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Things that drive me nuts ...
5

Things that drive me nuts ...

Things that drive me nuts ...

(OP)
.
SW2005 SP4.0

- Open dwg, just for printing, PRINT , after that you want to close the file, without ANY changes - window pops up asking for saving changes ......  WHAT CHANGES ??? I haven't done ANYthing !!!

- Saving dwg with ONE sheet - window pops up saying Views on inactive sheets need updating ...  bla ... bla ...

There in NO inactive sheets - there is only ONE sheet dammit  !!!!

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Same in SW2006 SP3.1

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

So I guess "wrench" is the wrong answer for this forum?

-----------------------

In SW the thing that has been driving me crazy recently would be SW deciding that it doesn't want to move dimensions from a main view to a detail view of the area in question. Generally it works fine, but it sort of defeats the purpose of the detail view if I can't point out the dimensions I needed the detail for in the first place.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

jacek0841,

In regards to the first thing you mentioned.  If the model that the drawing is based on is different than what was present when the drawing was saved, SW rebuilds the drawing. This causes the changes that SW wants to save and is one area where care is required for associative drawings.  They can change without you realizing it.

Eric

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

2
What drives me nuts in SW?  I wish I could pick the dimension line or extension line of a dimension to change it's value rather than having to pick the number.

Flores
SW06 SP3.0

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

smcadman ... RMB click anywhere on a dimension, select Properties, then change the Value. Not quite as good as a double click but still only 2 clicks.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Thanks CBL, but if it has to be a 2-step process, I might as well zoom in until everything isn't too cluttered to pick the value.  

Something else I would like is an automatic normal-to-sketch on all new sketches, not just the first sketch.  Whenever you start a new part and start the sketch command, you are automatically normal-to sketch.  Any new sketch after that, well you have to hit the normal-to button.

Flores
SW06 SP3.0

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Amen to the OP - so annoying that simply printing requires a new save.  Same to BiPolar's comment (obviously).

I'd like to throw the Photoworks interface into the ring - ALL of it.  

The normal-to-sketch thing should be an option, but not required.  I often like to line up my view then start the sketch.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Have you all submitted your "gripes" to SW as an ER?

Jabberwocky ... I think you will need to be a bit more specific than "the Photoworks interface ... ALL of it" smile

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Jacek has a good one. I hate the same issue. Bring up a current drawing from the vault (PDM) and print it, then get prompted to save changes. Very aggravating.

One of the things I hate the most is getting a vague error message when attempting to create a feature. The message neither helps me to find the error, nor points me in the right direction. A better help menu with a general troubleshooting section would be great. Solidworks has the worst help menu I've ever seen.

Here's one thing I hate about PDM. If you load an assembly from the vault and do a save WITHOUT making ANY CHANGES, the vault will think the local version on your computer is newer than the vault copy. We need smarter software that compares part, drawing, and assembly files for differences. Not just looks at a date/time stamp.

And another thing (can you tell I'm on my soap box), how about a new version of Solidworks that has NO NEW CHANGES, except for fixing the existing issues. We should not be bug fixing DSS's software. Excuse me: Beta testing their software!

There's more, but it's quittin' time, and I hear a cold one calling my name, a beer, not my wife! lol :)

Yanceman

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I hate the way that SW (after 2005 anyway) prints out the grid of a drawing if it's displayed at print time.  Does this only happen for me?  Is there a setting to turn this off?  If so please let me know!  After printing a few D size sheets of graph paper I killed the toolbar button for "Print" and made my own, which points to a macro that turns off the grid and then prints.  

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

yanceman,
New changes with fixes all the time is what is making SW stay ahead (or catching up) of other CAD software.
Send in Enhancement Request's for things that you want changed. Stay quiet, don't get it.
handleman, I believe it is in your settings to turn off grid. I don't have it here in front of me to check.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

yanceman: while SW could easily implement a system for actually comparing a document to the vault version, you would not like the wastage of system resources (and your subsequent increase in coffee breaks)

Stefan Hamminga
EngIT Solutions
CSWP/Mechanical designer/AI student

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I know how to turn off the grid display.  I just don't want SolidWorks to print the grid on paper if it's displayed on the screen.  The grid never printed on paper prior to SW 2005 (or maybe it was 2004).  Why would anyone want the grid printed out?  Do some people need to print their own graph paper?  smile

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Quote:

Why would anyone want the grid printed out?
Why would anyone want the grid ... period. I detest using those. No-one I knew ever drew on graph or lined paper when on the board, so why on earth would anyone need it with CAD???

