What the big guys use?
What the big guys use?
(OP)
I did a search in the forum and found a couple of threads from a few years ago talking about how Boeing using Catia, etc. I was wondering if any of this has changed with the latest versions of Solidworks. I was always curious as to what the big guys like Boeing, Airbus, all the big car companies, Nasa, our government, etc. uses for their engineering departments. I was watching a discover channel show about a month back where they were showing the building of the new Airbus A380 plane and there were some seens of the engineers working on their computers with a 3d model of the actual plane but I couldn't tell what software they were using, in any event, those have got to be some HUGE assembly files.






RE: What the big guys use?
Mike Puckett
Los Angeles/Orange County
Solidworks User Group
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
John
RE: What the big guys use?
Here are the details how I know them:
Boeing aircraft(includes Phantom Works MAC-Douglas) - CATIA
Boeing Space Systems (formely Hughs Space & Comm) - Pro/e
Raytheon - Pro/e
Lockheed Martin (Skunk Works) - CATIA & some Pro/e
Lockheed Martin Missile Systems - SDRC Ideas & some Pro/e
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
I doubt it. There are some things SolidWorks isn't even close to doing as well as CATIA and UG, especially w.r.t. complex surface building. Styled surfaces and surfaces that dependend on mathematic qualities (like airfoils and nozzles) would still be better off in UG.
RE: What the big guys use?
Yes, solidworks, seems easier to use, but it is much harder to customize. This is what imho seems to make SW easier to use... because so much goes on "behind the scenes".
But since they are both owned by DS, then hopefully they will eventually integrate them better.
But who knows... people have talked about this for a couple of years now...
Wes C.
------------------------------
When they broke open molecules, they found they were only stuffed with atoms. But when they broke open atoms, they found them stuffed with explosions...
RE: What the big guys use?
The cost of transfering legacy data is out of this world. Let along maintaining two high systems for a decade until the transfer is completed. I was involved in some data transfer between CADDAM and SDRC Ideas....It was a costly venture. I have a friend that did a contract with Freightliner for this very thing. They were transfering from CATIA 4 to CATIA 5 and from what I hear was a huge project that affected every department in the organization.
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
The Airbus A380 is done on Catia.
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
You said: "Our castings were drawn years ago by draftsmen who were pretty handy with a french curve and circle templates, plus the pattern maker might have done some blending to make it all fit together. Converting that into a solid model has been very difficult with the operations allowed by Solidworks."
Do you know how to utilize the surfacing commands in solidworks to create geometry? Check out these sites...
http://w
http://ww
http://w
http://www.zxys.com/swparts/
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
I think Rolls-Royce is (was ??) using CADDS5
RE: What the big guys use?
I can see both capturing all engineering with the exception of Arch, that is where ADesk has the market.
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
So, to answer the question: Yes. But the wide base of Acad users can't switch to SolidWorks because it doesn't work so well in their disciplines.
RE: What the big guys use?
That brings their numbers up quite a bit... that's like cheating to me though. I honestly hate AutoCAD simply because they dropped the ball on their users for years. They would have been on top if they had not let their power ego trip confuse their path. That is obivous because when SW came out they struggled for years to come up with something that would work. MDT is a prime example of how hard they tried and it fell flat on it's face when it was released... IMO.
Regards,
Scott Baugh, CSWP
www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
...but I use SolidWorks.
RE: What the big guys use?
I agree that AutoDesk is "cheating" in the numbers game by giving Inventor away, they were doing that 5 years ago. I don't know if I am a "die hard" MDT user, but when it came to parametric modeling, MDT was better 5 years ago than SW is today. Their equations/variables were much easier to work with.
Flores
SW06 SP2.0
RE: What the big guys use?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
Solidworks equations do blow, but configurations almost completely make up for it. MDT better than SWX? I think not. I'm glad I left that garbage behind. If was better, how come they developed Inventor?
Jason
UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2005 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2
SolidWorks 2006 SP1.0 on WinXP SP2
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
That's it just 6'2"... hehe I got you beat... I'm 6'7"
Cheers,
Scott Baugh, CSWP
www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
RE: What the big guys use?
