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CAD users: How old are you?
3

CAD users: How old are you?

CAD users: How old are you?

(OP)
www.cadalyst.com/cadalyst

Too those of you who have already taken the poll. Is there a simple explanation for the big differences between age groups? A big surprise to me was the 40-49 group, compared to the 30-39 and 50-59 groups.

I am in the 30-39 group and can not imagine an engineering world without the use of CAD. Or are there people who feel different about CAD?

Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

David Foot's book "Boom, Bust, Echo" is an excellent reference for demographics such as this.

50-59 = Baby Boomers = 1946 > 1964
40-49 = Gen-X
30-39 = Echo Boomers or Gen-Y

In simplistic terms ... the Baby Boomers are the prolific post WW2 generation. They dominate the workforce and basically held/hold most of the better paying jobs ... leaving slim pickings for Gen-X. The Echo Boomers (also prolific being the offspring of the more affluent Baby Boomers) are/were able to get better education & therefor better jobs ... again leaving slim pickings for the following generation.

Quote:

The expected job vacuum caused by retiring boomers isn't happening. Worse, many jobs seemed to have skipped Generation Xers, instead going to boomers' kids.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

The 30-39 group are doing CAD as part of their development as engineers.

The 40-49 group are working as senior engineers, and have lackeys do the CAD.

At age 50, their employers will suffer unfortunate market setbacks, and "so sorry, not because of your age", and certainly not because of the cost of providing health benefits, their employment as engineers will cease.

They will become CAD lackeys, "part time", with long hours, and no benefits.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I'm in the "older" group.  I can do CADD without any problem.  Learned it real fast.

I have noted, however, that using CADD, in my opinion, stunts the development of engineers to a degree.  Those that come into the work force using CADD (and design software) do not seem to "get into" the design and understand their design as well as my peers did when I was coming into the work force.  

Perhaps I'm thinking of the "good old days", but I notice it even within myself - that there is a tendency to glaze over things when they are all on the screen, with multi-colored straight lines.  You have to force your mind to get into the details when using computers.

Probably opening up a storm of worms-from-a can here.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

(OP)
And what a big can that is.

I agree with JAE, only to a certain extend off course. Somedays, looking at a computer screen for 10 hours, does make my mind feel numb.

Then again, the new generation 3D design software is really amazing. It is no longer a screen with multi-colored straight lines. That been said, it still remains only a tool and is no substitute for creativity and common sence.

The problem with the younger generation may not be the CAD software but the exposure they had as kids. Just take Lego for example.  When I was a kid (not that very long ago) it was plain square boring plastic blocks. I had to use my imagination to make something out of it. With the same blocks I could build anything from a ship to a truck to a space craft. Modern Lego is almost pre-assembled, where is the fun in that?  My mother only had to buy me one Lego set. My sister-in-law has to buy her son a new set every time he gets bored with the previous one. Quite a need marketing strategy.  $$$$$$

I am going off the topic here. Just some thoughts maybe for a later topic.

Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Most of the CAD proficient engineers where I work prefer to do their own CAD, rather than give it out to drafters. The older engineers make very detailed sketches that are given to the drafters to CAD duplicate. The problem we have is that our drafters are of poor quality. Like engineers, there seems to be no agreed upon process that qualifes someone as a drafter. It also doesn't help that we are forced to use "no-name" 17" monitors, basically making the CAD process very inefficient.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I'm one of the Echo Boomers - a new term for me - and I'm probably the only qualified engineer in our company who is also a reasonably competent AutoCAD user. I'm not as quick as the guys from the drawing office who use it all day, but they're snowed under with work so I do my drawings myself rather than wait for an indeterminate period until they get a chance to do it for me. I did study technical drawing for a little while at school, so I can tell the difference between 1st angle and 3rd angle projection unlike most of my colleagues, and I'm a pain in the ass (so I'm told) for getting all the detail right. It's very rare that a drawing I receive for approval gets signed straight off - it usually goes back covered in red pen a few times first.

I've gotten round the problem EddyC mentions with monitors - one of the spare 22" CRTs from our Foxboro distributed control system got mysteriously redirected onto my desk. I was sick of going home with sore eyes and a headache from working on one of the standard 17" types, so the objectors were told to get stuffed. It makes a HUGE difference when working on densely packed electrical drawings, and I haven't had any eyestrain problems since. An A3 drawing is virtually life-size on screen at 1600x1200.

