generate revenue).  Most states are much cheaper.

Generally, if your license lapses, you can renew it within several months or a year just by paying an extra penalty.  If you wait too long, you have to go through the application process again (of course, you wouldn't need to take the test again.)

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

In Texas you can take an industrial exemption if you are not offering services to the general public, then you can claim exemption to the $200 fee.

-The future's so bright I gotta wear shades!

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

quote
"If you haven't renewed, then your license is void by now, and you can't use a PE title.  At least that's the way it works in TX.  It doesn't just mean you passed a test.

SAYS WHO.
Why don't you tell my perpective employers that. I will use that title wherever and whenever I want since I passed the test. Moreover as long as I am not signing off on any drawings it is still a valid description of my background.
I suppose if some state wanted you to pay them a fee to keep a masters degree active and you refused, then would that mean you no longr could claim the degree?
I think you ought to join the PE police and investigate all those who are not complying by paying a silly fee for no need. I think we are a danger to society.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Although not explicitly stated, we'll assume you are somewhere in the US.

In Canada, the term is "P.Eng.", and you can ONLY call yourself an "engineer" if you are registered with your provincial association.

Microsoft keeps pushing the MCSE (Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer) designation, but they've been taken to court in Canada because you can't call people engineers if they aren't PEngs.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

ksbarry, I would absolutely recommend that you earn your license, if you are so inclined.  Even if you do not currently need it, it will help to open doors for you and may even lead to increased compensation at an unexpected time.  If you not motivated to put in the time and resources to pass, don't waste your time.

Zekeman, Says EVERY state licensing board in the United States.  If you are not a licensed (current and paid) engineer in a particular state, you can NOT put P.E. after your name or claim the title Professional Engineer, Licensed Engineer or a few other reserved titles.  You may correctly state that you have passed the Professional Engineering licensing exam (Principles and Practice of Engineering), but it is illegal to use the designation P.E. after your name if you are not currently licensed.  In fact, it is illegal to use the designation in a state you are not licensed in, even if you are licensed in another state.  Your "perpective employers" should try to validate your claim if a P.E. is essential to your PERSPECTIVE position.  When your claim doesn't check out, one of them may indeed turn you in to the state board and you will be fined and/or barred from becoming licensed in that state.  Also, a master's degree is not regulated by the state.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Here's what the state laws of Texas have to say about it:

SUBCHAPTER G. LICENSE REQUIREMENTS
§ 1001.301. License Required
(a) A person may not engage in the practice of engineering unless the person holds a license issued under this chapter.
(b) Except as provided by Subsection (f), a person may not, unless the person holds a license issued under this chapter, directly or indirectly
use or cause to be used as a professional, business, or commercial identification, title, name, representation, claim, asset, or means of
advantage or benefit any of, or a variation or abbreviation of, the following terms:
(1) “engineer”;
(2) “professional engineer”;
(3) “licensed engineer”;
(4) “registered engineer”;
(5) “registered professional engineer”;
(6) “licensed professional engineer”; or
(7) “engineered.”
(c) Except as provided by Subsection (f), a person may not directly or indirectly use or cause to be used an abbreviation, word, symbol,
slogan, or sign that tends or is likely to create an impression with the public that the person is qualified or authorized to engage in the
practice of engineering unless the person holds a license and is practicing under this chapter.

§ 1001.353. Procedure for Renewal
(c) A person whose license has been expired for more than 90 days but less than two years may renew the license by paying to the Board
the required annual renewal fee, a late renewal fee and any applicable increase in fees as required by Section 1001.206 for each delinquent
year or part of a year.
(d) A person whose license has been expired for two years or more may not renew the license. The person may obtain a new license by
complying with the requirements and procedures, including the examination requirements, for obtaining an original license.

In other words, when your license is expired and is not renewed, you're not a registered engineer, can't call yourself such.

You might also note that the various licensing boards do issue rosters (usually available online) of all currently licensed engineers.  If anyone you're ever dealing with decides to look you up on the roster (which is a handy way to verify company and name spelling, by the way), they'll find out right quick your actual status.