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I never use grid either. In 20 years, I never used grid paper for drafting. I never used it in any CAD.
I used up to SW05. There is a setting somewhere to set it to not print.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

The grid is a visual aid for me in lining up dimensions.  Our division's drawing standards (division motto - "We like to make up our own standards") dictate that the dim closest to the part edge is 20mm away and subsequent dims are spaced at 10mm.  I realize that you can link dimensions to stay 10mm apart, but you can't simultaneously link them 10mm apart and collinear with other dims.  I choose to link them collinear and visually line them up approximately 10mm apart using the grid.  I did a lot of searching for a setting that stops the grid from printing, but found nothing.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

As a visual aid in PhotoWorks would be OK for me.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Ctopher: Yes, I think I am due for another enhancement request. They haven't heard from me in a while :)

Stephan: Hopefully, in another few years when we are all on 64 bit processors, the file comparison won't slow us down.

Handleman: Create a layer on your drawing template that has the grid lines spaced as required, then just turn them off prior to plotting. A macro would work to automate this.

Yanceman

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Thanks, Yanceman.  I already have a workaround - a macro that turns the grid display off if it's on (SetUserPreferenceToggle), prints, and restores the grid to its previous state.  I replaced the print button on my toolbar with a button linked to this macro.  Having to do this actually prompted me to check further into automating my printing.  That macro now includes a userform with eight buttons - a 100% scale and fit scale for each paper size A through D.  A and B are sent to one printer, while C and D are sent to the plotter.  I know that print/plot settings are saved with the drawing, but sometimes I want a quick print of a D size drawing fit to B size.  Sometimes I start out with one drawing template and decide to change sheet format to a different size.  Either of these used to require multiple changes in the print setup dialog.  Now I just hit one button.

My original musing was to wonder why SW started printing the grid with 2005 when it never did before.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Handleman,

Nice macro. Sounds like it does everything except pour your coffee!

Yanceman

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

handleman ... Just guessing here but, maybe SW wanted to maintain/complete the WYSIWYG aspect of its drawings ... ie. if you can see the grid on the screen, then it will be printed. It would be nice if they gave a Default=ON or OFF option though. Of course it could also be a glitch. smile

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Hey, that's an idea!  How's this: winky smile

CODE

Sub CoffeAssistant()
Dim myCup as Ceramics.Mug
Dim myBrew as Beverages.Coffee
Dim myPot as Appliances.MrCoffee
Dim myDrain as Breakroom.Sink

While Time() < "5:00 PM"   
  If Not myCup.IsEmpty Then
    If Not myBrew.IsCold Then
      myBrew.Drink
    Else
      myCup.Dump(myDrain)
    End If
  ElseIf Not myPot.IsEmpty Then
    myCup.Fill(myBrew, myPot)
  Else
    myPot.MakeMore
  End If
Wend
      

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

That's Great!
I needed a good laugh!

Yanceman

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

My biggest solidworks gripe is

1. that I can not control the linetype for detail circles seperate from their leader.

2. that I can not control the linetype for the detail circles per view or per instance(instead of globally across the drawing)

I used the grid in CATIA pretty regularly. Helps to line things up visually from far across the sheet, when accuracy is not relevant... horseshoes and hand grenades)...

I also liked it in the CATIA sketcher, but it really sucks in the SWx sketcher (but for the life of me I dont' remember why i used it in Sketcher... or why it suck so bad in SWx sketcher)...

Anyway, it's easy to SWx w/o the grid... probablly better in the long run.

and yes... I did submit an ER for my detail circle  gripes...

Wes C.
------------------------------
When they broke open molecules, they found they were only stuffed with atoms. But when they broke open atoms, they found them stuffed with explosions...

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

This one just happened to me: edges that should be visible are not displayed in the drawing--and no amount of rebuilding or selecting "show edge" will work (it wouldn't print them either). Oddly enough, upon creating the drawing for the third time it decided to display them.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I hate that I can't "Replace a component with another of the same name (but different directory)."

