CAD users: How old are you?
CAD users: How old are you?
(OP)
www.cadalyst.com/cadalyst
Too those of you who have already taken the poll. Is there a simple explanation for the big differences between age groups? A big surprise to me was the 40-49 group, compared to the 30-39 and 50-59 groups.
I am in the 30-39 group and can not imagine an engineering world without the use of CAD. Or are there people who feel different about CAD?
Too those of you who have already taken the poll. Is there a simple explanation for the big differences between age groups? A big surprise to me was the 40-49 group, compared to the 30-39 and 50-59 groups.
I am in the 30-39 group and can not imagine an engineering world without the use of CAD. Or are there people who feel different about CAD?
Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2





RE: CAD users: How old are you?
50-59 = Baby Boomers = 1946 > 1964
40-49 = Gen-X
30-39 = Echo Boomers or Gen-Y
In simplistic terms ... the Baby Boomers are the prolific post WW2 generation. They dominate the workforce and basically held/hold most of the better paying jobs ... leaving slim pickings for Gen-X. The Echo Boomers (also prolific being the offspring of the more affluent Baby Boomers) are/were able to get better education & therefor better jobs ... again leaving slim pickings for the following generation.
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RE: CAD users: How old are you?
The 40-49 group are working as senior engineers, and have lackeys do the CAD.
At age 50, their employers will suffer unfortunate market setbacks, and "so sorry, not because of your age", and certainly not because of the cost of providing health benefits, their employment as engineers will cease.
They will become CAD lackeys, "part time", with long hours, and no benefits.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I have noted, however, that using CADD, in my opinion, stunts the development of engineers to a degree. Those that come into the work force using CADD (and design software) do not seem to "get into" the design and understand their design as well as my peers did when I was coming into the work force.
Perhaps I'm thinking of the "good old days", but I notice it even within myself - that there is a tendency to glaze over things when they are all on the screen, with multi-colored straight lines. You have to force your mind to get into the details when using computers.
Probably opening up a storm of worms-from-a can here.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I agree with JAE, only to a certain extend off course. Somedays, looking at a computer screen for 10 hours, does make my mind feel numb.
Then again, the new generation 3D design software is really amazing. It is no longer a screen with multi-colored straight lines. That been said, it still remains only a tool and is no substitute for creativity and common sence.
The problem with the younger generation may not be the CAD software but the exposure they had as kids. Just take Lego for example. When I was a kid (not that very long ago) it was plain square boring plastic blocks. I had to use my imagination to make something out of it. With the same blocks I could build anything from a ship to a truck to a space craft. Modern Lego is almost pre-assembled, where is the fun in that? My mother only had to buy me one Lego set. My sister-in-law has to buy her son a new set every time he gets bored with the previous one. Quite a need marketing strategy. $$$$$$
I am going off the topic here. Just some thoughts maybe for a later topic.
Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I've gotten round the problem EddyC mentions with monitors - one of the spare 22" CRTs from our Foxboro distributed control system got mysteriously redirected onto my desk. I was sick of going home with sore eyes and a headache from working on one of the standard 17" types, so the objectors were told to get stuffed. It makes a HUGE difference when working on densely packed electrical drawings, and I haven't had any eyestrain problems since. An A3 drawing is virtually life-size on screen at 1600x1200.
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I don't suffer from insanity. I enjoy it...
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I'd thought I'd throw in my two cents from the unnamed generation (<30). I'm an engineer in a department of 4 and do pretty much all my own CAD. I must say I was impressed to see the large spike in the 50+ range. Also I cannot imagine how such complicated things were designed before modern CAD. I guess I can but it involves a lot more man-hours than I care to think about.
Another thing to note is that the demographics may be skewed by the website itself - I, at least, had never heard of it until this post.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
As an EIT, most of what I do right now is CAD work for the senior engineers. Most of them have been designing wind tunnels for 40+ years and are very proficient AutoCAD users.