You might also note that taking the test(s) is just part of the licensing process.  You could, in Texas, get licensed without the tests, and you could conceivably take the test and never get licensed.  They're not the same thing.

Most states have similar rules, and most states have their rules online.  If in any doubt, call up your state licensing board and ask them.

I would be curious if you still drive with your 30-year-old driving license.  I took a test for that, too.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

"I would be curious if you still drive with your 30-year-old driving license.  "

Sure. Mine covered me from date of issue until I am 70. Quite whether the nasty plastic folder will survive another 24 years is another matter.



Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Sorry if I offended all you PEs.please don't have me arrested for using the designation. I will be careful not to show up in public. And if it suits you, I will not call myself a PE, because to get reinstated it may take most of my pension money and I figure I need every penny of it rather than enrich the state coiffers.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

On the original question, I agree with the crowd.

The effort will likely be minimal (especially if you just finished your MS).  I'm pretty sure you get 3 chances at the test, so why even bother studying for the first one. Just take it cold the first time and only study if you have to retake.  The only minor hassle is the paperwork for application.

The credential to put on your resume and business cards and Christmas cards (just kidding) is noteworthy.  And signing your name as K S Barry PE is not quite as tacky as K S Barry MSME imo.  With the industry exemption that Steve mentioned in TX, I think it's only $30 a year for renewal.  As mentioned by others, a PE is perhaps comparable to a MS in terms of recognition, even though the time youl would invest into a PE would likely be a  tiny fraction of the time you spent on your MS. Bottom line... it's a NO-BRAINER decision.

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Quote "The credential to put on your resume and business cards and Christmas cards (just kidding) is noteworthy.  And signing your name as K S Barry PE is not quite as tacky as K S Barry MSME imo.  With the industry exemption that Steve mentioned in TX, I think it's only $30 a year for renewal.  As mentioned by others, a PE is perhaps comparable to a MS in terms of recognition, even though the time youl would invest into a PE would likely be a  tiny fraction of the time you spent on your MS. Bottom line... it's a NO-BRAINER decision."

Depends on the industry. In my case, I worked mostly in the aerospace field and never saw a manager get excited over any candidate having a PE license. it was never a requrement. Advanced degrees were held in higher esteem as they should. In fact very few people had the PE license.
My point was that while it is a good achievement and it certainly should be required  for certain documentation, since it forces a minimum level of expertise, and I recommend it, all engineers don't NEED one.
Lastly,Greg, I believe you.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I once was offered and accepted a job as substation maintenance engineer for a large electric utility.  Even though there was absolutely no design or stamping required, an Electrical PE was required for all the substation maintenance engineers at this utility..  

There was one weird part.  Apparently there was some accident at one point in the company's corporate history involving oil processing of a transformer.  As a result the task of running the transformer oil vacuum/processing truck was now reserved for engineers only.   It involved monitoring gages, turning valves and connecting/reconnecting hoses.  Not exactly a task that would require any electrical knowledge.

Nevertheless, it was an opportunity that I was very glad to have open to me (by virtue of my PE) at the time.

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

(OP)
Thanks to all for your inputs. I spoke to some of the other senior engineers who work with me and they have this same opinion "You can get it if you want but you DONT have to get it"
I dont foresee any specific value addition (with regards to my job)bcas of the license at this point of time but it does not mean that it may never be one in future. I am going to take the exam just as a personal challenge and to prove myself that I can solve engineering problems on paper as well. I have been working on same kinda calculations for a while , so it will be a welcoming change to scratch something other than the usual on a paper:)

CoryPad,
I did search before I posted and I was not satisfied with the way the threads had been started to instigate responses other than salary concerns.

regards,
ksbarry

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Comes in handy when arguing with marketing-type bosses, sometimes - especially when safety issues come up.

Everybody has an opinion {like everybody has an ....}, but you have a "professional opinion."  