----------------------------------
  I don't suffer from insanity. I enjoy it...

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Don't harsh on the LEGO toffeet!  They have both kinds of sets now, some that are practically action figures and some that are much more general blocks.

I'd thought I'd throw in my two cents from the unnamed generation (<30).  I'm an engineer in a department of 4 and do pretty much all my own CAD.  I must say I was impressed to see the large spike in the 50+ range.  Also I cannot imagine how such complicated things were designed before modern CAD.  I guess I can but it involves a lot more man-hours than I care to think about.  

Another thing to note is that the demographics may be skewed by the website itself - I, at least, had never heard of it until this post.  
     

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Here's another voice from the unnamed generation (I'm 24). I've been reffered to as part of the "nintendo generation", which is fine, because using Pro/E is not too far off from playing a video game for me, only the stakes are higher.

As an EIT, most of what I do right now is CAD work for the senior engineers. Most of them have been designing wind tunnels for 40+ years and are very proficient AutoCAD users.

Most of our work now, however, is migrating towards Pro/E for CAD, which is where I fit into the company. My class in college was the first one to learn 3D CAD from day one and I took to it pretty well.

The other engineers went for Pro/E training, but didn't take to it as well as they had hoped. So most of their work is still done in autocad or in excel, which I use as a basis for my models.

The senior guys and I get along great, and we can sit in the conference room, unroll a few feet of plotter paper on the table, sketch out a design, and I've got more or less everything I need to start a 3D model. In the process, I'm picking up what I can from their years of engineering experience.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Don't forget the older generation, 62+. Having fought many battles to implement the computer into our engineering I was instrumental in getting ME10 into the mechanical group. I started out on ME10 then as the Drafting Design Department started using Micro-Station I picked up on it. Most of the time I stayed with ME10 due to there being a free chair and they had the first 19" monitors. Later on the site started switching to Autocad I kinda lost interest as my then current job didn't require much Cad work. I'm probably the only one that frequents this site that has never drawn a line in AutoCad.

One thing that I found about Cad is it a tremendous help in design, either original or a redesign. As I didn't desire an AutoCad seat and probably wouldn't have got one if I had asked I personally bought a Small Cad Program. ProDEsign This evolved later into DesignCad which I still use today. In DesignCad you can use their programming language and basic to write macros and short programs of which I have over 200 working ones. When DesignCad went to Windows they changed from Basic to VB I never rewrote any macros or programs. I still run the DOS version to use the programs and Macros.

I still use Cad quite often, like this week I drew some special prints for metal flashing for a very large house with weird architectural details.

Two things that I used and still do for design and problem solving are DesignCad and a Dos Outlining Program.

My firsts with using a personal computer in engineering.
First to have a personal IBM compatible box
First to have a 20 Meg hard drive.
First to have a math coprocessor.
First to have a 32k of ram.
First to have a personal Cad program.
First to have a math program MathCad on any computer.

At Work;
The initial engineering computers were set up with Symphony/Lotus 123 and a word processor even though Symphony had one built in.

Instrumental in getting ME10, 2 chairs, on site.
Instrumental in getting Compress for the Engineering Dept. Had to do some rearguard action as the program was so buggy.
Instrumental in getting Pipe Plus. Ran the first case test with the program. Several months after we got PipePlus an Engineer set up a pretty complex case, the piping manifold in H2 plant. They tried to run it on a 286 sans mathcoprocessor and 72 hrs later it was still processing. I brought my coprocessor in and it finished in just under 6 hrs. Every computer in Engineering got a math coprocessor.  

Just some of trials and tribulations of doing Computer Aided Engineering work with accountants running the show, nothings changed.



RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I'm in the 40-49 group, and have to agree with many here, especially EddyC.  Starting out on the board, I remember how frustrating it was to have to rethink the view layout (lack of planning on my part) and how to precision erase when changes came along.  CAD has done away with all of the "artistry" that went into a manual drawing, and along with it went the knowledge of what constitutes a good drawing.  I actually used to know descriptive geometry (how many here know that now?) but have forgotten all but the most basic principles due to lack of necessity.
I am developing arthritis in my hand from years of pressing down too hard on my pencil, so I don't miss it all that much.  CAD has definitely speeded up the design process from what we did on the board.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I worked for a couple of years in the entertainment industry, as a "set designer"... which is basically a drafter / detail designer. In entertainment, almost everyone is still doing hand drawings (as of 2004 this was still true). Part of the issue here really has to do with the "artistry" as ewh had mentioned (I once had a director take several of my drawings and have them framed for his wall), and another is the fact that most of the work is done by freelancers who provide their own equipment, so the price point of CAD software was a factor.  

Wes C.
------------------------------
No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

As I'm from the UK and ageism is now illegal here I refer you to my solictor for daring to ask!

corus

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I'm in the 40-49 group.....by about 9 months.  When I started college CAD was just being introduced into the class work for the ME program.  So I only had one drafting class that was "on the board".  When I got my first job the company had just made the transition to CAD.  I had to do some board work when doing some ECOs but most of the time we would redraw them in CAD.  One thing I remember is playing with all the old drafting equipment especially the electric eraser......that was cool rofl2

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
      o
  _`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Ah, the electric eraser... I used to keep a sharp exacto handy to trim a sharp edge on the eraser.  This really helped when trying to erase small, exact areas (better than the erasing template).

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I remember using an exacto to deal with sepias and inked vellums.  I could get a cleaner erase job by scratching it off than burning a hole through the paper with an ink eraser in the electric.  Oh, I'm only 30.  But I truely believe that we are doing a disservice to future engineers and designers by not making them learn how to manually prepare a print.

--Scott

http://wertel.eng.pro

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I remain amazed at how few people knew the secret of using sepias ...

  >>>   print them backwards  <<<

... so you never had to draw on the same surface from which you had bleached or erased part of the reproduced image.

Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Eraser shields and licking the eraser to make it work better.

I never did a full engineering drawing on the board, however had the pleasure of making many amendments (ECO) on a range of media, including linen.

Ken 28

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

KENAT is right about licking the eraser.  On ink and mylar drawings, licking your vinyl eraser made quick work of it.  But I still think a sharp edge on an electric eraser was more accurate than the sheild.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

How about just a hard gum eraser and gum bag with a horse hair brush.

How about a sweat smudge near completion.

How about mixing you own ink.

How about a hand held pencil sharpener.

How about pencils made from real cedar.

How about German silver drafting tools.

How about a bamboo T square with a metal edge.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

(tangent alert) As long as this thread is still going, I must take exception to something quoted from a book above:

Quote:

50-59 = Baby Boomers = 1946 > 1964
40-49 = Gen-X
30-39 = Echo Boomers or Gen-Y

Are those ranges supposed to be ages?  If so, that ain't right.  It looks like they're off by 10 years.  For starters, someone born in 1964 would be around 40 now, not 50 (although 40 seems too young to be a boomer).  And they really aren't just 10-year spans like that, either.  And Gen-Y goes a lot younger than 30.

Funny, though, I looked some more and Gen-X is older than I thought it was--both the generation itself and the terminology.  I guess the term had a renaissance in the 90s, with the result that I thought I was older than the Gen-Xers, but apparently I'm one of them, and younger than the original definition as first coined.  (By the above cited definition, though, I'm Gen-Y, which is definitely not true.)

Hg

Eng-Tips policies:  FAQ731-376

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

OK unclesyd,
We all know that your very well experienced.pipe
I also remember the gum erasers, horsehair brushes and smudges on a beautiful, 99% complete drawing.  The worse was a nosebleed on such a drawing.  Luckily it wasn't linen.  Those bags always seemed to aggrevate the smearing for me.

Hg is right, that chart is off.  If baby boomers were born between '46 and '64, that covers 18 years.  The ages noted only cover 9 years.spineyes

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

The term Generation X came from a book written in 1991 by Douglas Coupland by the same name. It is a fictional book about three strangers who decide to distance themselves from society to get a better sense of who they are. He describes the characters as "underemployed, overeducated, intensely private and unpredictable."