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."
Steven K. Roberts, Technomad
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

BiPolarMoment ... That sounds like a Graphics Card/Driver problem.

MadMango ... That's more a Windows limitation rather than SW.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I hate that we have to use uneditable hardware, downloaded from McMaster-Carr for instance. Our IT guys use Linux servers with Samba for file sharing, and won't consider changing. Samba is not supported by SW, and won't handle the file locking-unlocking that Toolbox requires. Even with Toolbox copied parts, PDMWorks won't allow check-in of an assembly with TB hardware, sees them as "non-revision controlled" parts. Shouldn't these SW add-ons be compatible ?

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

CorBlimeyLimey: I'd have agreed if it had printed(externally) the lines despite not showing them--but it didn't.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Funny how people like different things.

I really like the fact that new sketches don't automatically change to a 2D flat view.  I tend to do most everything in a 3D environment, so even with the 1st sketch I usually pick a plane hit sketch, then <cntrl>7 back to a 3D view.  Particulaly on complex parts I find it much easier to work & stay oriented when I'm viewing the part 3 dimensionally.

The thing that really bugs me in SW is having to start all solid models as a line sketch.  I wish SW's would add some basic solid shapes you can simply draw (cylinders, spheres, blocks, ect.).

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

ongybill ... I also dislike the auto "Normal to" feature when creating a sketch & often adjust the view so it is slightly skewed. However it would be better if SW was more consistent with this feature ... either do it for all sketches or not at all. Better still give an option to default to the users choice.

As for adding solid features (primitives) you can create your own using the Library Features function. You dont always have to start from a sketch.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

CorBlimeyLimey

I'd agree the "normal to" would be better as a user set option.

As far as things that drive me nuts:  
I really wish they'd go back to the move/copy/rotate command available in 2005.  That was my favorite tool in SW.  With 2006 I had to start using 5 commands to do what I did with 1 before.  Huge negative for me, I'd drop 2006 & return to SW2005 if I could, but not feasible as I have to interact with others.

Never thought of making library feature primatives.  Think I'll give it a try.  Still, SW would limit you to drawing in 1 plane.  I miss being able to simply draw a cylinder between 2 known points to make a brace for example.  Even when it is at a complex compound angle(such as a tapered triangular tower) and the resulting cylinder doesn't align with any existing plane.  Major process and pain in SW.  2 Clicks and a diameter entry with some software.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Things that drive me nuts:

In frame drawings using square or rectangular hollow tubes and in sheet metal drawings and more, when adding a dimension, SolidWorks always picks first the hidden line, even it is not shown in the drawing and the option for selecting hidden entities is turned off. It takes me ussually two or three tries before gettting a dimension like that right, and sometimes I don't notice it and it gets me in trouble with the guys who cut a part 1/4" shorter.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

dogarilla,
I've noticed this at times too.  It seems to be somewhat dependent on how far you're zoomed out.  If there's a line hidden on the other side of a section that is thin with respect to overall view scale it will go ahead and select it.  Seems like possibly something to do with selection point Z value tolerances or rounding internal to SW.  Same thing happens in part mode (not drawing) if I have a gusset or something in a large, thin sheet metal part.  As I zoom out the hidden edges of where the gusset meets the sheet become both visible and selectable.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Here's one that just happened (sorry gotta vent).

Added 4 mounting holes to Part X to Mount Part Y in context of the assembly.

Suddenly 14 other parts have mate errors (they suddenly all have plus signs).

So adding holes to part X messes up 25 mates that don't mate with either part X or Y.  HUH!!!

Reloaded the Assy still has the problem.  Guess I'll force-Quit SW and reopen it.  If it's still wacked I'll go get the latest backup file.  Really don't want to recreate all those "over-defined" mates that have to be there for the assy to move properly.  Much rather measure and re-add the holes in the Part File.

I really wish SW would make the mate function more functional.

<END OF RANT>

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Try supressing then unsupressing the rogue mates.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

ongybill,

Most of the time when I do something that causes a bunch of mate errors there's really only one mate that's really the problem, and all other mates are over-defined because of that one mate.  Since SW has no "heirarchy" of mates every one in the chain is shown as over-defining.  I usually try suppressing the problem mates one at a time (from the bottom up) to see which one is really causing the problem.  Also, the forced rebuild Ctrl-Q is your friend.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

If I was creating mates, or editing mates and it messed a bunch up I'd try to trouble shoot it (probably my fault).  When they mess up for no reason I figure it's just a normal SW stability problem.  If forced rebuild doesn't help I reload the file, if that doesn't help I force-quit.