Most of our work now, however, is migrating towards Pro/E for CAD, which is where I fit into the company. My class in college was the first one to learn 3D CAD from day one and I took to it pretty well.
The other engineers went for Pro/E training, but didn't take to it as well as they had hoped. So most of their work is still done in autocad or in excel, which I use as a basis for my models.
The senior guys and I get along great, and we can sit in the conference room, unroll a few feet of plotter paper on the table, sketch out a design, and I've got more or less everything I need to start a 3D model. In the process, I'm picking up what I can from their years of engineering experience.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
One thing that I found about Cad is it a tremendous help in design, either original or a redesign. As I didn't desire an AutoCad seat and probably wouldn't have got one if I had asked I personally bought a Small Cad Program. ProDEsign This evolved later into DesignCad which I still use today. In DesignCad you can use their programming language and basic to write macros and short programs of which I have over 200 working ones. When DesignCad went to Windows they changed from Basic to VB I never rewrote any macros or programs. I still run the DOS version to use the programs and Macros.
I still use Cad quite often, like this week I drew some special prints for metal flashing for a very large house with weird architectural details.
Two things that I used and still do for design and problem solving are DesignCad and a Dos Outlining Program.
My firsts with using a personal computer in engineering.
First to have a personal IBM compatible box
First to have a 20 Meg hard drive.
First to have a math coprocessor.
First to have a 32k of ram.
First to have a personal Cad program.
First to have a math program MathCad on any computer.
At Work;
The initial engineering computers were set up with Symphony/Lotus 123 and a word processor even though Symphony had one built in.
Instrumental in getting ME10, 2 chairs, on site.
Instrumental in getting Compress for the Engineering Dept. Had to do some rearguard action as the program was so buggy.
Instrumental in getting Pipe Plus. Ran the first case test with the program. Several months after we got PipePlus an Engineer set up a pretty complex case, the piping manifold in H2 plant. They tried to run it on a 286 sans mathcoprocessor and 72 hrs later it was still processing. I brought my coprocessor in and it finished in just under 6 hrs. Every computer in Engineering got a math coprocessor.
Just some of trials and tribulations of doing Computer Aided Engineering work with accountants running the show, nothings changed.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I am developing arthritis in my hand from years of pressing down too hard on my pencil, so I don't miss it all that much. CAD has definitely speeded up the design process from what we did on the board.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Wes C.
------------------------------
No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
corus
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
--Scott
http://wertel.eng.pro
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
>>> print them backwards <<<
... so you never had to draw on the same surface from which you had bleached or erased part of the reproduced image.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I never did a full engineering drawing on the board, however had the pleasure of making many amendments (ECO) on a range of media, including linen.
Ken 28
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
How about a sweat smudge near completion.
How about mixing you own ink.
How about a hand held pencil sharpener.
How about pencils made from real cedar.
How about German silver drafting tools.
How about a bamboo T square with a metal edge.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Are those ranges supposed to be ages? If so, that ain't right. It looks like they're off by 10 years. For starters, someone born in 1964 would be around 40 now, not 50 (although 40 seems too young to be a boomer). And they really aren't just 10-year spans like that, either. And Gen-Y goes a lot younger than 30.
Funny, though, I looked some more and Gen-X is older than I thought it was--both the generation itself and the terminology. I guess the term had a renaissance in the 90s, with the result that I thought I was older than the Gen-Xers, but apparently I'm one of them, and younger than the original definition as first coined. (By the above cited definition, though, I'm Gen-Y, which is definitely not true.)
Hg
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RE: CAD users: How old are you?
We all know that your very well experienced.
I also remember the gum erasers, horsehair brushes and smudges on a beautiful, 99% complete drawing. The worse was a nosebleed on such a drawing. Luckily it wasn't linen. Those bags always seemed to aggrevate the smearing for me.