Coupland took his book's title from another book "Class," by Paul Fussell. Fussell used "X" to describe a group of people who want to pull away from class, status and money in society. Because the characters in Coupland's book fit that description, he decided on the title "Generation X."

The media found elements of Coupland's characters' lives in America's youth and labeled them Generation X. This stereotypical definition leads society to believe that Generation X is made up of cynical, hopeless, frustrated and unmotivated slackers who wear grunge clothing, listen to alternative music and still live at home because they cannot get real jobs. It is a label that has stuck, stereotypes and all.

Hmmmm very interesting.  But I still think those electric erasers are the cats meow.  I think the true drafter has gone by the way of PC.  I wish I had been given the chance to work with one.....

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
      o
  _`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I used the eraser shield to scrape off the ink on mylars, we never got exacto blades for that.

Wikipedia has an interesting chart listing several generations with overlapping date ranges.  I guess you can use this to argue or convience yourself or others you belong to what ever generation you want to belong to.

1860–1882 Missionary Generation
1883–1900 Lost Generation
1900–1910 Interbellum Generation
1900–1924 G.I. Generation
1911–1924 Greatest Generation
1929–1956 Jazz Age
1925–1945 Silent Generation
1946–1964 Baby Boomers
1948–1962 Beat Generation
1954–1965 Generation Jones     
1964–1984 Consciousness Revolution
1958–1968 Baby Busters
1961–1981 Generation X
1975–1985 MTV Generation
1981–1986 Boomerang Generation
1977–2003 Generation Y
1986–1999 Internet Generation
2001–        New Silent Generation

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
Steven K. Roberts, Technomad
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Hg ... The figures I used were just a rough linking of the age groups used in the OPs link to the Baby Boomer years, and then extrapolating the generations from there. Definitely not precise, but close enough (IMO) to make a link to the "Boom, Bust, Echo" groupings.

cheers
Helpful SW websites FAQ559-520
How to find answers ... FAQ559-1091

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I've heard all those from MadMango's list, except the last... what exactly is this NEW SILENT GENERATION?

Wes C.
------------------------------
No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

No-one knows ... they wont tell anyone.

cheers
Helpful SW websites FAQ559-520
How to find answers ... FAQ559-1091

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Or they're too young to talk yet. Although I've yet to meet a silent baby!

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Though they me be silent they give their presence away by leaving a trail of disturbed air molecules around their transporter.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

MikeHalloran,
It is difficult to imagine having to work on a sepia printed on the front side.  You must really have to burn that lead in to make a line (or learn to print in reverse on the back side)!

How many here have spilled eradicator fluid all over a sepia?  Another good reason to print it on the back.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I've worked in literally dozens of outfits where sepias were made right side up, just like prints, and untold hours were spent trying to make lead stick to a bleach- smoothed surface, or extra money was spent to buy erasable sepia paper.

I have _never_ worked in an outfit where printing sepias backwards and drawing on the nonemulsion side was SOP; I was always 'the strange guy who wants his sepias printed backwards'.  

Okay, I was strange for other reasons too.  winky smile

Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Naw... I think you just ended up working under strange procedures.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I tried CAD training for a while, and I dropped it because I was transforming into a draftsman/CAD type. That was not for me. Classically the engineer guides draftsmen thru his calculations and concepts for new creations. One old German ME who went into CAD in a big way expressed regrets for the same reasons.

One place I worked at hired science major engineering managers to do conceptual work. They missed the boat; that is what engineers are for! It was a case of sales managing the engineering dept and not doing a very good job. Engineers busy working at CAD may overlook the merit of analysing snap joints and other critical details to avoid failure. Engineers making unanalyzed cartoons is not the way to assure success in new designs.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

(OP)
Hello plasgears,

Which CAD software was it, if I may ask?

Solid Edge V18 SP6 on WinXP SP2

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Quote:

Engineers busy working at CAD may overlook the merit of analysing snap joints and other critical details to avoid failure. Engineers making unanalyzed cartoons is not the way to assure success in new designs.

Engineers use Computer Aided Engineering (CAE) tools to optimize their designs.  I would like to know what industry you are in?  I don't see anything wrong with an engineer doing his/her own drawings then passing them off to drafters.  We have drafter here and I find much easier to do the drawings myself then go back and fourth trying to get them done correctly.