DCX use CATIA. GM uses UG. Ford use IDEAS but are moving to CATIA.
I think you guys are focussing far too much on ease of use at the desktop level. The real cost in a large company is database maintenance and version control. Bunging lines on screens is just the fun part.
Round here a top end 3d designer with some supervisory responsibility will be on a scale up to about 85k US (ie the same as an engineer), but our cost of living is pretty low. Straight out of uni it's more like 40k.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: What the big guys use?
Pratt&Whitney-USA and GE Engines both use UG.
GE Locomotive uses UG.
"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."
"Fixed in the next release" should replace "Product First" as the PTC slogan.
Ben Loosli
Sr IS Technologist
L-3 Communications
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Having worked with several company's using SDRC Ideas, it is painful to watch their day to day process. More and more of these companies are starting to put aside their notion that their software is "superior", and in fact been neglected from years of automotive tier demand. As the US marked moves further and further away from Automotive dependancy, and the notion that if Chrystler is using Catia I have to use Catia, you will see much more of the MCAD market (SolidWorks, Inventor, Solid Edge, ProE) grow to fill these voids. I have worked with many of these tools and found their "Advanced" capabilied to be way overshadowed by their bulkiness, slow performance and cost of ownership.
RE: What the big guys use?
I never said that MDT is bettern than SW: re-read my post. Do you just start drawing lines and circles and let the chips fall where they may, or do you think ahead of what may be modified and build your parts with design intent? For example,
http
Double-click a dimension and you can easily enter design-variables by picking them from a list.
h
Not until 2005 did SW include global variables, and once made, they cannot be renamed on the fly. You can't just double-click a dim for modification, you have to pick the text.
I can't comment on Inventor because I never used it.
Uh-oh, did I just open Pandora's Box?
Flores
SW06 SP2.0
RE: What the big guys use?
What's the employment outlook like in the UK? I've often thought about moving back to the UK. That salary for a MCAD designer is a lot better then what I've seen here in the USA.
Ben,
When did you leave IR?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
Helpful SW websites FAQ559-520
How to get answers to your SW questions FAQ559-1091
RE: What the big guys use?
http://alum.wpi.edu/~gregm/thesis/node11.html
htt
I try to use a structured, methodical process to create parts and assemblies, and equations WAS one of the ways that I achieved that. If you never use equations in your parts or assemblies, then any points brought up with equations are moot.
Flores
SW06 SP2.0
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Regards,
Scott Baugh, CSWP
www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Probably not, as far as I know, both softwares are coming out from the same company ...
RE: What the big guys use?
Not everyone needs PLM. I would venture a guess that most companies don't need it, only the largest companies do.
Jason
UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2005 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2
SolidWorks 2006 SP1.0 on WinXP SP2
RE: What the big guys use?
"
What's the employment outlook like in the UK? I've often thought about moving back to the UK. That salary for a MCAD designer is a lot better then what I've seen here in the USA."
I don't know what the market is like in the UK. In Australia I know we have great trouble finding enough experienced drafties.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: What the big guys use?
I started directly in 3d with solidworks, I think that if I used 2d programs first like autocad I would of had a harder time adjusting my mind into 3d mode..
RE: What the big guys use?
For some strange reason I thought you were in the UK. What part of Australia? Does the industry in Australia recognize US engineering degrees?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
At a job several years ago I was hired to design, but having many years experience drafting, I ended up being a drafting checker/modeling tutor. The engineers working there had no experience drafting and no experience modeling. What a mess! By the time they were through with the model it was so chaotic that it was difficult to draft, and in some cases the dimensions they wanted were actually a tertiary effect of the modeling (to change the angle of a feature--which was the dimension on the drawing--it was necessary to adjust two diameters of a lofted part). Simple things like determining what were the important features to make into GD&T datums were mysteries to them. It took a long time to drive home the concept that since everything was dimensioned off a datum--directly or indirectly--then the datums should be some of the first features modeled and subsequent features derived from them.
