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report writing
4

report writing

report writing

(OP)
“Mr. Sinjin Smithe, PE of Engineers, Inc. visited Corp Campus on several occasions in December 2002 to observe, photograph and document selected existing conditions of Buildings 102, 103 and 109. Based on our understanding of your concerns, we focused our observations on exterior portions of each building and hardscaped areas closest to the Building 106 site.  We observed exterior areas associated with Buildings 102 and 103 on December 4 and 5, 2002.  We observed exterior areas associated with Building 109 on December 16, 2002.”


The above paragraph was copied from a report that I am using as a guide to write a report for similar work.  Both reports reflect nearly identical work so my plan was just to change (update) the names and dates etc.  However, I must confess that I just do not get this type of report writing style.  If Sinjin went to the job and did the work on his own, who is the “WE” that the report continues to refer to?  Is Sinjin a Borg and thus part of collective mind or did he do the work on his own?  This style of report writing is pervasive at our office.  Is it correct?


RE: report writing

Interesting point! I would like to know too. I have read quite a few reports with the first person plural.

Perhaps the author considers him/herself a member of the royalty and uses the royal plural?

---------------------------------------------------------
Operation Radiation: http://www.mrkenneth.com

RE: report writing

Just found a link that may be of interest:

http://www.answers.com/we

From the Houghton Mifflin Dictionary:
"Used instead of I, especially by a writer wishing to reduce or avoid a subjective tone."
"Used instead of I, especially by an editorialist, in expressing the opinion or point of view of a publication's management."

From Wikipedia:
"The editorial we is a similar phenomenon, in which editorial columnists in newspapers and similar commentators in other media refer to themselves as we when giving their opinions. Here, the writer has once more cast himself or herself in the role of spokesman: either for the media institution who employs him, or more generally on behalf of the party or body of citizens who agree with the commentary."

Still interested in whether the use of "we" is proper in formal reports.

---------------------------------------------------------
Operation Radiation: http://www.mrkenneth.com

RE: report writing

2
I believe that the use of  WE is referred to as the corporate voice and implies the formal concurrence of the corporation for whom the individual is acting even though the observations were made by the individual.  I have always used this form in documents that require multiple levels of approval.

RE: report writing

To my mind, the trouble with the example in the original post is that it fails to recognise the difference between individual observation and corporate opinion.

RGasEng makes a good point - you're paying for the opinion of the reviewers, so your entitled to be reassured that they think the same as the original author.  With that in mind, "we focussed" and the "we recommend" which I expect wasn't far behind are justifiable.

I have a problem with "we observed...". "We" clearly didn't:  He did, then his interpretations were agreed by others.

This is the style traditionally adopted by financial auditors in their opinion's on a firm's accounts.  Post Enron/Arthur Anderson, I imagine people in need of a bit of gravitas will have to try a different tone.  Perhaps they should try something along the lines of:

"There's cordwangles in my possett bag,
What shall I do my May O-
And I can't woggle my artifacts
What shall I do my Darling?"

It couldn't sound any more strained than the original.

A.
  

RE: report writing


If the style distracts from the substance, change the style.  You can avoid using  I or we for the individual’s actions by casting phrases in the passive voice, i.e., “the site was visited…”, “observations were made…”, “photographs were taken…”  This is frequently the preferred style for technical reports because it creates a degree of objectivity.   

I would avoid using proper names in the report unless it was for billing purposes.  

RE: report writing

(OP)
Good points all; however, the report makes NO engineering interpretations or engineering conclusions as a result of the information gathered.  This was a straight info gathering operation as the report goes on to say, “The survey was qualitative in nature and not technically exhaustive (e.g., does not include engineering measurements, testing, calculation, or design).”

So the corporate voice alluding to the formal concurrence of the corporation isn’t really needed for this type of report.  As RGasEng pointed out the style can be changed to passive voice.  I happen to love passive voice but others at my office believe passive voice comes from the devil.

RE: report writing

A useful, if dirty trick for sailing the difficult course between the passive voice and the personal is to blame it on a process - for example:

"The survey concentrated on buildings 108 and 109, and gave rise to the following observations:

Building 108 is......"

A.

RE: report writing

I have often been told that reports should be written in the passive voice.  But I find that objectionable because it is imprecise.  I suspect this is a holdover from a time when one was encouraged not to use "I" because it may sound self-promoting.  However, in this modern age, precision prevails, in my opinion.  If "I" visited the site, then I will say "I,"  and if "I" did something wrong or made an incorrect recommendation, then "they" will know exactly who to blame.  It is "me."

RE: report writing

Well hang on. In the land of the fuddy duddy poms, 26 years ago at university, we were told to use the active voice, and the first person, to write reports. I could tell the profs were not wildly enthusiastic, but would have thought that by now it might have permeated through to business!

