Workplace Scenario
Workplace Scenario
(OP)
My colleague confided me for his undertakings, i dont want him to offer with empty handed comfort and opinion. That's why i would like to brought this out in here for your further views.
He's about to be a shift supervisor on O&M department. But he wonders how would he react to his subordinates if he discover the fact that they are sleeping at work? He's a little bit hesistant to his reaction when he found it whether to be rude, else he thinks, subordinates would take advantage his kindness, if he does.
Anyone, had experience such sleeping - a workplace scenario?





RE: Workplace Scenario
Our manager didn't want to go any further with it because the employee was near retirement age, and wanted him to make to retirement instead of being fired or laid-off.
Chris
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
Supervisors are supposed to be fair, not kind. Sleeping on the job and getting paid for it is not acceptable (unless you're a fireman). To allow this violates the trust the company and managers have placed in the Supervisor.
Fired on the spot would not be rude but would be fair and appropriate as these slackers as they need a wake up call.
I was on one job site years ago and they had a problem with some of the laborers taking a siesta up on platforming or scaffolding high out of view. One project manager when finding a sleeper would simply pick up the hard hat, which had the name and badge number, off the deck and turn it in to the Construction Superintendent and they would be terminated.
NozzleTwister
Houston, Texas
RE: Workplace Scenario
"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?
RE: Workplace Scenario
1) they're in a meeting
2) the office is too hot
3) the work is boring (see 1)
4) they're listening to the CEO's annual speech
5) it's after lunch and either 1) to 4) is occuring
6) not enough sleep
7) they have an illness
8) they're drunk
1 to 5 are perfectly acceptable reasons and can be dealt with by good management, 6 and 7 are probably worth a discussion. 8 is classed as gross misconduct.
corus
RE: Workplace Scenario
I heard a story here at my job.
Several years ago an employee was caught sleeping under his desk over-night. Was doing it for a couple years without being caught. Turns out he was homeless. All his money went to child support and alomony. He was fired the day after he was caught.
Sad
Chris
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
Some interesting facts about sleep disorders.
htt
Narcolepsy is a serious medical disorder and a key to understanding other sleep disorders. Narcolepsy is a disabling illness affecting more than 1 in 2,000 Americans. Most individuals with the disorder are not diagnosed and are thus not treated. The disease is principally characterized by a permanent and overwhelming feeling of sleepiness and fatigue. Other symptoms involve abnormalities of dreaming sleep, such as dream-like hallucinations and finding oneself physically weak or paralyzed for a few seconds.
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.
RE: Workplace Scenario
For the first sort, a good talking-to is indicated.
The second guy gets a walk to the gate...
old field guy
RE: Workplace Scenario
Keep in mind, I am saying this from the perspective of an exempt (non-hourly) employee. I would not show them the door for a first offense but talk with them, find out if there is a legitimate reason (maybe there is a medical problem or something else that might make this a one-time offense). Document the discussion. If it happens again, consider a more serious consequence. Probably by the third time, you should consider unpaid leave or termination, depending on the circumstances. You should consider as well, how is the job performance and is the guy otherwise getting all of his work done, does he put in extra hours when required, etc. If a non-hourly guy performs well, gets work done and willingly works extra hours when required, do you really care if he closes his eyes for 20 minutes once in a while (maybe on break)? I know that I would rather have this working for me than one who works exactly 8 hrs (or less) and doesn't get his work done on time.
RE: Workplace Scenario
I would suggest telling them if they do not make changes, they may lose their jobs. See if these employees will try it for awhile. At the very least, a better diet and more exercise will improve their health and ultimately their value as an employee. If there are sociological causes, a warning about the loss of their income may alter their behavior. This way your colleague can be more at ease knowing an attempt was made to help before taking more drastic action.
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance!"
RE: Workplace Scenario
I've also drifted off a few times when reviewing documents, and I've been in a meeting with a customer where one of their guys kept falling asleep.
It may sound like the cowards route but I'd refer it to HR/Personnel or at least get their input. Before conducting any disciplinary action I would familiarize my self with company policies and consult HR, otherwise you're just leaving yourself and possibly your company open.
One question, of all the things to be concerned about when taking over a new supervisory position how did employees napping get to the top of the list? Perhaps a slightly more detailed explanation will generate more targeted responses.
As for the guy sleeping under his desk, sounds a bit harsh, assuming he was even just a halfway decent employee I’d have tried to work something out. However, I’m sure we’ve all heard of people fired for less.
RE: Workplace Scenario
However, there may be reasons for it. None of them cause it to be acceptable.
A good manager needs to confront the employee, ask if there is something that is leading to the unacceptable behavior, and offer to help remedy the problem if there is one.
Then document that he did that.
If the behavior does not self-correct, or if the offer of help is not accepted, then the employee may be fired.
RE: Workplace Scenario
I would give a warning to underachieving chronic napper but ignore the ones who doze off every now and then with good performance.
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
Chris
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
When he left the department they had a whip-round and bought him an eraser for his pencil - so that he'd not poke his eye out when he fell asleep.
RE: Workplace Scenario
----------------------------------
Sometimes I only open my mouth to swap feet...
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
It probably wouldn't be a great policy for a work environment, but it was enough to amuse a room of 16 year old kids.
RE: Workplace Scenario
Chris
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
TTFN
RE: Workplace Scenario
A few months later, we were running 24x7 hot and heavy and I was appointed interim production supervisor. That same tech proved very reliable for me and went out of his way to help me. I figured it was because I didn't burn him when I could have.
Tell your friend to talk to the guy off the record at first and then escalate enforcement as needed.
If the guy comes in with a diagnosed case of narcolepsy, though, they're screwed.