After forcing SW to quit I reopened the file No Problems.

I then readded the 4 mounting holes in exactly the same way, again No Problems.

I've learned to force quit, because if you quit SW normally, or exit the file normally and choose DON'T SAVE CHANGES, it SAVES the changes.  That I find highly annoying.  Perhaps we could get a major upgrade so when you don't save it don't save.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

force quit? How do you do that?

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

force quit? How do you do that?

Open the windows task manager, select the applications tab, select Solidworks, then pick end task.

<Cntrl>, <Alt>, <Delete>  keys opens the windows task manager window.  At least in Windows XP 2002.

Optional, but not recommended, pull the computers plug out.<G>

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

You could also hit the Reset button, or hold the Power button in for 4 seconds, or flick the I/O switch at the back of the computer.

None of these are recommended as a corrupt file could result.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Ohh, yeah... I never thought of using that function that way. I have only used it to get out if a non-responsive and hungup programs.

I love this forum. I pickup the big stuff and the little stuff.

A star.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

We have occasional cases where a drawing that is revised will lose data from other untouched sheets.  And I have verified that there is no link between the touched page data and the untouched page that loses something.  This is a serious issue because such things are rarely caught, since no checker is going to check 50-100 entities per sheet on a 25 sheet drawing that had one entity on one sheet revised, just to see if any one random entity has disappeared.

Any others having this experience?  We run SW 2005 SP02.

debodine

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...


I would like to have the ability to change multiple dimension values in a sketch by a given amount in one operation. I usually like to use splines in profiles. If I need to change the profile in one direction by a given amount I have to change each individual dimension independently. I do this by highlighting the mm in the change dimension dialog box (see attachment) and replacing the mm with + xmm (with x being the increment i want to modify the dimension by, the example in the attached image is 2mm) . It would be good if I could select multiple dimensions and change all there values at once.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

How do I attach images or embed an image.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I hate the undo function. It seems there are not a lot of things you can undo.

Also, the way changes are saved: I have an assembly open. I open a part of it, edit it, decide it's not good and close it without saving. Then when I return to the assembly, all my changes are still there!! Is this still the case in SW2006?

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

daanh,
The reason your changes are still there is that when you have an assembly open, all parts that are not lightweight or suppressed are fully open, just not visible.  That's why there's a "reload" function.  You can reload the part from the file on disk.  You will have to do this prior to saving the assembly.  Otherwise the part and its new changes will be saved along with the assembly.

afb66t9,
This type of function should be relatively easy to program with a macro.  

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Things that drive me nuts...
Why haven't they fixed the dual dimensions with bilateral tolerances with an Inspection box? I've been trying to have this fixed since 2004 both by my VAR and through enhancement requests, with no luck. It sure clutters up a drawing the way it is.
Sylvia   

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I posted this as a reply in another thread, bnut it works here too.

For some parallel-universe reason SWx chose to make the z-axis perpendicular to the front plane instead of perpendicular to the top plane. As a result, the top surface has to be modeled as the front surface, because when it goes to CAD/CAM machining the cutter program is oriented with z-axis vertical--the way it is supposed to be. I can't count how many of my models crashed in the machine shop when they tried to translate the axes to make it work with their software. They finally let me know, and now all my models are on their side.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

wgchere ... I believe you'll find that most CAD programs use the X=horiz, Y=vert & Z=into/out of the screen notation.

Also 2D came before CAM. Drawings were made on a near vertical board & X & Y were taken to be the horiz & vert. Graphs were displayed using the same notation.
Most 2D CAD uses X as the horizontal & Y as the vertical as seen on the screen.  When 3D came along, I guess it made sense to add the 3rd dimension into & out of the screen.

It's the same argument with the spaceball movement ... should a forward horiz movement of the controller make the cursor go vertical or into the screen?