Also, in a previous life, we used to get a buck-an-hour raise for passing the EIT &PE tests [a bigger deal way back when.]

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I've been licensed for several years now.  Before I sat for the exam, I questioned the worth of the PE as well.  Generally speaking, the PE doesn't do a whole lot for an ME, at least compared to CEs.  What finally sparked my decision to obtain my license was a comment an older engineer made to me when I asked him.  He described a situation where two candidates apply and interview for a job and both have identical credentials, but one has the PE.  Who's going to get that job?

Anyway, my wife and I recently started our own engineering firm.  This was not something I could have foreseen 6 or 7 years ago, but I'm glad I already had the license in place and kept it current over the years.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I have a P. Eng. I am a professional engineer.

If I don't have a P.Eng, then I am not a professional engineer (and I can't call myself one). I am only a guy doing technical work.

If you have the time, make to effort to get it. If you don't have the time, then I guess not. The cost really isn't that much (at least where I am). The tough part is the time commitment - but you only need to do it once (most states have comity).

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."   
Albert Einstein
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RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I personally found the preparation for the PE exams very stimulating. I took an eight week in-plant course for preparation. Everybody has their short cuts, and I learned a few.

My favorite problem was working out an AC air mixture problem on the psychrometic chart. Finding conditions A and B on the chart and determining the proportional mix point was astounding to the class. The response was 'Is that all there is?'

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

As the liability attorney that I used to work for pointed out, once you have your license everything you sign,from an engineering standpoint whether or not it expliciting requires a license, makes you directly liable.  Even when your industry generally has an industrial exemption it no longer protects you in many states.  So if you go for it beaf up your insurance.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Every job/task that involves responsibility invovles liability. If you are in the USA, it does not matter if you are responsible, you can still get dragged in to a litigation.

Do not assume improper liability, but be responsible enough to take on responsibilities, if you are to persue any kind of success.

As someone here the line "It's not the failure but the fear of failure that keeps you from success".

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

with all this talk of liability, it occurred to me that maybe the entire reason for the professional registration system is to know whom to hold personally responsible when something goes wrong. It may be that even non registered engineers are held directly liable, but I think it's pretty rare. Certainly if there is a name at the end of a document with a faulty design printed on it, it's very easy to go after that name at the end. The company the name belongs to is always sued, of course, because of deep pockets.

If you aren't registered, it is easier for you to stay anonymous when something goes wrong. Was any engineer held liable for the Pinto gas tanks exploding on impact? Or for the bad latch design on the DC-10? But someone surely was held personally responsible for the collapse of the Hyatt
Regency walkway. The primary difference between these 3 is that only the last one had some registered engineer's name attached to the design documents.

Personally I won't affix my stamp to any document unless it is absolutely necessary, and I stay away from any client who needs such a stamp.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

prost:

Nothing can be farther from truth if you say if you did not stamp a drawing you are not responsible. The litigation does not work that way. The key is to establish negligence, not whether or not you were qualified for the task. In fact someone is found making decisions, that he/she is not qualified to make, he/she can be even more severely punished.

If you have a license you have better chance of defending your decisions as at least you had the credentials. So whether or not you stamped the drawings, if it can be proved without reasonable doubt that you made the decisions, even if the superiors failed to catch your mistakes, you are still liable.

The key is to not to commit negligence. Stamping drawings is merely a statutory requirement. One cannot be absolved of his/her actions and their consequences just because they do not possess a license or do.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Team Member's:

Have you ever read the articles: "ENGINEERING and The LAW"?  ****Was Publish in the late 1970, & 1980.

Technical Note: If you are working other then the (NOT IN)United State how long will you be detain or in jail.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

My senior year in collage, I took (and passed) the EIT exam.  My first job and since has been in the aerospace industry.  I have discussed with other non-PE's the merits of taking an getting the PE licence.  Almost alway met with opposition, as it is not needed in my line of aerospace business.   

After some years of meeting and discussing this with aerospace retreads (started aerospace, fired due to lack of work - then obtaining their PE, and rehiring to aerospace) I got my PE for insurance in case of lack of work (about 20 years after the EIT).