My point: any good modeling has to have structure and rigor. A 2D background tends to develop that. But it can be developed without that background too. But I also feel that, since the model is ultimately drafted, it helps to know drafting so it can be easily drafted.
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Yes, contact the Institute of Engineers (Australia) for equivalency for degrees. Probably not an issue, to be honest.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
RE: What the big guys use?
Last Friday was my last day at IR.
I started on Monday at L-3 Integrated Systems.
Warmer climate and closer to the kids/grandkids.
"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."
"Fixed in the next release" should replace "Product First" as the PTC slogan.
Ben Loosli
Sr IS Technologist
L-3 Communications
RE: What the big guys use?
You can be a good designer without 2D knowledge, but as wgchere pointed out, you still need to know how to set up a datum structure.
I have yet to meet anyone with only 3D design experience create a good drawing. An excellent modeler is not the same as an excellent drafter. SolidWorks may automate it somewhat, but it doesn't know enough to do it correctly. Little things can make a big difference in drawing legibility (such as leader lines crossing dimension lines or proper section view orientation).
A designer will have had to pay his dues in drawing cration to be considered well rounded. This is becoming more rare as drawing checkers seem to be a thing of the past at most companies.
RE: What the big guys use?
I agree!
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Chris
Systems Analyst
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 05
AutoCAD 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
RE: What the big guys use?
As wgchere noted "Simple things like determining what were the important features to make into GD&T datums were mysteries to them. It took a long time to drive home the concept that since everything was dimensioned off a datum--directly or indirectly--then the datums should be some of the first features modeled and subsequent features derived from them."
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
What is your technical background? Do you have a two year technical degree in drafting, are you a degreed engineer or are you self taught?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
RE: What the big guys use?
Best Regards,
Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)
"Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success." - Henry Ford
RE: What the big guys use?
Parametric drafting programs draft as well as Word's grammar checker writes sentences. Well, actually, they draft worse. But if one knows little about English grammar one might think that Word has now made learning the rules of English grammar a thing of the past.
As has been pointed out already, drafting is more that putting dimensions on a drawing. As far as the automatic drafting goes, if you didn't make the dimension in the model, it won't be on the drawing.
Take the same part and make two drawings, one drafted well, and one drafted poorly. The bad drafting may take several hours to interpret correctly, while the good drafting may only take 15 or 20 minutes. Over the life of the drawing hundreds or thousands of man-hours may be lost trying to interpret the bad drawing. That costs money and wastes time, and will be reflected in any quote for manufacture.
Drafting is a skill and an art, and like most skills takes practice to master and become efficient.
RE: What the big guys use?
Well i know this is from like 40 posts ago, but just thought i'd let you know, that a number of the bigger modern arch firms are switching to CATIA. Ghery has been using it for years now.. and a number of others are starting to follow.
Ben,
Congrats on the new job.. Which L3 are you at? Waco?
Wes C.
------------------------------
When they broke open molecules, they found they were only stuffed with atoms. But when they broke open atoms, they found them stuffed with explosions...
RE: What the big guys use?
Yes, I am in Waco supportting the Wildfire/PDMLink implementation. Same thing I did for IR. More challenges here, as they did the installation and configuration by themselves. They did a fantastic job considering they had no PDM consultants when compared to what IR paid to PTC in consulting charges in 2005 for the 2 sites that were setup. There are things that L-3 did not implement that I would have done, but it does the job they wanted it to do.
"Wildfires are dangerous, hard to control, and economically catastrophic."
"Fixed in the next release" should replace "Product First" as the PTC slogan.
Ben Loosli
Sr IS Technologist
L-3 Communications
RE: What the big guys use?
I would recommend "Fundamentals of Graphics Communication" by Gary Bertoline because it covers 3D principles, correct drawing/drafting practices, and ANSI standards.
You can pay several hundred for a book on ASME standards, but many companies use "company standards".
We started with ANSI standards as our base, but modified it for our company. We only use A and B size sheets (8.5 x 11, 11 x 17), so we modified the text height on dims to .094, our arrow tails are shorter, etc.
http://www
Flores
SW06 SP2.0