Hg is right, that chart is off. If baby boomers were born between '46 and '64, that covers 18 years. The ages noted only cover 9 years.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Coupland took his book's title from another book "Class," by Paul Fussell. Fussell used "X" to describe a group of people who want to pull away from class, status and money in society. Because the characters in Coupland's book fit that description, he decided on the title "Generation X."
The media found elements of Coupland's characters' lives in America's youth and labeled them Generation X. This stereotypical definition leads society to believe that Generation X is made up of cynical, hopeless, frustrated and unmotivated slackers who wear grunge clothing, listen to alternative music and still live at home because they cannot get real jobs. It is a label that has stuck, stereotypes and all.
Hmmmm very interesting. But I still think those electric erasers are the cats meow. I think the true drafter has gone by the way of PC. I wish I had been given the chance to work with one.....
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Wikipedia has an interesting chart listing several generations with overlapping date ranges. I guess you can use this to argue or convience yourself or others you belong to what ever generation you want to belong to.
1860–1882 Missionary Generation
1883–1900 Lost Generation
1900–1910 Interbellum Generation
1900–1924 G.I. Generation
1911–1924 Greatest Generation
1929–1956 Jazz Age
1925–1945 Silent Generation
1946–1964 Baby Boomers
1948–1962 Beat Generation
1954–1965 Generation Jones
1964–1984 Consciousness Revolution
1958–1968 Baby Busters
1961–1981 Generation X
1975–1985 MTV Generation
1981–1986 Boomerang Generation
1977–2003 Generation Y
1986–1999 Internet Generation
2001– New Silent Generation
"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
Steven K. Roberts, Technomad
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RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Wes C.
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No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
It is difficult to imagine having to work on a sepia printed on the front side. You must really have to burn that lead in to make a line (or learn to print in reverse on the back side)!
How many here have spilled eradicator fluid all over a sepia? Another good reason to print it on the back.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I have _never_ worked in an outfit where printing sepias backwards and drawing on the nonemulsion side was SOP; I was always 'the strange guy who wants his sepias printed backwards'.
Okay, I was strange for other reasons too.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
One place I worked at hired science major engineering managers to do conceptual work. They missed the boat; that is what engineers are for! It was a case of sales managing the engineering dept and not doing a very good job. Engineers busy working at CAD may overlook the merit of analysing snap joints and other critical details to avoid failure. Engineers making unanalyzed cartoons is not the way to assure success in new designs.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Which CAD software was it, if I may ask?
Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Stephany!
http://www.recoverandbackup.com
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Engineers use Computer Aided Engineering (CAE) tools to optimize their designs. I would like to know what industry you are in? I don't see anything wrong with an engineer doing his/her own drawings then passing them off to drafters. We have drafter here and I find much easier to do the drawings myself then go back and fourth trying to get them done correctly.
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I believe it was AutoCAD, some years ago. I went thru the tutorial, and it seemed simple enough.
Then some characters were commenting on the new draftsman, me. It came to a screeching halt right there.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
That's a pity. The reason I was asking is that I do believe that the new generation 3D CAD has come a long way. A lot of drafting work is automated and you can spend more time on the creation of a 3D model.
Solid Edge V19 SP1 on WinXP SP2
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I can not agree more with you. I have been using Solid Edge for 4 years now and I can not imagine my daily life without such a tool.
Solid Edge V19 SP1 on WinXP SP2
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Weird.
I'm in the 40-49 group. And no, I'm not going blind. ;)
Chris
SolidWorks 06 5.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Dik
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
Pretty much anyone who was in high school and below, once Pac-Man came out, has computer-geekness in their blood.
What the folks don't have (and what I am seeing less and less of in the younger engineers) is good drawing skills. That is, with pencil and paper. You can be a "whiz at computers" but if you don't have the learned talent for technical drawing, forget it.