So maybe its the CAM people who got it wrong. smile

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

CBL,

Which view do you start with?  Front or top?  Why?  Is it just because the software says so?  Not all systems start with a front view.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

ewh ... "Not all systems start with a front view." ... who said that they did?

I start with whichever plane suits the part I am designing & which helps me visualise how I would physically make it.

If it's a simple turned part, I'll most times choose the "Right" plane, so that the standard views place correctly on the drawing sheet. It's also how I picture it being created in a lathe.
If it's a complex turned part I'll usually choose the Front plane to do a revolve, again for the drawing views & production method.
If it's a simple milled rectangular block, it doesn't really matter which one I choose.
If it's a formed sheet metal part, it depends whether it's an "extrusion" type or multi-flanged. So usually either Right or Top. Whichever way allows me to best visualise the manufacturing process.
If it's a profiled milled block I generally draw it as if it was placed on the desk in front of me.

To sum up I generally don't give a damn about the literal X,Y,Z because the CAM people I use can read native SW models & interpret them correctly.

The point of my post was to question which discipline was actually correct. It is just a matter of perspective. Are the CAM people right just because it suits the way you think? IMO, neither are right nor wrong ... just different.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Didn't mean to seem so aggressive, CBL.  I often run into situations in UG where someone will model hardware (screws, etc) with X along the axis.  I've modeled for years with Z along the axis, and we still don't know who's right.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

wgchere, coming from MDT and AutoCAD, the Z axis in SW threw me off for a minute or 2.  All 3 of them have the X axis horizontal, and the Y axis Vertical.  The books I have studied have the Z axis going vertical toward the ceiling.

I was wondering if how Catia and Pro E handled the Z axis.  I couldn't find any screenshots of Pro E with the X,Y,Z showing, but Catia looks like the Z axis is the same as AutoCAD.  

http://www.3ds.com/typo3temp/pics/35b206b510.jpg

Flores
SW06 SP4.0

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

At our company (aviation) we renamed the front, top and right planes as the Station, Waterline and Buttline.  Station is the position along the X axis (nose to tail), Waterline is the position along the Y axis (keel to crown), and Buttline is the position along the Z axis (left to right).

When we draw entities, we try to start out in the most reasonable orientation to allow the part to be assembled with other parts without having to use unique coordinate systems or jockeying with orientation.  It's not perfect, but it does make it easier most of the time.

debodine

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

ewh ... no problem. smile Most of my hardware was created with SolidMech which uses the Z (into/out-of the screen) as the main axis ... so the Front view is looking onto the head of the screw. Not my personal preference but nothing actually wrong with that.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I create all models as they get machined. If it's a turned (lathe) part, I use the right view. This make the side of the part the front, as if looking at it from the lathe. If the part has a feature for attaching a connector, the surface that sits on the machines table is the top view, the connector feature is toward the right. It's typical for cables to be shown connected from the right. All models have the origin in the middle, mounting surface. This makes showing CG easier to read and for mating in assy's. For lathed parts, origin on center plane either at end or middle.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Long before cad packages were developed the x-y-z orientation was fixed with the z-axis being vertical. This is the essence of the "right-hand rule" I learned in physics.

AutoCAD started and is still mainly an architectural/Civil engineering package. Yes, the z-axis comes out of the screen, but the screen is looking down. AutoCAD's native view point is called a plan view. What is a plan view? It is a view of a plot of ground from the air. The x-y axes are on the ground, the z-axis is gravity. Cadkey started as a wire frame 3D package. The z-axis is vertical. Pro-e has the z-axis vertical (at least PTmodeler did). Look at your old drafting texts and I'll wager you'll find that, when the term is used, z-axis is up/down.

CBL, you may have never heard about difficulties with CAM programs translating a sideways part (milling and workstation setups). I had no idea until one of the CAM programmers made a casual comment and we found out we were causing a bit of lost time from our orientation. They had never said anything about it because they thought their practices were causing the problem! We paid attention to orientation and the problems practically disappeared.

Now, I’m not talking about drawings here, I’m talking about the 3D orientation of model space. On a drawing each view can have an x-y orientation, which is dependant on the horizontal/vertical of the paper, not the part orientation.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Anyone ever want to flip a dimension, or set it to zero!!

I dimension holes and sketches to the center line, orgin of the part. But solidworks wont let me put in a negitive value, or set my dimension to zero when moving into a new quadrent or when the hole or sketch becomes aligned with the center axis!!