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
      o
  _`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Then you obviously don't put much stock in helping your drafter to improve.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

The skills or desire to improve are not their.  I've tried to mentor, encourage and talk with but the person is dug-in to "old-ways".  It's extremely difficult to change people that do not want to change.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Yes, it can be.  As an exercise, why don't you give him a project that is not of high priority, and keep giving it back to him full of red ink until he gets it right?  I realize that not everyone has the luxury to this, but it would help to get your point across.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Toffeet,

I believe it was AutoCAD, some years ago. I went thru the tutorial, and it seemed simple enough.

Then some characters were commenting on the new draftsman, me. It came to a screeching halt right there.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

(OP)
Hello Plasgears,

That's a pity. The reason I was asking is that I do believe that the new generation 3D CAD has come a long way.  A lot of drafting work is automated and you can spend more time on the creation of a 3D model.

Solid Edge V19 SP1 on WinXP SP2

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I guess I don't fit into any classification that is given in this thread.  What about engineers younger than 30?  By the way, I am pretty proficient with SolidWorks and I tend to see a world of difference between myself and someone less proficient in an equivalent 3D MCAD program.  I may not have all the years of experience in design, but I think b/c of my skills and knowledge of a program like SolidWorks I can arrive at answers to designs faster if I utilize the resources available to me of those more experienced in what works in designs.  I find that I can work on more projects b/c I am able to get things done faster.  Getting things done more efficiently allows me to be exposed to more and therefore learn design particulars at an accelerated rate.  I also find that as I model particular parts in 3D, it forces me to learn about the particulars of a manufacturing process that may be used, or a method that may be used.  So I see 3D MCAD as being a great enabler for me to learn and develop at a faster rate than what would have otherwise been possible.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

(OP)
Hello pdybeck,

I can not agree more with you. I have been using Solid Edge for 4 years now and I can not imagine my daily life without such a tool.

Solid Edge V19 SP1 on WinXP SP2

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Interesting. I login to Eng-Tips everyday. First time this thread has shown.
Weird.
I'm in the 40-49 group. And no, I'm not going blind. ;)

Chris
SolidWorks 06 5.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 10-27-06)

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

I'm in the upper reaches and have been using a personal computer since the first XT came out.  Used to use an IBM 360 at university that would be sluggish compared to my laptop... and my desktop is faster yet... it's been driven by my kids gaming requirements...  Although I'm not as fast as some CAD operators, I use AutoCAD frequently and can hold my own with an average CAD operator.  Use 2002LT and started with ver 2.15 (if anyone has that good a memory).  I program in half a dozen languages as a hobby (sort of) although most of the stuff I do is in Delphi, now.  Some of the programs have over a meg in source code.  Although I've written relational databases, I'm just picking up MS Access (setting up a new project that can use it).  I've always been an info junkie and love learning.  My laptop is running an AMD Turion ML-40 at 2.2 gHz, with 2 gig RAM and 100 Gig HD and a wide screen.  It has faxmodem, USB, Firewire, Bluetooth, WiFi, and regular LAN, etc.  Because of my wife's illness, I use it far more often than my desktop...

Dik

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Born in 1963, by the time I was 18, I was heavily addicted to video games... circa 1981. Ten years later, my addiction hit the peak when I made it through the entire "Black Tiger" game on a single quarter. I heven ad an unfortunate lapse in 1998 when I spent an entire week of vacation playing Warcraft (I finished it all...). Computers in general came easy to me then and are even easier to use now.

Pretty much anyone who was in high school and below, once Pac-Man came out, has computer-geekness in their blood.

What the folks don't have (and what I am seeing less and less of in the younger engineers) is good drawing skills. That is, with pencil and paper. You can be a "whiz at computers" but if you don't have the learned talent for technical drawing, forget it.

Don't think of ourselves as doing CADD, think of the work as CAE: computer-aided enigneering. The production drawings, with tools like TitleBlock Manager (for MicroStation users) are a snap. Integration of good, quality technical drawings into Excel or MathCAD makes it all go together...

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

it's definitely a weakness for me.