Don't think of ourselves as doing CADD, think of the work as CAE: computer-aided enigneering. The production drawings, with tools like TitleBlock Manager (for MicroStation users) are a snap. Integration of good, quality technical drawings into Excel or MathCAD makes it all go together...
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
How do you discuss a tricky detail in a meeting if you are not able to sketch it up? I am a bit concerned about what happens when that generation of engineers that cant do hand calcs or hand sketches become senior engineers.
I agree with what JAE said about it stunting engineers growth - it flattens the engineering learning curve.
csd
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
While I agree that hand sketching and hand calculations are useful and sometimes more efficient tools, there are times when it just doesn't cut it and not adopting newer technology holds you back as far as capability, creativity, and the ability to look at more design variations. You may be coming from a different background being from the structural/civil realm. A lot of the discussion here is centering around 3D MCAD for the product design world. Because of the advent of better 3D MCAD tools, it allows me to model and analyze a much broader range of possiblities for products. Initial ideas start out as sketches and quick hand calculations, but it eventually ends up on my screen. There are probably a number of people in this thread that are involved in designing things that can't easily be sketched properly, but can be accurately modeled - non-prismatic shapes (think of a computer mouse, autobodies, the handle to your favorite cordless drill.) The job of the engineer is to be able to decide when to use the best tool. I tend to be much more optimistic about the engineers of the future.
Pete
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I dont understand 3DMCAD is it a design program or a drawing program?
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
I too still do hand sketches regularly when I am in the field and have no computer, I also do hand calculations all the time, but I use excel a lot.
I recently did a scale 3D CAD model of some very confusing piping changes we had for a plant in our area. It went through about 20 revisions with our client before we were both satisfied with the product. To do this by hand would have been tedious, time consuming and impossible in the time frame that we did it. To have a drafter do it would have be frustrating, since I know the flows pressures restriction... that the different piping flows have and I could avoid trying to explain this to someone else by doing it myself. When my client was satisfied I gave the model to the drafter and he made it into three plan views and 6 detailed elevation views. The model could be viewed and talked about on one 11"x17" piece of paper and was a great tool in optimizing the design and insuring all our criteria were met. I did the model to scale in about a day and it took about 1 hour to revise it from hand scratches the customer and I did on while we were discussing our options. You would need one hell of an eraser to do this by hand and by the end the paper would be thinner than a napkin. Every revision I made was clear and crisp just like a new drawing.
I think that, in my industry at least, the ability to do CAD is almost a necessity for an engineer. Not that you can't be a great engineer without it (I know of many), or that being good at CAD makes you a good engineer but it is an excellent tool. The way CAD is progressing, being an engineer and not having the ability to do CAD will put you at more and more of a disadvantage, but this of course totally depends on your industry and your position.
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
www.solidworks.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LstOExJ2oGs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyMciBk5nco
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9c5QHGuNu0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4DfYtGCvy4
http://www.cadjunky.com/tag/solidworks
that should give you a good idea...
Pete
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
In my industry, the term is generally used in reference to an electronic way of producing drawings (such as Autocad).
This 3DMCAD, I would refer to as a second generation of CAD combined with Analysis package. It makes sense for the analysis package to also produce drawings in this case.
Similar packages are available in my industry, but they are still not the norm.
csd
RE: CAD users: How old are you?
- My point exactly. CAD is a catch all generic term that people use in many ways to mean different things. When you write the letters "CAD" - I have a different idea in my mind than what you have been used to. They are like apples and oranges. Your industry will eventually move to the newer generation of programs, its inevitable. For some reason(s) the civil architectural world seems to lag a little bit in that area. They don't seem to be the norm as you say, but then again the product design world has seen a lot of changes in this arena within the last 10 years - even the last 5 years. AutoCAD was probably the norm 10 years ago in product design. Now, if you are still using AutoCAD in the product design realm, then I would have to question a person's sanity/judgement. I understand this is different in civil/architectural, but I would look into emergin technologies in this area and watch them closely.
Pete
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