I am forced to delete the dimension, move the hole to opposite side of axis and redemension.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

SolidCreative,

When faced with this in the past, I have made the dimension in question a driven dimension and then dragged the sketch entity to the other side of center.  Make the dimension a driving dimension, modify the value to what you want - DONE!!!!

A complex constraint network might force you to do this to several dimensions, but this should work for most sketches.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I'd much rather solidworks be "smarter" about that particular issue, especially if for instance, you wanted an equation to be able to drive the feature "negative" without having to dimension from a different point to ensure it's always positive--sure you can work around it, but why should you have to?

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

There shouldn't be a neg or 0 dim. Why would you want to? It doesn't benefit anyone, just creates confusion. Place your feature approx where you want it and dim it.
Also, always dim your part they way you want the part made. I see parts dim one way and dwgs dim another. This makes the CAM people make a part one way and inspection use the dim's from the dwg another way, creates bad parts.
Just a FYI.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Thanks for the FYI, but I and everyone in my company do our best to dimension patterns to the center line. When a hole pattern cross the origin into a different quadrant, you must delete, reposition the pattern, and reinsert the dimension. If the pattern moves to be along the axis of the origin you have to delete the dimension and add a vertical mate. By allowing zero and negative mates this problem would not occur. FYI. Maby they could make a simple version for anyone this confuses.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

correction. By allowing zero and negative dimensions, not mates.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

If it was zero, it wouldn't be a dim. Curious, does the shop measure from the CL to make the holes on all your parts?

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

SolidCreative ... this would be a perfect example for using planes to locate the hole centres. Offset planes could be placed wherever needed with the hole centres being made coincident with them. Then, when a hole needs to "flip" into another quadrant, all that is required is to reverse the offset direction.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

UG allows sketch dimensions of zero to constrain geometry, as well as negative numbers (not recommended) for situations such as SolidCreative mentions, so it is not out of the realm of CAD.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I apologize, ctopher, but I was thinking like I was still using pro-e. The best way I could find to get an axial sectioned helical cut would be to drive the angle with an equation using a variable section sweep over the length (trajpar function) e.g:

http://blennopho.be/helicalgear.jpg
Excuse the fake involute and silly render, it was my first model back then.

In those cases, there was no easy button to reverse the direction of the helix like in SW since it was all originally dimensioned as an angle (though you could use an equation to derive it from pitch/length if necessary). It was a modeling issue at the time, not a drawing one.

I sure hope Pro-E has gotten better, because simple stuff like that shouldn't be so complicated--normal helical sweeps weren't much better.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I have to disagree that negative dimensions don't benefit anyone. Positive and Negative coordinate systems are often used in engineering; and are a staple in mathematics.

Over the years I've designed several irregular motor mounts ect., where the most sensible way to dimension it was from the center of the circular pocket used to locate the motor.  Usually the motor holes can be dimensioned as a bolt hole center, but gearboxes often have rectangular or irregular bolt hole patterns.  And often there are a myriad of other mounting holes that don't follow any set pattern.  The only important thing is that they are precisely located from the motor center (Say +/- .003" tolerance).  While the outside plate dimensions aren't very important (+/- .125" tolerance).

From a CNC machining standpoint it's child's play to program this part using positive and negative XY coordinates, particularly if the hole locations are listed in a spreadsheet format.  The negative X/Y values immeadiately identify where the hole is located.  Using all positive dimensions doesn't identify which quadrant the hole is in, and make it much easier to make costly mistakes.

I find this a real weakness of SW.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I was thinking of the model itself, not the dwg.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I was thinking of the model itself, not the dwg.

Either way.  I've converted many dwgs from paper dwgs to solid models.  It's much easier & faster in a program that simply allows you to enter hole centers using a coordinate system.

I just don't get the reason for the artifical limitation SW imposes here.