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

In my current job I do much of my own CAd, but I would much prefer to stick to hand sketches and hand calculations.

How do you discuss a tricky detail in a meeting if you are not able to sketch it up? I am a bit concerned about what happens when that generation of engineers that cant do hand calcs or hand sketches become senior engineers.

I agree with what JAE said about it stunting engineers growth - it flattens the engineering learning curve.

csd

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

csd,

  While I agree that hand sketching and hand calculations are useful and sometimes more efficient tools, there are times when it just doesn't cut it and not adopting newer technology holds you back as far as capability, creativity, and the ability to look at more design variations.  You may be coming from a different background being from the structural/civil realm.  A lot of the discussion here is centering around 3D MCAD for the product design world.  Because of the advent of better 3D MCAD tools, it allows me to model and analyze a much broader range of possiblities for products.  Initial ideas start out as sketches and quick hand calculations, but it eventually ends up on my screen.  There are probably a number of people in this thread that are involved in designing things that can't easily be sketched properly, but can be accurately modeled - non-prismatic shapes (think of a computer mouse, autobodies, the handle to your favorite cordless drill.)  The job of the engineer is to be able to decide when to use the best tool.  I tend to be much more optimistic about the engineers of the future.

Pete

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

Pete,

I dont understand 3DMCAD is it a design program or a drawing program?

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

2
I am just barely still in the 20-30 range and I have been doing CAD since early university classes (10 years now) I use it regularly in my work but I don't do official drawings. I do what I call CAD sketches and hand those of to Drafters to spruce up and put into real drawings. I could not imagine working without CAD, but I am by no means a drafter (even thought I have done a complete drawing package a few times when our drafters were too back up).

I too still do hand sketches regularly when I am in the field and have no computer, I also do hand calculations all the time, but I use excel a lot.

I recently did a scale 3D CAD model of some very confusing piping changes we had for a plant in our area. It went through about 20 revisions with our client before we were both satisfied with the product. To do this by hand would have been tedious, time consuming and impossible in the time frame that we did it. To have a drafter do it would have be frustrating, since I know the flows pressures restriction... that the different piping flows have and I could avoid trying to explain this to someone else by doing it myself. When my client was satisfied I gave the model to the drafter and he made it into three plan views and 6 detailed elevation views. The model could be viewed and talked about on one 11"x17" piece of paper and was a great tool in optimizing the design and insuring all our criteria were met. I did the model to scale in about a day and it took about 1 hour to revise it from hand scratches the customer and I did on while we were discussing our options. You would need one hell of an eraser to do this by hand and by the end the paper would be thinner than a napkin. Every revision I made was clear and crisp just like a new drawing.

I think that, in my industry at least, the ability to do CAD is almost a necessity for an engineer. Not that you can't be a great engineer without it (I know of many), or that being good at CAD makes you a good engineer but it is an excellent tool. The way CAD is progressing, being an engineer and not having the ability to do CAD will put you at more and more of a disadvantage, but this of course totally depends on your industry and your position.


RE: CAD users: How old are you?

There is a bit of a discrepancy in what we are referring to when we refer to CAD.

In my industry, the term is generally used in reference to an electronic way of producing drawings (such as Autocad).

This 3DMCAD, I would refer to as a second generation of CAD combined with Analysis package. It makes sense for the analysis package to also produce drawings in this case.

Similar packages are available in my industry, but they are still not the norm.

csd

RE: CAD users: How old are you?

"There is a bit of a discrepancy in what we are referring to when we refer to CAD."  

- My point exactly.  CAD is a catch all generic term that people use in many ways to mean different things.  When you write the letters "CAD" - I have a different idea in my mind than what you have been used to.  They are like apples and oranges.  Your industry will eventually move to the newer generation of programs, its inevitable.  For some reason(s) the civil architectural world seems to lag a little bit in that area.  They don't seem to be the norm as you say, but then again the product design world has seen a lot of changes in this arena within the last 10 years - even the last 5 years.  AutoCAD was probably the norm 10 years ago in product design.  Now, if you are still using AutoCAD in the product design realm, then I would have to question a person's sanity/judgement.  I understand this is different in civil/architectural, but I would look into emergin technologies in this area and watch them closely.

Pete

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