--------------------
How much do YOU owe?
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
--------------------
RE: Workplace Scenario
Perhaps. Though I'd like to think schools haven't changed that much in the last 8 years (since I'm only 24). Although, said teacher would have probably gotten reprimanded for it if someone took it the administration.
RE: Workplace Scenario
Outlandish behaviour could be certain to result in judicious use of the cane, or in the case of the chemistry teacher, a wooden retort stand. Weapon of choice for the PE teacher was a plymsol (tennis shoe).
Then again, in my day there wer no security scanners or body seraches and you didn't have to pack your lunch in a see through bag. The incidence of serious bodily harm to anyone by anyone was nil.
Sadly, not so long ago when the unions were very strong, it was expected that every worker was entitled to so much overtime each week whther there was wrok available or not and when there was work available the work rate was strictly controlled. In those days it was not uncommon for the entire night shift to be asleep and no one expected any different.
Some workers resented this but thyere was little they could do except what was expected of them by their colleagues and the unions.
I think the occassional lapses of employees should be ovelooked unless there is a clear work and safety issue. Repetitive behaviour is something else.
Much more serious is when employees choose to die at work.
JMW
www.ViscoAnalyser.com
RE: Workplace Scenario
I once had the case that I was trying to get hold of someone at another company and couldn’t get a response. I got a message the next day that they had fallen ill at work been taken to hospital and died! Didn’t seem so funny at the time.
So is sleeping on the job endemic at your place billybry?
RE: Workplace Scenario
We use the Have a BEER method.
Behavior - talk only about sleeping in just 1 sentance.
Effects of that behavior or why its bad to sleep on the job
Expectations what is the expectation, even rules
Results what will happen if they continue to sleep and what will happen if they stop it.
The first sesion is on their turf and time table, the second warning is on your turf and time and it should be written too.
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
I suppose many bosses won't like this setup because they sometimes want to nap too.
RE: Workplace Scenario
I never once thought to sue...
RE: Workplace Scenario
Our manager would pass along the hallway without getting entered to the workshop to catch up such dilema, and remarkably he appreciates the outcome.
RE: Workplace Scenario
Sleeping at work I cant tolerate - sorry. There may be good reason for it but there is no excuse for it. In saying that Id not sack the individual but Id talk to them and ensure that I understood the reason. Id also let them know that it wasnt toleratable. Next time there would be something done about it and the appropriate actions carried out.
can you imagine the driver of an 18 wheeler sleeping on the job, or a nurse on intensive care monitoring duties ?
No neither could I, and I think that to do something like that or allow this to happen just serves to cheapen engineering as a profession.
Rugged
RE: Workplace Scenario
It does depend on the job you are in. But let's consider on engineering side.
RE: Workplace Scenario
I worked at a place like that once. Very stressful having the boss watch every breath I take. At my review he said "You spent 3 minutes in the bathroom!". I said "You spent 15 minutes BSing with the secretary!" Then I quit.
It was an engineering job.
When I see someone sleeping on the job, it depends if it annoys me or not. If it's a young employee, parties a lot, comes in late and leaves early, no excuse. If he/she is older, there could be various reasons why the sleeping. Then I leave it alone.
Chris
SolidWorks 06 5.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
Well he is getting paid to be a manager. They feel they can trust him. One thing is very important, if his subordinates are sleeping on the job, then the job is not at its full potential. He should give them a warning something like this,
Hey guys I know sometimes this job gets boring but I can not allow you all to sleep on the job. If this happens again I will be forced to write you up. If you feel like your falling to sleep please let me know maybe I can give you a 10 min brake but I can not have you all sleeping on the job. Please consider this your first warning. This a nice but nasty way of getting your point across.
Ps
Job first feelings later
RE: Workplace Scenario
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: Workplace Scenario
Chris
SolidWorks 06 5.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: Workplace Scenario
Fortunately, I seldom do more than nod off before getting a Coke, and taking a walk thru the shop. But sometimes I have to look at the clock, or look around not knowing how long my eyes were shut. LOL
I don't think my boss (a father also) would say much besides maybe "better get some coffee!"
David
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
WJSD just set evolution back a few thousand years...
Wow, I sure wish I could meet a man like you that would let me stay home and be a housewife and raise babies and cook your dinner and rub your feet at night.....
or not...
RE: Workplace Scenario
Hg
Eng-Tips policies: FAQ731-376
RE: Workplace Scenario
On a side note, my 7th grade science teacher had a remarkably dramatic way to awaken the back row. The smooth black counters of the science room were perfect for use with a yardstick (meterstick for your UK'er's?). Mr. Steven's would continue to lecture as he casually strode to the back of the room next to the offender, slowly raise the yardstick, and bring it down with such expert precision that it made the sharpest, loudest, snap that mankind ever created. During one incident, the offender's eye's shot open, they tried to stand up in their one piece desk, lost their balance and fell ass over tea kettle, backwards, onto the floor. Science class was always exciting to me no matter what was being lectured on!
--
Erik
MO P.E.
RE: Workplace Scenario
RE: Workplace Scenario
I don't think I'd be honest if I said I've NEVER fallen asleep. There have been some pretty boring conferences where I've joined the rest of the back of the room in dozing off. It happens, everyone is human. No realistic employer thinks that their staff is 100% efficient 100% of the time. I don't see the difference in wasting time by falling asleep over socializing. Heck, wasting other people's time is even worse! If it was one of my staff who fell asleep and it didn't happen regularly, I wouldn't worry about it.
But, if it is chronic, then the employee is taking advantage of the company and it should be discussed with them. If they are getting their sleep during work hours, that is stealing from the employer.
RE: Workplace Scenario
That's a good remark.