Same with dimensioning to zero.  I've had several times I've wanted to lock a center point to a particular point on a sketch (particullarly when there are several configurations of a part).  I want it 0" from that point, but I can't do it.  Zero isn't allowed.  I can generally figure out a convoluted way around this, but simply dimensioning it at 0" from the desired point would be 100 times better and much more straightforward.  It will allow you to dimension it at 0.0001" away.  Which you'd think would be sufficent, but 100,000th is far enough off it'll mess up concentric mates.  Really wish they'd fix this one.  Zero was invented thousands of years ago, wish someone would clue SW in.<G>

Best workaround I've found is to draw a point .1"X & .1"Y from where I really want it, dimensioning the unnecessary point off the useful point, and then the desired point off the unnecessary point.  Not really complaining; it's those dozens of extra steps that make SW such a joy to use.<G>

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I gues I'm not seeing it. Can you show a pic of where a zero dim is needed?

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

ctopher,

I don't have a picture but we use 0 as a dimension also.  We build indexable cutting tools and sometimes the cutting edge is on centerline of the cutter, sometimes it is above or below.  I would like to be able to dimension the edge on center at 0 instead of just using a note saying it is on center.  That way if the design changes and the cutting edge goes above or below centerline the 0 dimension could update automatically, don't have to worry about manually updating a note.  It may not be ANSI or correct to the drawing codes, but the people in our shop understand it and it works well for us.

mncad

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

The only time I have seen "0" dimensions used is on ordinate dimensions and bolt hole circle patterns.  Also, SW allows negative numbers on hole tables.  The use of zero dims may depend on your field of work.  

Flores
SW06 SP4.1

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I gues I'm not seeing it. Can you show a pic of where a zero dim is needed?  

Who's talking NEEDED.  I'm talking EASE OF USE.  SW will draw anything I want it to.  But, IF and ONLY IF I draw it in EXACTLY the manner SW likes.  This just seems like a meaningless hoop to jump through.

Usually this comes up when I need to go back and move something so it lines up with something else.  A zero dimension would be the Simpliest, Fastest, and Easiest way to do this, but it's NOT ALLOWED.

A dimension of ZERO is just as valid as a dimension of any other #.  It precisely locates something in relation to something else as well and as accurately as any other dimension does.

Perhaps you can't see a need for it.  But, can you explain to me WHY it's NOT ALLOWED?  What terrible things would happen if ZERO dimensions were allowed?  Personally, I can't think of a single problem it'd cause (I'd be interested if someone can think of some).  On the other hand, I can think of many instances where it'd be useful.  It's also something I've used hundreds of times with other software with ZERO problems.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Are we discussing zero dimensions on a drawing, or in a sketch?  I am one of those that sees no need for them on drawings.  It just confuses the issue to have to dimension features on a centerline as being zero from that centerline.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I think both. Having zero dim on a dwg confuses machinist's and inspectors. Nothing to check to. For those who do not makes dwgs and just use models, same problem.
If you need a hole in line with the center, why not use relations?
There is more than 2 ways to create within SW.

Why are zero dims not allowed?, because that's the way the programmers made it. They are not engineers. Turn in an enhancement request.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Ok, just thought of an instance where zero & negative dimensions would have been wonderful:  An odd shaped cover plate that had a component with 4 possible mounting locations, all located from the center of a shaft pass through hole (shaft location also varied).  No extra holes were allowed in the cover for asthetic reasons, so there were 4 seperate parts that could be built for each shaft location.  This should be easily handled with a design table, but EVEN design tables won't allow zero or negative dimensions.

So, instead of simply specifying the hole pattern center at 0X,9Y; 0X,-9Y; 9X,0Y; and -9X,0Y I added a point that was 10" left and 10" below the shaft hole center, & dimensioned the hole pattern center off that point.  Of course I had to remember to add or subtract from the desired dimension to compensate for the offset point.  I ended up with 1x,10y; 19x, 10y; and 10x, 1y; 10x, 19y in the design table.  All positive numbers, no zeros SW happy, me not.<G>

If my description is confusing, it should be.  On a machining drawing zero dimensions don't usually make sense.  In sketches and design tables they make all the sense in the world.

Guess I should do an enhancement request.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I see your point. I would still use releations. Also, dims on the part should match as close as possible to the dims on the dwg. Makes it easier for any user to make mods to the model.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...


Distance mates, angle mates, surface offsets and offset planes all allow a "zero" input. Apart from ordinate "datums" I don't see the need for zero dimensions on drawings, but I can see a use for them in a part sketch to allow "flipping" sides (or quadrants) around a point. A simple workaround would be to constrain the hole centres to offset planes. No need to add unnecessary points or deleting/replacing dimensions.