After getting my PE licence and simply adding it to my email sig block, I noticed a positive change is how managers, customers, and suppliers responded to me.  I have never used it, I don't even have a stamp.  Nothing else changed.

I cannot put a measureable value on the benefit of obtaining the PE licence, but it is there.

I would recommend pursuing the PE licence.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

At my last job there were a lot of phonies with questionable credentials who were given the engineer title by the company in order to fool the customers. None of them had or could ever get a PE. This kind of company is precisely why engineering licensure was developed and why every qualifed person should pursue their PE.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

EddyC,

You have summed up my view perfectly. Merry Christmas!

----------------------------------
  Sometimes I only open my mouth to swap feet...

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

KSBarry,

Do a careerbuilder.com or a monster.com or whatever job seeking website you like search for your discipline and field and see how many job descriptions state that PE is preferred or required and then make up your own mind.

rmw

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I'm a mechanical PE (registered in NC) with "inactive" status.  I also recently attained six sigma black belt certification, which would qualify me as "active" on the CEU count for 2 or 3 more years, but why bother?

Anyway, if your state does not allow the "inactive status" then use reciprocity to activate your PE license in NC.  You can pay your $40 a year and remain inactive.

To continue the "active status" requires you to have continuous education hours (CEUs).  None of it comes close to "real" on-the-job experience.  If you have the full weight of a plant's operation riding on your expertise, then I'd count that above all the courses that meet CEU requirements.

When the rubber meets the road -- that's what seperates the engineers from the wannabes.  When you have a highly visible problem with no immediate solution, but you're confident your expertise will solve it -- you are then a professional.  Shut out the heckleres, the naysayers, and just do your job -- it works every time.

http://www.angelfire.com/planet/gadgetforum/index.html

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

I've read perhaps a thousand failure analysis cases, and never once heard of a non PE getting sued for negligence or any other act as far as I recall. So legally someone may be held negligent, but it seems to be pretty rare occurrence for any engineer, but non PEs in particular.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

rbulsara: I very much doubt what I said about liability at first could be the one thing in the universe that is 'farthest from the truth."

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

prost:

Not to parse words, but to say that by not sealing and signing drawings, you avoid liability, is not true at all. If any thing it could work against you in a real litigation.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

ksbarry, The main reason to get a PE license -now- is that it will never be easier. The further you are from school days, the more review it will take.

The main reason to get one -ever- is that if you do need one sometime in the future, you will have it. Someday 20 years from now, having a PE may open an opportunity for you

Also, a good review course is a good engineering refresher, you will get a few aha!s and and new understanding as you review subjects you weren't all that hot at the first time through.

I got my PE 25 years ago when I was 10 years out of school and never needed to use it. It was still worth the effort to prepare for it and take the test because of the valuable engineering refresher the process provided.

RE: Benefits of obtaining a PE license

Good thread!  Sorry to come in on it late.

I went after my Colorado PE 10-years ago because 1) I wanted to see if I could get it and 2) I had a better chance of getting it (passing the exam) the earlier I tried.  Getting it didn't have any noticable impact on my career.  I've never identify myself as a PE and I've never applied my seal to anything.  The company that employed me (a major oil refiner) covered all the fees but never seemed to care much.

It's been stated that having a PE license can open doors which is true.  In some circles it can kick doors down.  Prospective employee usually like candidates with PEs over those without.

Are licensed PE more vulnerable liability wise?  I believe they are.  It would come up in any litigation, applicable or not.  Part of that vulnerability is what keeps us honest, though.

Something worth mentioning is that when it comes time to solicit references for your PE application it's easier to stomach doing so with current co-workers/supervisors.  The option I faced recently while applying for a Texas PE license was to hit up a supervisor who's employ I'd left six months prior.  Talk about vulnerability.

Another tip keep decent records on your work since it's a pain to remember all the details years down the road.

My vote...get it but use it wisely, if at all.   

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