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

RE: report writing

RGasEng has it right.  The "we" is a corporate voice if you are working for a corporation.  The client hired the corporation, not the individual.  The corporation is the entity providing the professional services, the individual is only the part or "arm" of the entity which performs the work in actuality.

When we sign our letter reports, we sign it:

Sincerely,

ABC Consultants, Inc.

....signature

John Doe, P.E.
Engineer


The coporation is the entity providing the letter report.  John Doe is the individual responsible for putting together the corporation's letter report.

For non-corporations, I would think that the letter could be written more in a first person vein, but never having worked for one, I cannot say for sure.

RE: report writing

How about an approach to acknowledge the "corporate voice" such as
“Mr. Sinjin Smithe, PE, representing Engineers, Inc., visited Corp Campus on several occasions..."

Then use first person, active voice to describe the observations.

Signature as suggested by JAE.

www.SlideRuleEra.net

RE: report writing

Regarding your comments in relation to
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“Mr. Sinjin Smithe, PE of Engineers, Inc. visited Corp Campus on several occasions in December 2002 to observe, photograph and document selected existing conditions of Buildings 102, 103 and 109. Based on our understanding of your concerns, we focused our observations on exterior portions of each building and hardscaped areas closest to the Building 106 site.  We observed exterior areas associated with Buildings 102 and 103 on December 4 and 5, 2002.  We observed exterior areas associated with Building 109 on December 16, 2002.”
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


IMHO, this is confusing, in any voice or sence.

Firstly, how the author structures the paragraph is confusing. The first sentence introduces several concepts that are not backed up by the supporting sentences.

The comment “Mr. Sinjin Smithe, PE of Engineers, Inc. visited Corp Campus on several occasions in December 2002 to observe, photograph and document selected existing conditions of Buildings 102, 103 and 109. implies that Sinjin was the only one to visit the Corp Campus.

In the next sentences the paragraph conradicts the first sentence by using we. So the reader is now left wondering how many people actually visited the place of interest.

Finally the author could has started each of his final sentences with "On the Date" or Building xxx or better yet On the xxth building 109 exterior area was examined. That would have given the sentenace consistency and made them easier to read. Or even made it clear by using bullet points or a table.


Regarding your comments in relation to
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The above paragraph was copied from a report that I am using as a guide to write a report for similar work.  Both reports reflect nearly identical work so my plan was just to change (update) the names and dates etc.  However, I must confess that I just do not get this type of report writing style.  If Sinjin went to the job and did the work on his own, who is the “WE” that the report continues to refer to?  Is Sinjin a Borg and thus part of collective mind or did he do the work on his own?  This style of report writing is pervasive at our office.  Is it correct?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No this isn't correct, its just poor communication skills IMHO. I would replace "we" with "he". Also I would point out that on the first visit to 109 the author failed to supply a date.
 

RE: report writing

GregLocock,

I agree that we too were encouraged to use the active voice in the writing courses I took, but the professors did not insist that we use the active voice exclusively.  One of the texts that I used states the following:

Passive verbs do have their proper place in style and are effective when used correctly. They may be used if (1) the actor is obvious, is unimportant, is not known, or is not to be mentioned; (2) the receiver of the action should be stressed, or the actor should appear in a subordinate position at the end of the construction; (3) the thought comes too rapidly in the active voice and needs a more deliberate presentatiorn (4) variety is needed in a passage expresscd in the active voice; and (5) a weak substitute for the imperative is desircd. (From Effective Writing for Engineers, Managers and Scientists by H. J. Tichy, John Wiley & Sons, Inc, 1966)    

RE: report writing

(OP)
If you thought that that first sentence was weird the following sentence was also in the report.

"Engineers, Inc. performed the survey utilizing professionals that have a rounded knowledge of construction, pertinent building systems and components, and are experienced in conducting property condition assessments."

Remember, only ONE engineer went to the job or performed any work for this job, but once it was decided to go with the "WE" writing style it couldn't be reversed back to the singular for this particular sentence.

I believe that the entire report reeks of trying to make something more out of what really happened.  This seems especially odd since no actual engineering conclusions were drawn and no actual engineering recommendations were made.

RE: report writing

Now wait a minute.  I disagree.  Perhaps one engineer visited the site, but no engineering firm that I know of ever performs a critical engineering report without support, quality review, and/or peer review by others within the firm, and without the corporate protection that a firm provides under law.  

Just because only one human body actually visited the site, doesn't negate the fact that the resources of an entire corporation were available to the engineer(s) who prepared and reviewed the report.

I've done hundreds of structural engineering reports, both for prospective projects and forensic situations and used "we" in all of them with the total understanding that I was presenting for my firm and not presenting my own individual, personal comments as a stand-alone engineer.

I also don't see how using a corporate "we" in a report reeks of anything but professionalism.  In fact, when I see reports written with "I" in the past, they have tended to be quite poor in quality.

RE: report writing

Yes, sorry RGasEng. I overstated the case. Generally in the narrative we were encouraged/advised to use the active voice.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

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