Quote:

CorBlimeyLimey (Mechanical)    1 May 06 13:01
... this would be a perfect example for using planes to locate the hole centres. Offset planes could be placed wherever needed with the hole centres being made coincident with them. Then, when a hole needs to "flip" into another quadrant, all that is required is to reverse the offset direction.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

CBL, how do you dimension the distance between the circumferences of two concentric circles? I would like to be able to dimension the distance between centres (in this case zero) then change, in the properties, min and max.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...


dogarila;
Please clarify ... you want two circles to start off being concentric but then you want to be able to make them non-concentric?

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

personally to make a dim like that, I usually draw a construction line between the circles where I want the dim and dimension the construction line.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

If the circles are truly concentric, then selecting the two circumferences should return the "radial difference" dimension which can be placed anywhere around the circles.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I know there are ways to work around this zero dimension "limitation". If you can have a mate at distance zero why you can't have a dimension zero.

CBL, you are right but it wasn't always this way.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

turn off your add-ins one at a time and see which one is causing the issue.

Regards,

Scott Baugh, CSWP
www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

What are you doing (trying to do) when you get the error message? I assume you don't know what "blank" refers to.

cheers
Helpful SW websites  FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions  FAQ559-1091

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

This happened whenever I started SW.  My macros weren't running either.  I found out IT uninstalled Mcafee antivirus and installed AVG antivirus (supposedly it's better).  I did a system restore to yesterday morning, and all is well again in SW world with no funky alerts and all macros work again.  This was actually not SW's fault and I can say that even though SP4.1 is not "rock solid", for the most part it has been very stable.

Flores
SW06 SP4.1

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

What really gets on my t!ts is having to rebuild a massive rolled-back model before I can see what effect my edit has had on an assembly it's in.

I also would like to be able to control the draft of each face in an extrude separately in the same way you can switch on multi radius fillet.

I have ERs for both these.

Just to stir you guys up some more I also find not being able to enter neg or zero figures into dimensions on a model iritating. During the early phase of a design I might dimension everything off an origin and mate up the planes of 2 halves of a enclosure so they are always centered. If I then drop some holes into a part to I'll dimension all those to the centre as well but I won't always know which side of the origin it will need to be.

I know you'll hate this but I-DEAS can do all these things.

Matt Jackson
Product Design Engineer

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Do you dim the dwg from the origin? Does the machinist start from the origin?
IMO, not a good practice. Dim the part how you want it made. Forget how other CAD software does it.

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks Pro 06/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

If I have a feature to the left of the centerline in a drawing view and want to dimension it relative to that centerline, I add a positive dimension.  To achieve the same thing in modeling would require a negative dimension, which is the reasoning behind my opinion that negative values should be allowed in a sketch.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

I find it funny how anything even slightly negative about SW is met with a statement that says in effect:  'well you shouldn't do it that way anyway.'(followed by some justification) LMAO

Well, just because YOU don't want to draw it that way doesn't mean everyone feels that way.  Simply put it diminishes the usability, flexibility, and usefulness of SW when it restricts you to drawing things the way they want them drawn.

Example, I find it inexcusable that SW doesn't allow negative and zero dimensions.  It's something I've used hundreds of times in a half-dozen other CAD packages.  It's as basic a tool as having a screwdriver bit for a cordless drill.  The fact that hand screwdrivers exist in SW and will do the same job doesn't negate the fact that a screwdriver bit would do it faster, better, and easier.

RE: Things that drive me nuts ...

Forgetting how other software works is also no good.  A lot of functionality makes it into software because people who switch from one package to another miss certain features and request them.

For example, I would benefit from the multiple draft angle functionality that Matt mentioned.  In the interest of fairness, I have also used I-DEAS, which is how I know I would benefit from it.  If I had never used I-DEAS and didn't know that something like this existed, would I miss it?  Doubtful.  Have I been unable to complete a part design in Solidworks because this feature was missing?  Absolutely not.  Would this functionality have helped me at some point?  Of course it would have, which is why we as users need to keep submitting enhancement requests.

It's the same thing as companies that want to hire from outside.  Keeps fresh ideas coming in the door......

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