cost of engineering cost of engineering pce3 (Industrial) (OP) 4 Oct 05 13:45 I am investigating the "Average Cost of Engineering" on capital projects in individual industries? ie Agricultural, pharmaceutical, Food, etc. RE: cost of engineering NCCaryME (Mechanical) 4 Oct 05 13:56 What exactly is your question? The costs can vary wildly depending on the project, as you can imagine. Different projects will require different amounts of various engineering disciplines, and I doubt you'll find any sort of generalizations for "engineering" on "capital projects". Not to discourage you, but good luck! RE: cost of engineering pce3 (Industrial) (OP) 4 Oct 05 14:12 naygoo - ie. 1. 2 story office building with cafeteria. what would you say the % of engineering ought to be? 10500 sqft per floor. 2. process packaging line epc - what would be an expected cost of engineering on capital cost of $11M.I understand many different variables... RE: cost of engineering cvg (Civil/Environmental) 4 Oct 05 14:45 depends on your scope of work, which of these are you including?data gatheringpreliminary planningbenefit / cost analysisrisk assessmentfeasibility studydesign criteria reportpreliminary designfinal designpost design / pre-construction servicesbidding and project awardconstruction administrationinspectionquality controlquality assuranceoperation and maintenance plans or programsemergency action plansis the work done for / by a private company, public works agency, industry, federal government?Is the work done by a consultant?Is there an element of risk that the consulting fee will cover? Is the work done time and material or lump sum? Are you building a dam, nuclear powerplant or just paving a parking lot? RE: cost of engineering pce3 (Industrial) (OP) 4 Oct 05 15:37 I understand and appreciate the input. I'm sure you are aware that clients tend to try to keep Engineering dollars to a "percentage" of the package and try to negotiate from that aspect. This was my motivation in inquiring. RE: cost of engineering dbuzz (Structural) 4 Oct 05 21:26 For minerals processing projects, with capital value greater than $1m, we use the following indicative ranges for the value of the engineering services:- Concept/Prefeasibility Study, 1-2% of total installed cost- Feasibility Study, 2.5-5% of total installed cost- EPCM, 15-25% of total installed costThat said, we always prepare a 'bottom-up' estimate at the task and deliverable level. The indicative ranges help as a 'sanity check' on our estimates. RE: cost of engineering cvg (Civil/Environmental) 5 Oct 05 11:19 We also have some clients that expect the fee to be in a certain percentage range, however, they don't always factor in the scope of work or risk involved. A good example is our work designing and constructing dams. For a smaller dam rehab project, the engineering might be 30% of the cost to rehabilitate the dam. And the construction inspection, testing and field engineering might be 18% for a total engineering cost of nearly 50% of the construction total. Couple that with a client that has a very small capital improvement budget and you have a difficult time negotiating the contract and the eventual change orders... RE: cost of engineering RDK (Civil/Environmental) 5 Oct 05 14:27 The Manitoba association has a guide on how to hire a consulting engineer.http://www.apegm.mb.ca/keydocs/cguide/index.htmlOne of the methods is to use a percentage of construction cost method. The guidelines have three ranges, basic, complex 1 and complex 2 fees.Some examples are Basic is municipal design, complex 1 is dams and complex 2 is sewage treatment plants.The suggested percentages fees are also dependant on total dollar volume of construction and range from 6 to 14% at the lower dollar contracts and from 5.5% to 9% for larger dollar contracts.They are given in this graph:http://www.apegm.mb.ca/keydocs/cguide/epce-appb3.pdfHope that this helps Rick Kitson MBA P.EngConstruction Project ManagementFrom conception to completionwww.kitsonengineering.com RE: cost of engineering dave472005 (Mechanical) 6 Oct 05 09:31 Suspect that you are looking for some sort of Rule of Thumb.From my experiences in power utilities,Nuclear - small design work - minimum of 120-150 man-hours engineering- large design work - need a detailed evaluationFossil - Small projects (<100k), engineering ~$10k or 10%Medium projects (100k - 500k), engineering 10-15%Large projects (>500k) - should do a detailed evaluationDuring a short stent in an Engineering firm doing HVAC/Plumbing - Total mechanical/electrical installed cost ~30% of overall construction. Engineering - Mechanical and Electrical - ~25% of architectural fee. RE: cost of engineering dogleg43 (Electrical) 6 Oct 05 11:59 Your question has a lot of variables assoiciated with it. In the pharmaceutical industry there is the issue of validation, which drives engineering costs up tremendously.Example: The eng. costs for a small sterilizer that needs "validated" are about $110,000. For one that does not require validation is about $40,000. (Validation is a FDA requirement to require piles and piles of testing and documentation).